America is a Racist Country, which relagates to inferior status Negros, Hispanics, Indians, Asians or anybody new...He11 when the Irish stepped off the boat the English discriminated against them..calling them Rednecks, when the Italians, jews and Poles stepped off the boat the Irish and English discriminated against them. So what the fk is new, its Americas Great passtime..

Now all the afore mentioned get to discriminate against the Rag Heads...

I'm not rationalizing calling anybody anything. But It's true. Most white people I know don't care about being called a redneck and wouldn't consider it the ultimate slap in the face.

Like I said above, Jeff Foxworthy has made a career out of "You might be a Redneck . . . "

That's been on all the mainstream media. I think he's even been on Disney. So, obviously, "redneck" has a meaning and use that is fully acceptable by mainstream society.

I highly doubt we'll be seeing a black comedian doing "You might be a N if . . ." on network TV any time soon.

Which proves the point. Words are nothing but a collection of letters, they alone have no meaning. They only mean what we as a society make them mean.

And we, as a society, have not made "redneck" anywhere near the level of insult as the N word. That's just a fact. I suppose if you wanted you could argue it shouldn't be that way, i.e., that "redneck" should carry the same heavy weight and be the same level of insult as the N word.

But should and is are two completely different things. And in American in 2006, the N word and "redneck" are nowhere near the same level of insult. It is simply impossible to effectively argue otherwise.

Interesting that you mention the fact that words are just a collection of letters. The "N" word is simply a variety of the Spanish word for "black". Why it become a slur was simply the way it was being used.

No, it is not impossible to argue otherwise. The "we, as a society" to which you refer has left out the folks that are, in fact, truly insulted by the term "redneck". It very much carries the same weight as "nigger" when used with these people. That's the part that folks at the higher end of the socio-economic ladder fail to grasp; the very fact that their endearing little insult really does carry significant weight with a very real part of our population. Because it does not carry the same weight to you, or to the folks you regularly interact with, or to the "national conscienceness", does not mean that these people are not deeply hurt by it. Maybe even more so than the folks insulted by "nigger" because, as poor whites, their pleas for understanding and help fall upon society's deaf ears. And, as you so aptly demonstrated, no one thinks they are insulting them.

I imagine it would depend on their circumstances. Obviously the yachting, porsching crowd might find it funny to be called a redneck....Someone that is part of the poor white underclass that really fit the stereotype might take it poorly...just as I imagine a person that is not black...or does not consider themselves black...would consider being called the n-word such a bad thing bad either. Where I grew up, calling someone a redneck would get your ass kicked just as assuredly as using the n-word in Harlem.

Foxworthy just presents it so that everyone in the audience thinks he is talking about someone else...certainly not them. It also depends on how the term is used and by whom. He also implies that he is also a redneck...and it is a term of endearment...much like blacks calling other blacks the n-word. Some of prissy, panty-waisted beach boys that use the term so readily should come on down to the farm and see how funny everyone thinks they are when you call them that.

Yes, it is impossible to argue otherwise.

You prove my point yourself when you wrote "The "we, as a society" to which you refer has left out the folks that are, in fact, truly insulted by the term "redneck".

That admits that the term isn't viewed as offensive by society as a whole (the way things "are"), but then states that it does so by leaving out folks that are truly insulted by the term redneck (the way things "ought to be"). Your own argument - you are admitting that "we as a society have accepted Redneck as an acceptable term."

Which is of course true. "Redneck" is widely accepted as a largely benign term in the U.S. That's just the way it is. There is "Redneck Beer." A million car and motocross teams called "Redneck Racing." "You might be a Redneck . . . " is widely accepted. www.redneckworld.com is completely uncontroversial.

Do you think "N Beer" would be as uncontroversial as "Redneck Beer?" "N Racing?" "You might be a N . . . ?" "www.n******world.com?" C'mon, let's be real.

Are some insulted by "redneck"? Probably. But that doesn't change the fact that (1) most aren't, and (2) that is reflected in society's acceptance of it.

Everything is PC these days. If a significant part of the population was truly deeply insulted by the term, Jeff Foxworthy would not be a mainstream phenom, and "Redneck Racing" would not be painted on race team trailers, T-Shirts, etc. throughout the country.

Maybe you think Redneck SHOULD be viewed as being as offensive as the N word. Again, that's a completely different argument. But in real life America 2006, it simply isn't.

But the fact is, Foxworthy can use "redneck" on TV because a large majority of the population find it acceptable. Right or wrong, it's an observable fact.

You would never, on the other hand, have a mainstream network comedian base on act on "You might be a N if . . . "

Because the two terms carry very different weight in America.

I really can't believe people would fight that very simple and easy factual observation.

Speak for yourself. And I'm not "utopian" either as someone else described.

While my background hardly qualifies for any special protection (100% German and German/American on both sides), I did chose a 100% Chinese/American women for my wife -- and thankfully she reciprocated. It's not that I have anything special for Asian women as opposed to Caucasions, my previous girlfriend was as WASP as they come. It's just that she was the right women for me, and I've been thankful to be married to her every day since then.

My wife's parents still speak Chinese at home unless they are addressing me. My wife and I both laugh about how she used to often be given the bill to total and divy up when a large group of people went out -- because everyone knows that Asians are good at math! :rolleyes: When we were younger we both used to get the stares from the locals when we held hands while walking through Chinatowns. One of the few Chinese words that I know is "lo-fan" which means non-Chinese, and is not particularly complimentary.

My mother even gave me a bit of a cautionary lecture when we first got engaged about what would happen to the kids since they would be neither Asian nor Caucasion. Our response when this subject came up was was that they'd be beautiful for who they are, not for their ethnic group. But they would be lucky to have two very different cultural backgrounds to draw upon. Both girls are quite happy to describe that they are "half Chinese, half German, and all American". They're just as happy with chop-sticks and wearing chimsums (SP? the long form-fitting Chinese dress) as they are learning German and wearing Derndles (German folk dresses). Thankfully in our local public school their class-mates have comparably diverse ethnic backgrounds from all 6 populated continents. One of my daughter's best friends last year was Indian (sub-continent, not Native American). My wife and I agreed that he was a great kid and were sorry to learn that they didn't share a class this year.

The first time that I filled out a census form after my kids were born, I got really frustrated because there about 20 different special groups to identify with, and a person was expected to pidgeon-hole themselves into only one. Sure that's easy for my wife and I, but not for the girls. After thinking about it for a minute or two, I just jumped down to the "other" category and wrote in "Human" -- because that's the only group that matters.

I work for companies which are predominantly Asian. They are owned by Asians, run by Asians and predominantly staffed by Asians. Guess what -- I'm the minority. Is that a problem for me? Nah. I am who I am, and try to provide the most value that I can for my position. If I can bring in the sales, I'm neither American, Chinese or Malaysian -- I'm a salesman who books orders. It's not because of my race that I do or don't -- it's because of me.

I see racial prejudices every day. But that doesn't mean that we have to be defined by them. That only happens if we give in to the prejudices -- both our own and the other person's. I try to make a point to consider each person for their ideas and individual value. To be honest, in some people it's hard to find much of either. But I do try.

If I feel that someone is prejudiced against me, I don't let it get me down. In some cases I find it funny. I'm not going to let someone else's narrow view of me constrain my life. I am who I want to be.

John,

Perfect post...what makes me enjoy this BBS.

Hmm... I'm not sure how to clear this up for you, other than to point out that we are saying essentially the same thing. "Redneck" is accepted today; I don't dispute that. I do, however, decry that acceptance.

My point, and I believe where we might differ, is that the only reason the term "redneck" is so accepted in mainstream society today is because of that society's indifference concerning that term. It has become so accepted, so de rigour, that those who use it have no idea of how hurtful it is to some. Or maybe they just don't care. This has happened before in America.

Think of how the term "nigger" was used in America just a generation or two back. It was used in the most enlightened, educated circles. No one thought twice about using it. Hell, most of the people using it never even considered how hurtful it was to others. It took the Civil Rights Movement to cast the term "nigger" in its proper light for society to see. We are now at exactly that same point with "redneck", only there will never be a similar civil rights crusade on their behalf.

And no, real-life rednecks cannot afford to race. They don't have TV shows, or stage acts. They don't sell tee shirts. Jeff Foxworthy is their modern-day equivalent of the old Vaudeville "blackface" acts, wherein performers made fun of, and perpetuated all the well known stereotypes about, the American Black. And everyone laughed. I'm sure that all seemed pretty harmless to enlightened society back then, as the whole "redneck" issue does today.

That clears it up. We agree it is accepted.

As to whether it should be accepted, I don't know. I don't know anyone that is deeply insulted or hurt by "redneck," and I've known and grown up with a lot of people that are fairly "salt of the earth." But maybe there is a huge part of the white population that is deeply offended by the term redneck, I don't know.

But henceforth, I will not use "redneck" anymore, but instead, the "R word" or "sons of the soil." :)

John, your story isn't quite the same as what is being debated here. The issues of being lao wai and caucasian/asian intermarriage is a whole other ball of wax. I applaud your attitude, but it isn't the same as white/black. And if you were living in China, you'd find some different attitudes.

We should all strive to be "color blind", but I think we also have to try and understand our own biases, and the ones of those around us. And often times, the way someone reacts to us has less to do with us and our race, and more to do with the fact that they might just be having s crappy day. Of course some people seem to always have a crappy day :p

Your logic is quite flawed. "Nigger" was completely acceptable to a large majority of the population when I was growing up. Right or wrong, an observable fact. I guess if we let that be our standard for discourse, it would still be used to describe about 15% of our population and would still be perfectly appropriate for TV too.

Funny how easy it is to justify harmful stereotypes when they are applied to someone else.

Your comprehension really isn't great.

Try again.

That's probably not enough clues for you.

Focus in where I discuss the difference between "is" and "ought."

There, now try again.

You sure seem to enjoy insults as long as they are used against someone else....Oh, wait...is that some sort of special...not-so-bad slur?

I answered the post you made. If you did not mean to use those words...you should either explain or retract them. Implying that I am stupid is really not a very effective tactic and only reinforces my point.