I read somewhere, that indeed math skilz are pretty bad. In fact, in the math catagory, 50% are below average. http://www.pelicanparts.com/support/...ool_shades.gif


:D

Wow, this is quite a thread. I've learned a lot; not so much about public education, but a lot about people here. (And by extrapolation, people in general)?

Schools by definition are in the mass education business, they must design a curriculum that is effective at educating a number of children at once. I did poorly in school compared to my siblings due to a restless and easily bored nature that was not suited to the discipline of studying hard and concentrating, (what they now call ADD), but I would never dream of blaming the school that also sent my brother and two sisters on their way to post-graduate degrees and extreme academic achievement. It was a public school, BTW. I do not remember the political indoctrination classes that Paul frequently refers to, maybe I was not paying attention in class?

I definitely would have benefitted from the type of intense individual attention that a top private school and private 1-on-1 tutoring provides, if nothing else it would have fed my ego and made me feel important. But that is not what school is supposed to be; it is a factory of learning and parents are supposed to prepare their children for it. I was reading well before the 1st grade, I remember being bored for the first time in class when they were teaching *Dick and Jane* level R&R. We went to the Public Library w/ my Mom from the time we were born when she was checking out or returning books, (another horrible government institution to some here I'm sure), :rolleyes:, I remember asking for books with pictures of cars in them at a very young age. It introduced me to reading in general, through my parents letting me pursue an early interest. I am certain that my mother, who had 5 children in 5 years after marriage at 25 y.o., did not put an inordinate amount of time into individual tutoring of us. And my dad worked and made money, he definitely spent ZERO time raising us unless you include a kiss goodnight at bedtime and the occasional ass-whupping for bad behavior.

If you have parents who are not intellectually curious or readers themselves, you cannot expect their children raised in a house with them to be different. The world needs ditch-diggers and Republican voters, (j/k :D), it all used to work out before we had such an over-population of people and the need for every type of "growth" in society, IMO. America has traditionally been a place where really mediocre white people could make a lot of money and have a great lifestyle, and the demise of this is causing a lot of kicking and screaming, understandably. We have middle-aged people here who are functionally illiterate in their native language, but have several expensive cars in their signature line and brag about their material possessions, w/o even realizing that it's the red badge of a moron.

I think that it is admirable that parents like Jim C. are so involved in their kid's lives, I often wonder if I'd have done better in certain areas if my Dad had given a schit. It also sounds like your son may have had a really bad teacher, (more than one?), they exist, but they never made a difference in my educational experience. I had some exceptional teachers in public schools, those are the only ones that made a difference one way or the other and broke my extreme ennui for a moment, the boring or lazy ones were of no consequence.

Interesting, revealing discussion none-the-less. :cool:

What is this library thing you speak of?

Hmmmm... loaning out books for free!

Sounds like some sort of socialist/communist plot, this sort of thing could lead to independant thought! We better close them all down just to be safe.
;)

if teaching is such a cush scam, why don't you brilliant minds do it? From they way you guys describe it, you'd have to be a moron *not* to be a teacher.

seriously.

50% of opinions offered on Pelican OT are below average.

but only one is brilliant.

butt darts

teaching is one of the jobs i turned down and i had the hook to get the job.

it was "do i want to hang with these people all day?"

they live and bang each in their own little world.

Only if smileys are included, otherwise, you're just average. :p
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/NickBu...iley1/moon.gif http://mywebpages.comcast.net/NickBu...y3/roflmao.gif

do you know where that dart has been?!?

:eek:

My son was left back in Kindegarten, he was tested and found to be normal (by the school) he has a borderline birthday and we chalked it up to atarting him too early. By 1st grade it was apparent to us (not the school) that he was not keeping up. Couple that with abusive teachers and we were not sure what was going on.

He was tested again in second grade by the school, again, averything was fine. We took him for a private testing and found there was something wrong but no one was sure what. We hired a tutor to help us work with him, we did not replace our helping him with a tutor, we supplemented our help with a tutor. She felt he had soemthing wrong too but she said whatever it was he is compensating in a huge way and he will probably always be an average student. In other words C's would be his A's.

We were cool with that but we researched further and found out schools are not teaching cognitive skills anymore. We paid a learning center over $5,000 to teach our son cognitive skills and to teach us how to cement them in.

He got a little better in school but then he had another really bad teacher and he started to go downhill, we tried to get him switched and were told no way too many kids in the school and they cannot be doing that. So he suffered for a year.

When he got to middle school we hoped it would be a good thing for him being he will change classes. Last year (6th grade) he FAILED math while I fought and fought to try to get him to understand the work (Geometry and Algebra) and teach him at home. Techers conferences and guidence visits did nothing.

The teacher was fired after the 3rd 1/4 it seems most of her students were failing.

My son had to go to summer school missing passing the class by 1 point. He wad an 85 average in summer school I am not sure that means much from an acedemic standpoint being summer school is probably dummied down but what it did to his self esteem was amazing.

He got an A the 1st quarter with a very young and enthusiastic new teacher in 7th grade and a B the second 1/4.

When we saw his language arts go from a solid B last year to an F this year I knew what the problem was. But then that teacher crossed the line and was humiliating him before the class. This is where I went from the nice parent that backs the teachers to a raving mad a-hole that was out to make this woman apologize and step back off my son.

I resulted in my son being repeatedly pulled form class anf forced toconfess to lieing when he did not and threatened with punishment from the pricipal.

I had it and pulled him from the school he was nto safe there anymore and he was not going to be taught language arts from an incompetant teacher.

Guess what, he was in a class competition this past week, he had to find alternate definitions for words the fastest. He came in 3rd and now is entered in a national competition. If he comes in in the top 5 he gets a 50K scholership.

The switch to private school has stopped the mental abuse and my son it turning into a happy person again.

I would like to go visit his old teachers and tell them what kind of people I think they are.

I am VERY involved with my family I dare say more than most of you here. I have given up my social life to be there 100% for them. The insinuations that I am not involved with my kids education are insulting to me. You have no idea what I have sacrificed for my family. I wouldn't change a thing.

Public Schools SUCK and if it makes you feel better to take shots at me because I feel that way go for it. I will make financial sacrifices to keep my kids in private school. Even sell my P-car if it comes down to it. My kids and wife are all that matters to me.

Jim, sorry you and your son had such a bad experience. Not sure what to say, but I only offer that not all public schools suck. And just because a school is private that doesn't make it better than public (and vice versa). There are just too many variables to make that kind of generalization.

We had a very tough time with our son and went through private testing as well. Maybe we were lucky, but we also never were either "nice parent" or "raving arsehole", but rather polite yet adament about finding the best solution for our son. We learned how the system worked (with help from a psychologist who acted as an advocate for us through the process) and kept at it. We started him in 1st grade but after 2 weeks dropped him back to K because it was obvious it wasn't working from a socialization level. We jumped through the hoops and were persistant and now, in 4th grade, it is quite a bit better. We do fear middle school though, as if he didn't test gifted (he is not a great test taker, and he really doesn't engage if he thinks it isn't of worth) then the standard classes will likely not work for him.

The problem with private school is that they can take or leave kids. If a kid is disruptive or doesn't conform to what they want, they can just boot him out. That is one advantage to public school...they can't do that so they will work to find solutions. Plus the local private schools in our neighborhood are outrageous...we're talking $15-25K/year for middle school and up.

$15k a year in L.A.? Where??

Crossroads, Marlboro, Harvard/Westlake are all ~$25k per student/year.

Maybe Catholic schools are less, I don't know.

sorry, typo. i'll fix it ;)

Wait till your kid gets a sadistic old bat waiting for her retirement.

I pay 11K a year for my son to attend a Montesorri school. The atmosphere and the attitude of the staff and teachers is 180° from his last public school.

My son is not a behavior problem, never was, he is quiet, polite and well mannered. Behavior has never been a issue with him.

The teachers and staff have raved over how awesome of a kid he is and how well he fits in with the rest of the kids.

I chaperoned a field trip to see freedom writers last week and helped build a canopy over their lunch area outside last weekend and met a lot of other parents.

First I looked at the parking lot. I had the shiney red Porsche, they all had older For Explorers and pickup trucks. I got to talking with a lot of the parents, regular people making sacrifices to pay for their kids to be there. No rich a holes no attitude, I probably shot myself in the foot driving my Porsche there. These were just regular people that were discusted with the public school system.

They were not all from my area either, it seems some are driving 50 miles to get their kids in this school.

My son is very smart he is always reading books. The Lemony Snicket unfortunate events movie? He read every book. Eregon? Read the book and is reading the second one now.

He need a safe place and a competant teacher. He has those now and I am watching this kid change before my eyes. I am so pissed at myself for not doing this years ago.

Its sad you have to play a game with the public school system to get a troubled kid help. All of you have admitted that you have to know how to play the system and to that I say Public Schools suck.

Then either he'll change rooms or she'll retire early. Period.

It isn't a "game". It is my child's future. So I learn how the system works and act accordingly. In our case, sending him to private school is a bigger risk. There is more than one way to deal with your child's education. You picked yours, we've picked ours. I still argue that you can't make blanket statements like "public schools suck" or "all teachers are overpaid lazy jerks." It just isn't true...maybe in some places and in some situations, but it does not generalize to "all".

Doesn't hurt a bit that being part of the system, albeit at the university level, helps you understand how the system works when it comes to your own child... Jim, I agree with you...Government schools SUCK! They are primarily about teacher's union members and their determined pay and benefits. They call themselves "professionals", yet they enjoy both tenure and collective bargaining. Once a teacher obtains tenure, you pull teeth getting them fired for mere incompetence...they need to have engaged in criminal activity in order to be booted. The actual education of children is secondary to the teacher's union...they do the least work they think they can get away with. It's about the money.

below could be a true personal story or not? I really don't care either way but at the least it's entertainment.





"If you have channel 69(no cute comments needed) a car auction is in the works."


"Thx
Coffee ????????? "


"I wish I could do it all day everyday. This week-I am giving a midterm exam-expected to get it marked and get the report card grades in by Friday, have a course I'm taking on Thursday, taking my uncle to the MD on Friday and probably going to have no sense of humor by Saturday when I have to ..............You get the point-not until next week.That is unless I hand in my retirement papers tomorrow when I have a black militant who wants my ass because his niece is operating with an IQ of about 70 and is not capable of learning much, meeting with my principal and me to tell me what HE wants me to do for her. I'm sorry for the kid but it is difficult to teach a kid with so little to work with. She doesn't remember a statement I teach within five minutes of my having said it even when I relate it to her life. Does not compute> "

Some interesting info here...

How Much Are Public School Teachers Paid?
http://www.manhattan-institute.org/html/cr_50.htm

Same old nonsense about hourly wages.

GO be a teacher and then come back and say how well you are paid.