Another reason to only buy old cars...

[Porsche virgin]

You can get them with a manual transmission!

"Audi officials, at a roundtable discussion with the media at this week’s North American International Auto Show here, admit they’re considering doing away with the stick shift for its mainstream U.S. models.

“It’s conceivable in the U.S. we may dispense with manuals,” Johan de Nysschen, executive vice president of Audi of America Inc., says."

This would exclude the S and RS models.

Well, I guess I won't be buying an Audi anytime soon. Manuals are becoming rarer and rarer. Are we the only people left that actually LIKE driving a manual?

http://wardsauto.com/ar/audi_clutch_goodbye/

[TSNAPCRACKLEPOP]

gee, and i have been reading the manual for years, no wonder my car is such low mileage!

[Jim Richards]

Americans get the suckiest imports.

[wludavid]

I don't get it. We have the cheapest gas, constitute a HUGE market for uber-cars like the RS 4 and BMW M-cars, and yet everything is always detuned, automated and luxofied.

[kach22i]

If I had to drive everyday in traffic, I'd think twice about a having to clutch and shift.

I went to a Ferrari track day once just to watch, those paddle shifters ended up leaving the heavy smell of burnt clutch in the air. I'd like to test drive one.

[Jim Richards]

Originally posted by wludavid
I don't get it. We have the cheapest gas, constitute a HUGE market for uber-cars like the RS 4 and BMW M-cars, and yet everything is always detuned, automated and luxofied.

By and large, Americans can't drive, don't take driving seriously, and don't enjoy driving for the sake of driving. And there's lawsuits over everything, so better play it safe.

[Joeaksa]

In Europe you can even get rental cars with a stick shift. Never see one in America.

Difference is that in Europe you are not given a drivers license in a box of post toasties, you have to study for it and pass a rigid exam. Cost is about $1500 in Germany, same in other countries. Then you have to have emergency medical training and so on before your license is granted.

Motorcycle riders are limited to a 27 hp bike for the first year or two as a safety measure.

Big difference in the way they handle driving... In Germany if you run out of gas on the autobahn you get a ticket. After all, doing something like this is not responsible and a license is not a given, its something you have to earn then keep working at to keep. Wish it was this way in the states.

[IROC]

I think I read that a few years ago, only 7% of all cars sold in the US had a manual transmission. I don't think this included pickup trucks.

I've had a rental car with a manual transmission in the US, but it was a long time ago (20 years ago).

Mike

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Manuals will last the life of the car (cost of a clutch every once in a great while). Automatics are lucky to last 100,000 miles or 6 years.

[dd74]

The problem with buying an old car, a Porsche in particular, and driving it in traffic, is the stick itself. The 915 box has to be shifted, in most cases, more slowly than an automatic shifts. As an owner of an old Porsche with a 915, I sometimes find newer cars in traffic nearly rear-ending me as I shift from first to second, and in some cases, second to third.

Also, with Schwarzenegger threatening to reformulate fuel, who knows what that will do to the octane of the gasoline our old cars need to operate on. I use premium without the aid of knock sensors, computers or what-not. But if the fuel falls one or two points lower, my car would need a race gas mixture or twin-plugged, etc., etc., which would be, quite frankly, a huge financial pain in the ass.

At times, I drive my old car thinking how it conceivably could out live me. The problem is my old car can't out live government decisions about the gas it uses or the fact that SUVs threaten to mow it over with their super-fast-shifting six and seven speed computer controlled auto transmissions.

So one day, I'll probably park the 911, buy a Prius, and become one of the dreaded flock of uninvolved motorists. I can already see that begining to happen.

[mikester]

I resent that; I have a prius and don't consider myself uninvolved.

I even change its oil instead of taking it to the shop.

I have indulged in taking the porsche to the shop though. The last bill however I think has cured me of that...

[Porsche virgin]

Originally posted by Jim Richards
By and large, Americans can't drive, don't take driving seriously, and don't enjoy driving for the sake of driving. And there's lawsuits over everything, so better play it safe.

BINGO!

I rented a 1.0L turbo diesel in Italy with a 5 speed MT. Good little car. A taxi we took was a 190E 5 speed with manual windows. Damn nice.

When I learned to drive, I did so on a manual (an old Datsun pickup truck). I think you HAVE to take your test with a MT in Europe.

I know that automatics have their place, but I just really ENJOY shifting. I get a good feeling every time I match the revs properly, heel-and-toeing or double-clutching.

[Jim Richards]

Remember, in America we need vehicles with cupholders for every passenger, TV's to occupy them (no more "are we there yet?"), tables for the kids to eat their Fruit Loops at while we're driving, mirrors to support applying making up and shaving on our way to work, nav displays so we can wait to find out where we're going until we're already well on our way down the road ("Maps? I don't need no stinkin' maps!"), and they have to be big and strong enough to survive unscathed when Skylab falls on them.

[m21sniper]

Originally posted by wludavid
I don't get it. We have the cheapest gas, constitute a HUGE market for uber-cars like the RS 4 and BMW M-cars, and yet everything is always detuned, automated and luxofied.

Our roads suck, our emmissions regulations are ownerus(sp?), our speed limits are a joke, our citizens on avg. have lower driving skills than most of Europe, and on top of it most US drivers don't care about a motoring spirit, but rather want a mobile entertainment center, complete with cupholders, cellphones, and MP3/DVD players.

It's no wonder they sell the crap they do.

[onewhippedpuppy]

The average American is fat, lazy and spoiled. Why shift, when the car can do it for you? On top of that, you have to LEARN to drive stick. Perish the thought!

[m21sniper]

Originally posted by Porsche-O-Phile
Manuals will last the life of the car (cost of a clutch every once in a great while). Automatics are lucky to last 100,000 miles or 6 years.

I've seen a lot of old manuals with whooped syncros bro. Even well maintained ones. Most of the old 5speed 928s are in need of a good trans rebuild nowadays too, and those cars are built about as good as anything that's ever been put on the road.

[Porsche virgin]

Originally posted by m21sniper
...a mobile entertainment center, complete with cupholders, cellphones, and MP3/DVD players.

What I don't get are guys watching pron movies on laptops while driving. They actually made the effort to make it illegal in some states, I believe.

[holtjv]

There's a lot to be said about a car such as an old Porsche with a MT; very involved, great driver feedback, fun to drive, etc.

But a sedan with a MT is a pita--really the reason I got rid of my M5 after 3-4 months. The only way to feel like I was going fast, or to hear the engine was if I was going +120mph--way too dangerous for a dad. Maybe the old M5s or even the new M3s are more involved and fun to drive (thus justifying shifting)--the newer Audi's are certainly disconnected from the road and offer little driving excitement unless you're pushing the safety envelope.

I told my co-worker this theory and he thought it was stupid. He drove my SC and, at a whopping 70mph said, "damn! this is fun!"

He just bought an S4 and admitted, "now I know what you meant about your M5."

Jack

[Noah930]

Why not just drive around in a lower gear, then?

[dd74]

I once heard a statistic on a car-related radio talkshow that nationwide only .5 of a percent of new drivers know how to drive stick. Here in LA, almost every new Mustang GT, Honda Civic, VW GTi, and a bunch more I know I'm leaving out, that on the city streets, are automatics. I've always thought of these cars as manuals.

With certain cars, Subaru and Honda have it right as I don't believe you can purchase a WRX STi or S2000 as an automatic. If a buyer wants an auto, they'll have to select another car.