Questions for Motorcyclists

[MotoSook]

Yep...vehicular homocide....but are all accidents classified so? I think only in the case that there is a fatality. I'm talking about geting cagers to think that they can be prosecuted or sued (in civil court) for attempted murder. (even if it's just a spill that makes me have to buy new leathers....they caused it and the potential to kill is very real....see?)



And I agree...vehicular sodomy is a very scary thought...remember the thread about the wannabee cop causing bikers to spill?

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally posted by Drago
The two hicks in the beater pickup that saw me at the last freakin' second were enough for me to sell my old GS1100E.

Just assume they're all out to kill you and you'll be fine.

That said, I'd love a BMW R1150GS in blue and white please.

I'd even be willing to ride with JH and the chromosexual set, if they'd have me.

You would need more tats and scars. Plus a limp. "Drago" would make a decent road name, though. Tell your ol' lady (no longer a "wife") that you're buying a bike so you can ride with me. Then she'll really love me...

[nostatic]

Like others said, drive like they're out to get you, but not scared. Different thing. I go bright...yellow helmet, red or orange bike. I sit up tall and always try to look for my ways out. Sometimes you just get a feeling that someone is going to do something stupid...and they do.

The danger is when you start to get too comfortable. A near miss will usually put you back in the proper frame of mind. That being said, it is rather refreshing to commute by bike. Yes, you have to be totally focused and hypervigilant while riding. But you also are not distracted...no coffee in your lap, no cell phone, no radio. Just you and your wits. Use them wisely.

[Jeff Higgins]

I have commuted off and on by motorcycle for 26 years. Recreational riding and commuting are two different animals altogether. The danger while commuting is heightened considerably by traffic density and the commuter attitude. Everybody is running late and distracted in at least one way, often more. While vigalance is always necessary, rush hour raises the risk exponentially. I would recommend riding recreationally, away from heavy traffic and peak commute times, for some time before you attempt to commute.

[Rot 911]

Originally posted by Souk
I had a thought this morning as I was riding to work.

Could you prosecute a driver for attempted murder when they cause an accident involving a motorcyclist. Hmmmmm

Speaking from prosecution experience, the best you will probably get in involuntary manslaughter and only if the driver kills the motorcyclist. If he lives than most you will get is careless and imprudent driving.

[JavaBrewer]

Over a year now on the bike commuting 72mi each day to work. No near death experience's thankfully but had a bakers dozen or so times where a car tried to merge into the lane I was riding. Every single time the cager was on the phone...

Being alert, watching the cars (not drivers), enabled me to just move over to edge of lane and give a quick WTF stare at the driver. Several had the balls to then flip me off.

Sure the gas savings are nice but as already detailed you won't save money in the short run when you figure in the $$ dropped on a bike and gear. The real benefit I have realized since riding again is 1+ hours less in traffic each day as I lane split anytime speeds drop below 40 mph. Sure it depends on the rider but I honestly feel more comfortable splitting between cars then hanging out back waiting to get crushed.

If you're still interested and have questions about choosing a bike then search the OT forums for the NATO thread started by Todd. Lots of good info there and tons of eye candy.

[wcc]

Originally posted by Jeff Higgins
I have commuted off and on by motorcycle for 26 years. Recreational riding and commuting are two different animals altogether. The danger while commuting is heightened considerably by traffic density and the commuter attitude. Everybody is running late and distracted in at least one way, often more. While vigalance is always necessary, rush hour raises the risk exponentially. I would recommend riding recreationally, away from heavy traffic and peak commute times, for some time before you attempt to commute.

+1
This is VERY good advice....

[Overpaid Slacker]

A good point from nostatic -- "not scared". Stay relaxed, keep your heart rate and respirations low, and if you feel antsy or uptight, pull over for a few minutes. And trust your spidey-sense.

JP

[JavaBrewer]

Originally posted by Overpaid Slacker
A good point from nostatic -- "not scared". Stay relaxed, keep your heart rate and respirations low, and if you feel antsy or uptight, pull over for a few minutes. And trust your spidey-sense.

JP

I was gonna say the same thing. Defensive riding is key however I implement that strategy by choosing where I am and when at all times. Usually that means I am riding slightly faster than traffic and I don't let anyone force me into a spot I am not comfortable in. I pick my spots, twist the gas and get there. Always look down the road and you'll avoid a lot of problems.

[MotoSook]

Kurt I was hoping you would speak on that point. And as I suspected, the negligent driver gets off too easily. If I was a motorcyclist who ran over a pedestrian, what would be the charges that can possibly be used against me?

What about a civil case against the cager?

If drivers regard their driving privilege lightly and the law is not harsh enough to make them more alert behind the wheel....maybe a civil suit will. Do we have a precedence?


Regarding the cost of getting into motorcycling. I think it can be cheaper than what some of you guys think. There is a huge used bike market filled with very modern and potent motorcycles. For someone with 3-4K of money to spend, you can buy a good reliable bike + gear.

I figured that I would save about $30/week if ride my bike to work every day of the week. Over 6 months when it's warm, I would save $780. And on the weekends, I have a motorcycle to tool around the country side with....or go riding with my buddies. :-)

Now obviously I won't ride to work every day for 6 months, but for me I love motorcycles, and I own them because I can. Saving gas money is an added bonus.

For about the cost of a set of nice wheels and tires for my 911, I can buy a motorcycle that is capable of 0-60 mph in less than 4 seconds. I get to blast around the back roads to blow off steam and revel in the thrill of speed and acceleration.....and the sense of adventure when I feel like heading in a general direction with no particular destination in mind.

[Rot 911]

Souk, jurors are always reluctant to convict drivers when an accident occurs. Even if the driver is drunk. Somehow they see themselves in the same situation.

A civil suit is your best bet. At least you can hope to get some insurance money. Which brings me to another topic. There appears to be a direct correlation between negligent drivers and drivers who have no insurance. Everyone on this board should give serious thought to upping their uninsured/underinsured insurance on their driver's policies. Most just carry the minimums and it is quite cheap to up the limits.

[Drago]

Originally posted by Jeff Higgins
You would need more tats and scars. Plus a limp. "Drago" would make a decent road name, though. Tell your ol' lady (no longer a "wife") that you're buying a bike so you can ride with me. Then she'll really love me...

Well, I've got the tats covered (do old Grateful Dead tats count?) and the scars, although not visible when wearing clothes. I've got the limp due to the bad feet...nothing macho about that though.

Tonight I'll be sure to refer to her as the "old lady". Of course if she asks it'll be all your idea...

The only real question is if your CS buddies will accept a big beemer into their midst.

Maybe I'll look up the local Banditos chapter.

[Hugh R]

Young male highway motorcycle riders = #1 source of donor organs in the US

[Drago]

Originally posted by Jeff Higgins
I have commuted off and on by motorcycle for 26 years. Recreational riding and commuting are two different animals altogether. The danger while commuting is heightened considerably by traffic density and the commuter attitude. Everybody is running late and distracted in at least one way, often more. While vigalance is always necessary, rush hour raises the risk exponentially. I would recommend riding recreationally, away from heavy traffic and peak commute times, for some time before you attempt to commute.

+2

My near t-boned experience was when I was relatively new to riding and I was on my way home from work.

Recreational riding is way more fun and safe anyway...unless your trying to keep up with the guy who posted the above comments.

[MotoSook]

Kurt, that just sucks. A car with a negligent driver behind the wheel is likely the most deadly thing we know...why? Because of the shear number of vehicles out there. Every vehicle is a weapon, but we don't see it like that (we being the general public), because we are trained to think that one vehicle crashing into another is an accident. Even when there is a fatality, that accident is likely to be just that, an accident with the other driver or the negligent driver getting a lesser sentence.

It's like, "Oops! I didn't mean to crash into your car. It's OK I have insurance. Sorry about the injury and the death of your passenger."

OK OK...that's a bit extreme, but lets face it. Most drivers out there really do not think of how deadly they can be with their car.

[MotoSook]

Originally posted by Hugh R
Young male highway motorcycle riders = #1 source of donor organs in the US

That adds to the negative preception....further discounting the rights of riders


People love quirky little terms like that. And it's too bad that some bad riders prevents the rest of us from receiving the same respect on the road as the cagers.

How many car or truck accidents result in organ donors?

But it's cool, the poor guy was just a victim of a car accident. Poor him.


But if it's a rider, the guy was being a punk, so he deserves to be an organ donor

[Hugh R]

I'm not putting any connotation on it. I got t-boned on a ten speed in college in Boston by a hit and run. The down handle bar went in my sack and came out just below my belly button. I lost a nut and about 1/2 my blood. I don't remember anything after getting hit for a few days. I was taken to the nearest hospital which happened to be a catholic hospital. I was told they gave me the last rites.

[MotoSook]

I wasn't personalizing it, Hugh. Just the fact that folks love to use the term "organ donor" when speaking of young riders gives the rest of us a bad rep.


I'm glad you are alive a well.

[vash]

splitting lanes is legal in cali, when done in a safe manner. believe me, splitting is safer than getting rear ended. moving target is harder to hit. i love when i get to split while following a CHP guy on his big cruiser. now that is safe.

[Hugh R]

And by the way, I believe most car-bike accidents are the cars fault. Especially now with people chattin on their cell phones.