GM's CEO, Rick Wagoner, writes WSJ Editorial

[onewhippedpuppy]

FWIW, I would bet that the employee pricing fiasco had a lot to do with that. According to this month's C&D, thanks to the big 3's employee pricing July was the largest volume sales month ever, and GM's July sales were up 47% from July '04. That's going to skew the statistics for quite some time, it doesn't take into account that many of the cars were sold at, or in some cases below cost.

Even so, they obviously need to attract some new customers too, because they're not doing too hot.

[widebody911]

Originally posted by kaisen
JD Power announced (...)
What do you think?

I thought we'd already established the JD Power was a marketing shill.

[kaisen]

Originally posted by widebody911
I thought we'd already established the JD Power was a marketing shill.

Great, but who is benefitting? Why manipulate the data?

Does Toyota pay J.D Power? Does GM?

E

[onewhippedpuppy]

Toyota owns everybody, didn't you get the memo?

[kqw]

Jeeze folks.....This is like a discussion on religion.

I guess that GM didn't watch 60 minutes last night when Andy Rooney stated the market statictics on the Auto industry. The American car industry did not fare well.

GM knew it was/is producing crap cars way back when, and hoped amnesia would keep the buyers coming back.

The American Car Market was GM's to lose...and they lost it many years ago. But....I HATE to see workers lose their jobs because of executive incompetence, arrogance and short sightedness.

Have I owned GM cars? yes, would I like to have continued owning GM, yes, did I and my family get burned by GM? yes. Were the next cars (several) we purchased manufactured by GM? no. Will the next car we purchase (and my children purchase) be a GM product? no.

What GM may or may not have realized is that the generation of customers they turned off, carried over into the next generation(s) of car buyers and they will not buy domestic.

How do you think children learned curse words?

They kept hearing their parents yell... "What the Fuch is wrong with that Damn car now? Wasn't it just in the GD shop last month?" Or "Whaddya mean the $800.00 repair isn't covered under warranty?"...or:

Buy top of the line GM model, take it in for service and the loaner car is the absolute bottom of the line tin can....

Oh well, I truely hope like hell GM and the other domestic automakers stay in business unfortunetly, it make take a few generations of consumers for that to happen.

[kach22i]

Not starting a new thread for this......................GM related.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051213/ap_on_bi_ge/gm_india
GM to Nearly Triple India Production

BANGALORE, India - General Motors Corp. said Tuesday it plans to nearly triple the number of cars it produces in India to meet growing demand in the South Asian country.

If the link does not work, just look for the headline - it's around.

[widebody911]

General Motors Corp. said Tuesday it plans to nearly triple the number of cars it produces in India to meet growing demand in the South Asian country.

($suckers) += ($hours / 60)

OTOH, GM cars might be marginally better than a rickshaw.

[onewhippedpuppy]

You make a good point about the US market being GM, Ford, Chrysler's market to lose. Just talk to most old timers, especially in the central US. They're still faithful to their American cars, regardless of their problems, and don't like the cars made by the Japs and Krauts. The US companies had to overcome this passed down national pride with pure crap, and years of it. They had to overcome national pride with horrible products and inferior customer service, so much so that people began to wonder, what else is out there?

A couple great cases in point, my inlaws just bought a new Mazda 3. They live in a small town in central KS, often buy new cars, and between them and their kids own a Expedition, F250 SD, Grand Am, Grand Prix, Ranger, HD Ford Diesel, Dakota, and an old F100. They have never purchased a foreign car, but are fed up with the problems and recalls they have had on their current ones. Also, after looking at small American sedans they realized that they weren't as nice, didn't get as good of MPG, and didn't drive as nice. They came to these conclusions on their own, I didn't even have to help them. Now they're happy as can be, and will probably consider more foreign cars in the future.

Another is my parents. My dad is a lifetime Chrysler man. He grew up in Richard Petty's home town in NC, his dad had a garage that specialized in Hemis, and his pride an joy when he was my age was a '69 Roadrunner. He also at one point was the service manager for a Chrysler dealership. Always owned a Chrysler. After years of problematic cars, their Stratus and Sebring finally did them in when they started eating head gaskets and waterpumps. The frustrations that he had trying to repair them probably didn't help, what a joke. They now have a Hyundai and a Toyota, and are happy as can be. Say goodbye to two more loyal customers.

[Flatbutt1]

My car is a Chevy my truck is a Ford. The chevy is nearly dead at 75,000 miles with lotsa little issues but a majorly leaking head gasket. I can't keep coolant in it. The Ford has been great 180,000 miles, not entirely trouble free but I'd buy another IF I could afford it!

I'm looking at used Fords with 50,000 miles on them for $25K! A new F150 can run me $34K!!! But I can get a new 06 Tacoma 4WD big cab for $24K.

I am sorry for the UAW workers but i have to look out for me too. And no one is losing sleep over my industry's woes.

[onewhippedpuppy]

You notice that they price the trucks (which sell) high, while the cars (don't sell) are low. My father in law's F250 SD was a $40k+ truck new, now with a bit over 100k it has so many little problems he rarely drives it. The MPG doesn't help either. To it's credit, it is still good mechanically though.

I'm sorry, but I can't say I feel for the UAW workers either, they've been sucking their employers dry for years. When Boeing Wichita was recently bought out, the new owner had to negotiate new contracts with the various unions. The machinist's union rejected the offer of a MINIMUM of $25/ hr, with full health care, etc. The offer amounted to a 3% initial cut in pay, but they would get that back along with further raises within 5 years. A few people would have lost their jobs, but the majority would see no change. The union of course rejected the offer, greedy bastards, so Spirit Aerosystems essentially fired them all. They then sent offers to those that they wanted, offering them the opportunity to work, but they ended up offering less jobs than they would have if the union accepted the offer. So thanks to the union greed, people that would have had a job were now on the street.

I don't want to turn this into a union bashing thread, but they turned down $25/ hr! These are machinists, not engineers. Essentially skilled blue collar workers, with no formal edcation. When I graduate as an aerospace engineer, I will be happy as hell to make $25/hr, but these guys rejected it. Shortly after this happened Spirit Aerosystems made the same offer to the union at another Boeing plant that was bought out in Oklahoma, this time they accepted it.

[gaijindabe]

Got a flyer in yesterday's newspaper. "GM Red Tag Event". A 2006 Chevy pick-up, regular cab, 2WD for $14,504. Everyone needs a pick-up..

[onewhippedpuppy]

Good luck finding on like that on the lot. Zero options, V6, crank windows, vinyl bench seat, cheapie steel wheels, rarely do the dealers stock them that bare. It's good to suck in the customers though.

[Flatbutt1]

Originally posted by gaijindabe
Got a flyer in yesterday's newspaper. "GM Red Tag Event". A 2006 Chevy pick-up, regular cab, 2WD for $14,504. Everyone needs a pick-up..

there's a good reason for them to be "red" tagged. besides, a 2WD pick up is limited in utility. May as well have an El Camino. Though an El Camino would be kinda cool.

[kach22i]

Originally posted by SoCal911SC
The American companies really have their fingers on the pulse of what is selling.

http://www.forbes.com/2005/12/13/ford-everest-suv-cx_dl_1213everest.html?partner=msn

That's weird, I've been reading for the last two years that the Ford Expedition was going to be canceled soon.

[widebody911]

The longer Expedition had been known internally at Ford as "the Everest," but the company realized that name, in production, would connote monstrous size.

How about "effete" ? "effin' huge" ?

[onewhippedpuppy]

"The longer Expedition had been known internally at Ford (nyse: F - news - people ) as "the Everest," but the company realized that name, in production, would connote monstrous size. At a time when Americans are fleeing from large SUVs due to high gas prices, Ford wants to be more subtle about releasing and naming such an enormous model."

So despite the fact that it will be a huge SUV, if they give it a name not associated with monsterous size, we won't notice? "Honey look, I bought a new Ford Molecule! Can you believe you can fit 15 people in a Molecule!? Hey look, Nascar's on........." Wow, I'm simply shocked that Ford is laying off employees, with such quality decision making (cue sarcasm). Looks like CEO Ford's noble gesture of not taking a salary until the company turns a profit might come back to bite him in the ass.

[Drago]

Originally posted by onewhippedpuppy
When I graduate as an aerospace engineer, I will be happy as hell to make $25/hr.

You're just the sort of new hire places like the Lazy-B are looking for.

Get five years under your belt at one of the big aerospace companies and see if this statement is still valid to you.

Oh, and BTW, everyone of those years the new hires will come in making more than you do, and every year you'll be asked to help train and mentor these same new hires....who are making more than your $25/hr.

Did I already mention that?

[onewhippedpuppy]

I'm staying the hell away from that place, I've heard way too many bad things about Boeing. Obviously I'm going to shoot as high as possible, but really, $25/hr straight out of school is decent pay.

[Drago]

Originally posted by onewhippedpuppy
I'm staying the hell away from that place, I've heard way too many bad things about Boeing. Obviously I'm going to shoot as high as possible, but really, $25/hr straight out of school is decent pay.

$25/hr in Wichita is probably great!

Not so great here.

All the big aero companies have their "issues". Some of the most rewarding work for me has been with the smaller shops. You get to do a lot more varied work, where as at one of the big boys you get one little part to play with for months on end. Boring.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Are you up in the Seattle area? I'm sure pay is probably way better up there, probably partially offset by the cost of living. I've been told that it's pretty easy to get an AE job in San Diego for $75k, but with the higher cost of living you actually end up worse off. $50k is pretty good to start out here in Wichita, everything here's dirt cheap.

I've had that thought too about big vs little, I'm sure in a smaller company you would have more of an opportunity to make a difference, and probably a more rewarding job. Burn that bridge when I get there I guess.