CCW just passed in Nebraska

[cool_chick]

Originally posted by fintstone
And I thought everyone at the LV Pelican Meet was packing. Certainly most were. CC looked pretty dangerous to me....and was obviously packing some dangerous weapons.

You never know, Fint...you never know.... That's the beauty of the "concealed" concept....

[fintstone]

I wear mine tied to my leg.

[cool_chick]

Originally posted by FrayAdjacent911
Open carry would be nice, IMHO, but on the same coin, why don't people have placards on their cars showing their driving records? I bet you'd avoid the people with multiple Reckless Driving and DUIs on their record! Such people would also probably end up being discriminated against.

Point being, open carry would really scare too many people. Think about all the soccer mommies out there with the touchy feely 'guns are bad PERIOD' mindset. I walk into a store with my .45 on my hip, then out comes running Mrs Soccormommy screaming HE'S GOT A GUN!!! It causes a scene, likely has me having to talk to a police officer, causes an interruption of the store's business, interrupts other people going about their business...

Concealed, none of the above happens. Under the CHL provisions in Texas, I would be required to completely conceal my handgun such that a reasonable person under casual observation would not be able to detect I'm carrying it. Otherwise, I'd have committed a crime. If my handgun were visible, I'd be charged with brandishing a firearm.

CC, the argument about a gun being uber-easy to cause death as compared to a knife or blunt object really doesn't hold much water. You have to realize just how EASY it is to kill a human. It doesn't take much effort at all to plunge a blade into someone's gut, or to cause fatal damage to someone's skull with a golf club. We really are fragile beings.

On that point, if a criminal has a knife and threatens me, why should I not be able to more easily STOP him? Should I be required to have to put as much physical effort into defending myself as my attacker would have put into attacking me?

Demonstrations have shown that a man weilding a knife up to 23 feet away from a man with a holstered gun can close that distance and kill the man before he can draw his weapon and fire in self defense. Having a gun doesn't automatically trump every lesser weapon. It's a last resort.

Self defense has to happen in many ways. Situational awareness, avoidance, deterrance, deescalation and evasion - should all occur BEFORE a weapon is drawn.

I can't say often enough that this is not necessarily my position. But I was looking at the aspect of a gun, and only a gun, as a tool, and what it does.

But realistically, what I say does hold water when you look at the pure mechanics of it (which is where I was coming from). To lunge a knife takes quite a bit effort...one has to jump, start to lunge, proceed to lunge, and there is some time there to react. A gun only has to be in a coat pocket, point, a teeny pressure on the finger, that's all she wrote. I'm looking at it as a purely mechanical standpoint.

And trust me, I do have the self defense mentality down pat. I need to....I"m a woman, and my greatest fear is not just mugging, but rape. It's an additional concern you men don't experience. However, I'm so glad you are also aware of those points....awareness, avoidance, deterrence, deescalation and evasion...they are important. It's so very important, and your weapon should be the last resort (as far as defense). I know an officer who had to kill a perpetrator, and I tell you, he knows this guy was bad, but not a day goes by that he doesn't feel remorse for taking a life. He understands he had to.....and he made the right choice, but if you have any sort of soul, it will weigh on you no matter what (just like war). It's better to not go there at all if it can be avoided. What you "would do" is one thing, once you "done it" is a whole different ballgame. Thankfully for you, you appear to be aware of the consequences.


pg, good point about the soccer moms.

[cool_chick]

Originally posted by fintstone
I wear mine tied to my leg.

Oh yeah?

hehe

[fintstone]

Below the knee.

[fintstone]

The best reason to carry concealed...instead of open
is to protect those who do not carry.

[Tervuren]

Originally posted by cool_chick
A gun only has to be in a coat pocket, point, a teeny pressure on the finger, that's all she wrote. I'm looking at it as a purely mechanical standpoint.

Cool chick, I'm just wondering, have you ever fired handguns before? Its about like saying driving is opening a door, sitting in a seat, and turning a key.

[cool_chick]

I miss too (firing range). Actually, I kinda suck at it. However, I'm assuming one who owns a gun and is carrying it has shot it before. Is this not a reasonable assumption?

I do acknowledge what you guys are saying though. Shock of what's happening, grabbing the thing, etc., will make a delay. To be honest, I was looking at it from the angle of one with each in each hand, I was looking at it purely mechanical.....a gun, a knife, you are going to take action with each, one takes the effort of flicking a cigarette, one takes physical effort. The gun will win.

The question was why do people fear guns, I just tried to answer why some do......

Edit: you changed you post Terv....I was answering the prior question. I hope it makes sense....

[Tervuren]

Originally posted by cool_chick
I miss too (firing range). Actually, I kinda suck at it. However, I'm assuming one who owns a gun and is carrying it has shot it before. Is this not a reasonable assumption?

I do acknowledge what you guys are saying though. Shock of what's happening, grabbing the thing, etc., will make a delay. To be honest, I was looking at it from the angle of one with each in each hand, I was looking at it purely mechanical.....a gun, a knife, you are going to take action with each, one takes the effort of flicking a cigarette, one takes physical effort. The gun will win.

The question was why do people fear guns, I just tried to answer why some do......

Fear guns, I think its a lack of understanding of life. To me, we are all going to die one way or another, and the thread between life and death is very thin. I'm twenty, I could be killed, or die tommorrow. For me, I consider my 944 more dangerous then I would a gun - with one exception. My 944, has keys that I carry, and people treat car's with respect. A gun does not scare me without a bad person to back it up, why? I was taught to respect them by my parents. My idea's of guns where not from movies, etc. They had me shoot them, and understand their potential for harm as well. The exact same thing with a car,they taught me how driving could be dangerous.

I enjoy firing a semi automatic "assault rifle". haven't done it in years. For me personaly, its a preference that I do not like full auto. Its possible if your motion and firing cycle coincide, to shoot at a bunch of people, and not hit one. I Vietnam Vet I know, he and his team, where crossing a rice feild single file, a man jumped up from their side, unloaded two 30 round clips, along their line. Not one was hit at all.

[cool_chick]

Grrrrr

AGAIN

I can't say often enough that this is not necessarily my position.

You're preaching to the choir.

[pbs911]

Originally posted by cool_chick

To lunge a knife takes quite a bit effort...one has to jump, start to lunge, proceed to lunge, and there is some time there to react. A gun only has to be in a coat pocket, point, a teeny pressure on the finger, that's all she wrote. I'm looking at it as a purely mechanical standpoint.
.

Nice straw man set up for yourr point.

How about reaching for gun, placing hand on grip, removing safety strap, removing from holster, raising to eye level, releasing safety, chambering a rounds, aiming, checking what is behind your taget and squezzing the trigger. As for a knife, wipping it out and slashing. I can make a knife sound very easy to abuse.

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by slakjaw
20 emails about this thread? Give me a break man.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/ does not have a thesaurus otherwise you could find the meaning there.

yep

take it easy

Re-read my posts. You and CC (tough guy comment) are the ones calling people names, not me.

[fintstone]

Originally posted by fintstone
The best reason to carry concealed...instead of open
is to protect those who do not carry.

The bad guys (who are usually just bullies...and don't have much in the way of brains or nads) have to fear/assume that even the meekest little old lady from Pasadena packs a 357 magnum......
and parked in her rickety old garage.... a brand new shiny red super-stock dodge

[cool_chick]

Originally posted by pbs911
Nice straw man set up for yourr point.

How about reaching for gun, placing hand on grip, removing safety strap, removing from holster, raising to eye level, releasing safety, chambering a rounds, aiming, checking what is behind your taget and squezzing the trigger. As for a knife, wipping it out and slashing. I can make a knife sound very easy to abuse.

Exactly what strawman from me do you perceive here?

Not to mention, methinks you may be confused as to what the term strawman means, my friend.

LOL too funny.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by Tervuren
Fear guns, I think its a lack of understanding of life. To me, we are all going to die one way or another, and the thread between life and death is very thin. I'm twenty, I could be killed, or die tommorrow. For me, I consider my 944 more dangerous then I would a gun - with one exception. My 944, has keys that I carry, and people treat car's with respect. A gun does not scare me without a bad person to back it up, why? I was taught to respect them by my parents. My idea's of guns where not from movies, etc. They had me shoot them, and understand their potential for harm as well. The exact same thing with a car,they taught me how driving could be dangerous.

I enjoy firing a semi automatic "assault rifle". haven't done it in years. For me personaly, its a preference that I do not like full auto. Its possible if your motion and firing cycle coincide, to shoot at a bunch of people, and not hit one. I Vietnam Vet I know, he and his team, where crossing a rice feild single file, a man jumped up from their side, unloaded two 30 round clips, along their line. Not one was hit at all.

Except in very limited circumstances, automatic weapons are devices for turning money into noise.

[fintstone]

Automatic weapons are very handy...if you know how to use them.

[Tervuren]

Originally posted by fintstone
Automatic weapons are very handy...if you know how to use them.

For me, one that throws hard lead is not practical. But I can understand the concepts from paintball, of the sheer terror that can be caused by throwing a lot of projectiles realy fast at the enemy. Natural tendancy is to keep thier head down, allowing movement into a more advantageous position. One of the differnece though, is with a large full auto, you'd probably be able to punch holes through some of the tree's used as cover. Where just a twig can break a paintball. My weapon of choice is trickery.

[fintstone]

They are particularly effective with tracer rounds with a medium or long range weapon. At close range, they are a good way to lay down some heavy fire that is capable of penetrating light cover (doors, furniture, thin walls) better than a shotgun. An automatic shotgun is quite good for close work...but I like a pump.

[pbs911]

Originally posted by cool_chick
Exactly what strawman from me do you perceive here?

Not to mention, methinks you may be confused as to what the term strawman means, my friend.

LOL too funny.

"straw man. "The straw man fallacy is when you misrepresent someone else's position so that it can be attacked more easily, knock down that misrepresented position, then conclude that the original position has been demolished. It's a fallacy because it fails to deal with the actual arguments that have been made.

Asserting your definition of the mechanics of a fire arm and knife are accurate to support the conclusion the gun merely takes an itch in the finder to be more deadly.

[cool_chick]

Originally posted by pbs911
"straw man. "The straw man fallacy is when you misrepresent someone else's position so that it can be attacked more easily, knock down that misrepresented position, then conclude that the original position has been demolished. It's a fallacy because it fails to deal with the actual arguments that have been made.

Who's position am I misrepresenting?

Asserting your definition of the mechanics of a fire arm and knife are accurate to support the conclusion the gun merely takes an itch in the finder to be more deadly.

It doesn't? Are you telling me if I have a knife in one hand and a gun in the other, I can with the flick of a finger do more damage with the knife, and the gun takes brute force to fire or something? Not to mention distance to the object?