Guitar thread: Welcome back to the dark side

Shuie · 07:56 PM

Just when I think I'm out, they pull me back in

Anybody that has read any of my recent guitar postings has seen me say that wouldn't spend any more money on Gibson guitars. Well, I meant it. Until today.

I couldn't resist. '50s fat neck w/long tenon, 8.5lbs, and a discount that put it in the same ballpark as a nice non laminate top Japanese clone. I don't think its as resonant as my old '58 figured top reissue was, but it has better electronics. It doesn't have the perfect broken in feel of my Tokai, but its one of the nicer Les Pauls Ive played. Initial impression is that overall, its a slightly nicer guitar than my Tokai. And it should be. Its a custom shop job that normally costs 3x as much as my mid-low grade Japanese clone would at even todays ridiculous ebay prices.

I'm not abandoning the Tokai, Ive just given up on finding a high end Japanese clone on the internet from the US. The word has been out about the Japanese clones for years, but the pricing gets more ridiculous on a daily basis. Importing from Japan or the UK is the only option for a nice one and I wont spend that much money on a guitar that I cant sit down and play.

gratuitous pic. Tokai on the left, and a '58 Historic Gibson on the right.

HardDrive · 12-03-2005, 01:00 AM

Sure wish I could PLAY my god damn guitar. I have been at it about 3 months. Terrible, just terrible.

WolfeMacleod · 12-03-2005, 04:31 AM

I still won't buy a [new] Gibson. Ever. Period.

I cannot support a company who has screwed over the majority of it's dealers.
I cannot support a company who did not protect it's design and then sues another company (PRS) for making something similar. Then sues another company (Fender) because they want to use other thier designs under the Valley Arts name.
I cannot cupport a company who repeatedly has tried to pull the wool over consumers eyes (anyone remember the Bumblebee cap fiasco?)
I cannot support a company who claims Burstbuckers are "Paf replicas" but don't use vintage style magnet wire, which is a vital part of PAF tone.
I cannot suport a company who closes the door and lets in only a select few people at industry trade shows (NAMM)
I cannot support a company who lays claim to any designs you develop on your own while working for them.
I cannot support a company who says that a fret-job (by a Gibson-certified tech, even)renders the warranty void, and thus refuses to repair a defective neck.

For my money, I'll buy a Heatley or a Shamray or a Sundance if I want to go Japanese.

HERE is a local Shamray 'burst replica. It's simply an AMAZING guitar. Let the thread load, the pics are worth it.
And it only cost the owner $1600. With case. Shipped from Russia.

Shuie · 12-03-2005, 05:16 AM

I don't disagree with anything you just said about Gibson. I totally understand where you are coming from. Companies like Gibson (and Dimarzio) do everything they can to make the little guy struggle so they can build and sell overpriced crap with no competition. I still think a preowned '58 RI can be a good buy. They must be selling a ton of them, because people letting them go for well under $2k. I love the Japanese stuff and think its a much better deal considering the money, but I'm having a really hard time finding anything decent from Japan. The low-mediocre grade stuff is getting whored out on ebay at ridiculous prices, sometimes within days of being listed and no vintage shop in the US has anything.

Wolfe, how many guys do you know that build copies like that with the right headstock, etc? The Shamray from Russia looks incredible. Now THAT is long neck tenon. I'll always take something that is hand built by one guy over something built on a commercial scale. I'll start bugging someone like him for my next one.

WolfeMacleod · 12-03-2005, 05:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Shuie
Wolfe, how many guys do you know that build copies like that with the right headstock, etc? The Shamray from Russia looks incredible.

You could go with a Keebler...and it'll say "Gibson" on it as well. I can ask the builder if he'll make more...
Most companies won't do the "correct" headstock because Gibson will sue thier pants off. Shamray can get away with it cause they're in Russia, but they won't put the Gibson logo on it.
They will, however, put a "F*ck Gibson" logo on it, in the Gibson font, no less!!!

The Shamray came into my shop earlier this year so I could check it out. It was absolutely incredible. The only Gibson I ever played that came close were real '59's and one '56. I literally drooled on it while playing it.
I didn't want to let the owner leave.

Shuie · 12-03-2005, 05:38 AM

I dont care if it says 'Gibson'. I just want a lightweight, resonant, and boomey sounding guitar that looks and feels like a '58-'59 is supposed to.

I feel lucky to have found my Tokai and Im not going to play ebay games for another one. The Tokai stuff is so out of control that people are faking them now

. I cant find a decent 'Orville By Gibson' right now either. Ive found a couple of Greco and Burny laminate tops but nothing that really winked at me.

I would gladly pay someone that could build a good copy without fear of being ruined by Gibson.

WolfeMacleod · 12-03-2005, 05:40 AM

Hey Shuie, you got my phone number, right? If not, hit my website.
Give me a call in a couple hours if you can. I got a couple things hanging around the shop that want to become Xmas prezzies.

VINMAN · 12-03-2005, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by HardDrive
Sure wish I could PLAY my god damn guitar. I have been at it about 3 months. Terrible, just terrible.

Ive been at it for about 25 yrs , and I still cant!

WolfeMacleod · 12-03-2005, 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by WolfeMacleod

Give me a call in a couple hours if you can.

Let me amend that... Make it later in the day if you call. I just pulled an all-nighter and am starting to get really tired...I got less that an hour's worth of "gas" left in me.

Shuie · 12-03-2005, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by WolfeMacleod
Let me amend that... Make it later in the day if you call.

will do

WolfeMacleod · 12-03-2005, 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by VINMAN
Ive been at it for about 25 yrs , and I still cant!

You know...I know another VINMAN that plays. I believe he uses your avatar also, on another forum.
I asked him once if he was you...

scottmandue · 12-03-2005, 06:56 AM

I have trouble dropping $2K on a guitar... probably because back in the 80's I could pick up a scratched & dinged up Fender/Gibson that played great for $200 in a pawn shop.

I had a Gibson ES175 that I absolutely LOVED... until some junky broke into my place and relieved me of it.

Shuie and Wolf, is there anyone making copies of those? I have looked at the Epiphone and Gresch full size hollow bodies but they are mostly made of particleboard.

scottmandue · 12-03-2005, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by WolfeMacleod
Hey Shuie, you got my phone number, right? If not, hit my website.
Give me a call in a couple hours if you can. I got a couple things hanging around the shop that want to become Xmas prezzies.

Do you have a big fat hollow body jazz guitar that I could buy for my Christmas present?

Sonic dB · Sonic dB's Garage

All things considered and probably putting a damper on this thread... I just never liked the feel of the les paul. Its too ass heavy and does not fit to the body like a Fender Strat or even a Tele does. Also, the Les Paul tone is inflexible... it is just what it is and cant do much more... the hardware and "crapsmanship" on the newer Les Pauls completely sucks. I bought one in 92 and every knob fell off, tuning pegs broke..it was total ****.

My collection consists of a Tele Deluxe Plus, a Clapton signature Strat, Schecter C-7, Washburn E335 hollowbody, a Martin acoustic, a Fender dobro, a Fender PBass and an old Gibson EB3 bass. All are better quality and more versitile than the Les Paul that I had which fell apart.

WolfeMacleod · 11:20 AM

SHuie, # and 1/2 hours of sleeepp.. whheee .

I'm awake, so you can call any time. I'll be at the post orifice at 3pm, so I'll be away for about 20 minutes.

Quote:

Originally posted by scottmandue
Do you have a big fat hollow body jazz guitar that I could buy for my Christmas present?

Nope, sorry. Wish I did have a hollowbody tho!

Quote:

Originally posted by scottmandue
I have trouble dropping $2K on a guitar...

I had a Gibson ES175 that I absolutely LOVED... is there anyone making copies of those?....

I'm pretty sure SHamray could do a fantastic copy

IROC · IROC's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by VINMAN
Ive been at it for about 25 yrs , and I still cant!

Hey! That's me too! I bought my Gibson SG about 22 years ago... I still love it, actually. That and my Univalve. Pure tone heaven... I suck, but man do I sound good.

Interestingly, my SG seems to be a rarity. It's a "Firebrand" SG, but instead of the somewhat natural finish of the rest of the Firebrands, mine has a painted sunburst finish (and it's factory)...

Mike