Free Speech Should Be Completly Free & Uncensored - But Only for Those with Brains!
 

Had an interesting talk with a friend today concerning free speech. He said;

'I think free speech should only go just so far, it shouldn't incite a riot like those cartoons did.'

'I think that much more as at hand but say it wasn't, it still doesn't mean someone should go nuts and burn down buildings. Its important to have free, uncensored speech.' I said

'So it would be alright to yell fire in a crowded theater when there was no fire?' He replied.

'Sure" I said.

'Your freak'n nuts!' He screamed.

'Here is my line of thinking, perhaps it is nuts but humor me will ya. Say we are at a movie theater. We have the kids and it is packed. The movie starts and about 20 minutes into it somebody yells FIRE! What do you do?

‘I head for the exit sign as fast as possible’ he says.

‘No you wouldn’t. First you see where the yell came from. Then you wait and see if they yell again. If they do you quickly look around to see if you can spot a fire while you are also trying to smell smoke. You may even stand up and move in his direction but you would wait to see if it truly was a fire. Only if everyone started going crazy and running for the door would you make a break for it - but only because the mass of people did it. I will guarantee that if the theater was almost empty you would call out to the yeller and ask for more details.’ I said. ‘You must take a systematic approach and use your head. That’s why you won’t get trampled in a mad rush crowd. Now imagine if everybody made decisions based on a quick analysis rather than gut rage?’

‘So what is your point?’ he asked.

‘Just this. If your watching TV and some crap comes on you don’t stick around and watch it, you change the channel. You don’t read the rags about soap operas and you don’t waste time reading all the Spam you get or even your horoscope. You choose what you want to pay attention to and ignore the stuff that doesn’t make sense or is stupid.
For the things that bring about a question or emotion albeit fear, passion or rage, you have the ability to choose to react or not just like you have the choice to get pissed or let it go. Free speech is essential and anyone who is incited by it needs a lil bit more medication, some happy juice or to get laid.’

It isn't over a simple print of a cartoon. It's over a print of a cartoon, Arab leaders going to the Danish courts, the courts disregardng them, and then the reprint. The reprint after all that was essentially giving them the finger.

The problem with the cartoons was that the most egregious ones that are being circulated, were never published in the newspapers. The Danish inman that sent out the cartoons to the world, added a few.

The other thing is, it wasn't a newspaper like the NY Times, it was a paper closer to National Lampoon.

I think the issue has more to do with the Danish courts, to them......

I haven't seen any info about the Danish courts, only the Danish Government stating that they would not apologize for a Newspaper, do to free speech consideration.

Any more info on the courts?

So if the courts dismiss certain concerns then a riot should ensue? Bull*****!!!

Mike, you just don't understand. Those poor islamo-freaks were made fun of, which warrants at least a few burnt buildings and a several deaths. Man, I wonder what they would do if a cartoon depicting their prophet getting beheaded with a knife was printed in a newspaper?

They and some of their sympathizers seem to think a cartoon is cause for WWIII yet somehow beheading someone on video is acceptable justified behavior.

It is just bizarre!

Lube, well done. Knew it wouldn't be long for the 'you don't understand them' crowd to show. CC, surprised your here..was looking for you in the crowds in Pakistan.
Rika

So:
1) I get my day in court, losing, but at least I presented my case
2) Someone gave me the finger

Therefore, I:
3) Burn buildings, and call for jihad.

Sure, that's logical.

These loonies need to suck it up and realize it goes both ways. In a free society, sometimes you give the finger, and sometimes you get it.

We must think of The Children TM

No can do, they are working in factory making Danish flags,then lazy Dad can run around and try to burn them in the rain. They need a P dealership, own a P ,you forget about cartoons fast.
Rika

They lost in court, get over it. If they then riot they all deserve to go to jail for a long time.

Red is correct, the worst of the cartoons were never published but the Imam took them to Egypt and got the fire started, and it then mushroomed from there. He wanted a world crisis over it and now has it. He should be sitting in jail as well...

Ha!

c_c your defensive rationalizing has hit a new high. . . or is it a new low?

Anyway, you'll have a tough time devising a better self-satisfying, but incorrect, reason for the anti-ROW behavior of the misunderstood;):rolleyes: bomb-heads.

Many of us have had our days in court - sometimes we win and sometimes we loose. Mature, rational people deal with insults and loss. This culture of Islam has brained washed followers into a mass frenzy that is best described as cultural insanity.

I know it is not the "political" thing to say, but it looks like decades or even centuries worth of punishment and strife from their leaders with a very strong religious doctrine has done them no service at all.

*****...dem folks iz whacked!

It is very possible to train (brain-wash) a person, a family, a town and even a large group of people to become very dangerous to the rest of us all the while thinking that they are completely infallible. They will fight to the death and do anything to enforce their message. The sad thing is, when we end up smoke’n them, the liberals will say that they were unjustly persecuted and set up a huge fund or a small country for them. Then it starts…

Let me try this from a different angle.
Suppose someone did a cartoon of you blowing another guy and published it on the net? Or if they photochopped a picture of your wife doing it 'doggie style'.....with a dog. How about an image of your child being ....
Feel that bit of rage, just now? I suspect that is close to what Muslim fundamentalists might feel about cartoons defiling the prophet. We are talking different cultures, different values.
I know murder and mayhem are not the answer for any god-loving people, but I feel we too often think the 'other guy' should share our viewpoint. People aren't like that. We can't even get people on this board, many of whom grew up in similar circumstances and backgrounds, to agree. What makes you think someone who grew up in a strife-torn area, in a different culture, speaking a different language, praying in a different fashion to God, is suddenly going to chill out because "Hey, it's freedom of speach!"
While free speech is a noble idea, most of us censor ourselves much of the time. We don't tell the lady at the next table she is too fat and she should get her mouth under control, (although it is not unheard of in Japan to tell a co-worker they need to lose weight).
We tend not to tell the policeman who stopped us just what we think of his actions. The next-door neighbor who insists upon singing ABBA tunes while he barbecues in his backyard will probably not hear what you think of his vocal range (or lack thereof). In order to make things go along more easily, we keep our comments to ourselves.
It's not like I have the answers. Most times I count myself lucky if I get to hear the questions a second time.
Les

Yeah, something like that would never happen in a place like LA...

It's deeper than that, Lube. And most are protesting. Some are rioting, yes, and there is absolutely no excuse for violence, but most are just protesting, which is of course, free speech as well. Blame the rioters for the criminals they are...and you're right.......remember when you use "they" you're including people who are doing nothing violent of the sort, but just are protesting.

And what "dem folk" u talking about Luber?

she's back.....after consulting with the Iman,
we cannot use 'they or them ' it does not apply to them..only a few burning stuff you know.
'they' can however apply their rage to all of us. Nothing more then a bunch of flea bitten unemployed idiots.
Rika

:rolleyes:

Les - just had that exact example proposed to me by a fellow co-worker!

I guess I would find various graven images very objectionable but on a personal level but it would have to go pretty far before I started burning or even protesting. How many Americans were rioting when people from other countries burned effigies of our leaders or worse, drag the dead bodies of our solders through the streets?

You can get pissed but you also have to have some tolerence.

CC - any fundamentalist...

I think this was already brought up in another thread, but a few years ago there was an "art" display which had a crucifix in a vat of urine and a portrait of the Virgin Mary done in some sort of dung.

I don't recall rioting and burning of buildings back then, certainly Jesus and the Virgin Mary are as important to Christians as Mohammed is to Muslims...

I read a book back in college - "If you Meet the Buddha on the Road, Kill Him!" It made sense to me on many levels yet why do I think that if someone from the middle beast got their hands on it would become a terrorist manual?

Suddenly I feel much better about the whole situation. :)

No, it seems the west doesn't riot over religion, but they riot over other perceived oppressions. Riots aren't exclusive to the Muslim commuity. The root cause here and the common element of all is a feeling of oppression because, among other things, of their religion...

That's good moses. :)

CC, I'm sure you would find some +'s in Hitler and their like, your the lawyer at a Killers trial who says...not his fault..his mom wouldn't let him watch Bug's Bunny.. he was oppressed,misunderstood..blah blah.

Rika the Infidel

Actually, no Rikao. However, I do not compare Hitler to Muslim people, and if you do, you'd be inaccurate.

We are all professionals, no? When a problem arises, what do we do in our professional life? Do we just get mad and damn it to hell? Do we just ignore it? What happens to that problem? Does it go away, or does it get worse? It gets worse. Whether we're doctors, mechanics, in management, IT, etc., we do a root-cause analysis and address the root causes for the solution.

Why would one think this situation is "different"?

I don't know about U all, but I am laying in a stock of Duct Tape and Plastic Sheeting...hmmm I wonder if its too late to become Swiss?

The chicks are hot but the food sucks...

The Christians allready had their Inquistion and wars of Reformation.

Okay CC, then we need to do a ROOTcanal, the tooth is worthless,causes pain,
you, would gargle and floss...and take pills
me , pull it or or kill the nerve and be done with it.
Rika / Infidel

Not if the root canal tooth kills or damages every other single healthy tooth in your mouth renders you unable to eat, and thus will starve.

So the question remains from that line of reasoning - would my life be any less rich if the entire middle beast became a pathetic combination of a glass parking lot, oil production platform and a humongous protein rendering site?

It would become much, much less rich if it became those things. It would become nonexistent within a year or so.

Rika votes for the parking lot,
CC you know little about dentistry, purpose of canal is to preserve the others, and keep tooth . I would still go for the pull / or canal. Your version has me in pain and dying at the end anyway.
Rika the Infidel

Can you please outline a project plan as to how you'd pull out the bad criminals in this situation worldwide while preserving the good ones and make sure they don't rot... I'm willing to listen to your project plan...

Your parking lot scenario isn't like pulling out a bad tooth to preserve the good ones.....

Coke Cola and MCDs wouldn't like it if U turned the place into a parking lot....think of all the soda and Burgers they sell in the place. Not good to lose customers

I don't think so. We are not as dependent as you would think.

The thing is, the middle beast just does not ‘get’ the US and the US doesn't ‘get’ them.

If you explore the core of why wars and national / cultural hatred occur it really may just boil down to a few things:
1) Economics - they got more then us and they don't deserve it
2) They have one foot in hell and the other on a banana peel - we are morally superior
3) They hurt us - economically or physically so we must hurt them
4) They have something that is ours (or so we think) like land or water rights
5) They are friends of our enemies so they must also be our enemies

A HS junior could sort out each of those issues in a lunch period!

I propose that all major religions and every major government choose not to strive for reconciliation. It ain’t rocket science yet all make it so freak’n complicated that no end is in sight. I just wish somebody would show some ballz and nail this down. I see absolutley no leadership from any party, government or religion on this matter - and I am not sure I ever have.

lube, it's not a matter of dependency.

What if they turned the US into a glass parking lot, what do you think would happen? (clue....it starts with a WWW and ends with a III). Why do you think it would be different in reverse?

Secondly, I don't think we have the power to turn the whole ME into a glass parking lot.

Hey CC we allready had WW3..it was called the Cold War...

And Secondly how naive you are...just think what a coupla Trident Missles with MIRVs can do....