Why he joined

[widgeon13]

Originally posted by on-ramp
what is tragic here is that these men and women are dying everyday because of Bush's illegal invasion of Iraq....their sacrifice is wrongfully justified as "fighting the war on terror" or "protecting our way of life here" . this is Horseschit.

invading Iraq was never to protect the American people from an "imminent and grave threat". it goes deeper than that. the whole thing was made up. you can certainly accomplish a lot if you get enough people scared. the aftermath of 9/11 provided a perfect opportunity.

I have a very close friend whose son graduated last fall from Boston College. He has always been commited to the military and in spite of what you might think, is a very bright young man. He was in ROTC, graduated with high honors and was commissioned in the US Army, Infantry, now in training in Fort Benning. He will complete Airborne/Ranger school soon.

I am confident that his parents would prefer that he had chosen a different pursuit in his career but they did not object so strongly as to forbid or discourage him completely. There comes a point in ones life when you have to make a decsion and stand for what you believe. Obviously this young man has made that decision as did Lt. Daily.

I respect their decisions.

God Bless and God Speed

[Seahawk]

Originally posted by rrpjr
Like so much in America today that involves this issue, this thread is both inspiring and depressing.

As for the jab about authenticity (the first impulse of many who don’t like what they read), his parents made his letter available to the Orange County Register, which printed it alongside his obituary. Lt. Daily was an ROTC scholar.

I would think in the case of Lt. Daily, who impressively (certainly for a 23-year-old), declared his intentions to no longer accept inaction in the face of tyranny, liberals would find much to appreciate. For one, what could be more offensive to liberalness than tyranny? Didn’t liberals lionize those who journeyed to Spain to fight the Franco fascists, no matter how futiley? (A fairly mild brand of fascism, by the way, compared to the savage one that far more people face today.) Were THEIR principles “pointless”? Here is a man who described his determination to take action against oppression and tyranny, and then did it. What could possibly be more liberal? And what could be more American.

However “misguided” the national American attempt to wage war in Iraq might turn out to be, or however mismanaged the actual effort has become – and men of good faith can argue this issue – it hardly matters to the point of Lt. Daily’s personal statement. He was only telling us why he joined.

To deny a man like Lt. Daily his due or belittle his sacrifice as “pointless” is a kind of existential graverobbing by a niggardly, illiberal mind. It is a moral insult, not only against an individual, but against individuality itself. And against liberalism.

Once, to be a liberal was to embrace differences, to see them as more evidence of a rich humanity, as a further affirmation of one’s own. It was seen as a thing to love, not to fear.

A true “liberal” would love a man like Lt. Daily to his very bones, and find every way possible to do him honor. He would do so without the least fear of losing his own moral identity or, as the case may be, his own clarity of opposition to the war. In fact, he would welcome Lt. Daily’s convictions as a means of sharpening his own. A true liberal is fearless of competing ideas.

I knew some liberals once. I still know a few. I prize them in my life. But I’m afraid they are like the Mohicans. They are vanishing.

Thanks Joe and Randy. I share your sentiments.

I fear your eloquence will be lost in the maelstrom...but the LT would be proud.

[fintstone]

Yes. That letter reminds me of why I was once a liberal
...and why I am no longer.

[Dottore]

Originally posted by rrpjr

However “misguided” the national American attempt to wage war in Iraq might turn out to be, or however mismanaged the actual effort has become – and men of good faith can argue this issue – it hardly matters to the point of Lt. Daily’s personal statement. He was only telling us why he joined.

To deny a man like Lt. Daily his due or belittle his sacrifice as “pointless” is a kind of existential graverobbing by a niggardly, illiberal mind. It is a moral insult, not only against an individual, but against individuality itself. And against liberalism.

The sad thing is this guy joined to "make a difference". To help in the battle against tyranny.

But he just didn't have enough information to make an informed choice. So he joined a pointless war that has replaced one tyranny with another one that in the long run will be much worse than the old one and will destabilze that part of the world still more - all at the cost of many billions of dollars and countless innocent lives - including his own.

There is nothing noble about another kid making ill-informed choices and losing his life in the process. That's tragic - and to hold this up here as some fine moral example for other kids is the worst sort of mendacity.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by Dottore
The sad thing is this guy joined to "make a difference". To help in the battle against tyranny.

But he just didn't have enough information to make an informed choice. So he joined a pointless war that has replaced one tyranny with another one that in the long run will be much worse than the old one and will destabilze that part of the world still more - all at the cost of many billions of dollars and countless innocent lives - including his own.

There is nothing noble about another kid making ill-informed choices and losing his life in the process. That's tragic - and to hold this up here as some fine moral example for other kids is the worst sort of mendacity.

Thank you, that was well said and true.

[fintstone]

Originally posted by Dottore
The sad thing is this guy joined to "make a difference". To help in the battle against tyranny.

But he just didn't have enough information to make an informed choice. So he joined a pointless war that has replaced one tyranny with another one that in the long run will be much worse than the old one and will destabilze that part of the world still more - all at the cost of many billions of dollars and countless innocent lives - including his own.

There is nothing noble about another kid making ill-informed choices and losing his life in the process. That's tragic - and to hold this up here as some fine moral example for other kids is the worst sort of mendacity.

There is nothing sadder than those who would denigrate the choices and sacrifices of a man who died in the service of his country by calling him a "kid making ill-informed choices" and claiming he was ignorant ("didn't have enough information to make an informed choice" ). His letter seems to indicate that his choice was well thought out, intelligent and well informed. Those of you who choose to besmirch his service can only hope to live and die so well.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by fintstone
There is nothing sadder than those who would denigrate the choices and sacrifices of a man who died in the service of his country by calling him a "kid making ill-informed choices" and claiming he was ignorant ("didn't have enough information to make an informed choice" ). His letter seems to indicate that his choice was well thought out, intelligent and well informed. Those of you who choose to besmirch his service can only hope to live and die so well.

He didn't die in the service of his country, that's the point. He died in the service of the corporate state whose goal is global hegemony. From his writing it's clear he didn't know that. That means he was not in possession of the knowledge required to make such a choice.

[Jeff Higgins]

I have a great deal of respect and admiration for men like Lt. Daily. The world could use many more like him. His personal commitment and ultimately his personal sacrifice are far and above what most people are capable of. Rest in peace, Lt. Daily.

What grieves me the most about Lt. Daily's death, and so many like him, is what is becoming painfully obvious in Iraq. That is that the Iraqi people do not deserve men such as Lt. Daily. I hate to say this about anyone, but they deserve the very tyranny from which Lt. Daily was attempting to liberate them. We have led that proverbial horse to water; it is now clear that it does not want to drink. We gave it our best shot; they do not want, nor do they deserve, our help.

I'm sure men like Lt. Daily would go whether or not they felt a people "deserved" their help. They would go because the leadership of our country asked them to, with no further justification required. They trust our leadership to make good decisions, and not to squander what they have to offer. I applaud that trait in men like him. The men that sent him, however, need to see the bigger picture. Men like Lt. Daily are dependent upon the decision makers at the top to make moral and correct decisions about when and where to deploy them.

I supported this war 100% in the beginning. I thought it was the correct and moral thing to do. I no longer feel that way. I feel the administration is in denial and trying to save face; it is plain to everyone else that there is nothing more we can do in Iraq. It's time for them to help themselves. Or not. Let's not continue the tragedy of good men like Lt. Daily dying for a people that could care less; they do not deserve him.

[Lothar]

Lt. Daily had his heart in the right place. He showed genuine concern for his fellow man. He was selfless in his words and deeds. For that he should be commended.

Unfortunately, when we allow ourselves to grieve for those who live under regimes like that of Saddam and the Taliban, we lose sight of the reality of human existence.

Oppression and suffering has been the norm of human existence since its beginning. It is for but a few isolated times and places that human beings have enjoyed freedom and individual choice. The right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, endowed by the Creator, was a noble experiment built on unwaivering values and a belief in the individual. That experiment has lost its way, in favor of centralist government and the slow and steady shift of power from The People to The Government.

However, America losing its way and falling into the clutches of the centralists does not make Saddam an OK guy or the Taliban less supportive of Islamic terrorists. We still need to adopt policies to undermine regimes that not only oppress their own people, but also threaten our security. Regimes which give sanctuary to and provide meaningful support to terrorists organizations that have been at war with America for decades should be viewed as a serious threat to our security.

That said, America can be a real beacon for freedom and democracy, only when it gets its own house in order. When individual freedom trumps centralized government authority in America, we can encourage other peoples to remove dictators and totalitarian regimes, and replace them with limited and representative governments that serve the people.

It now appears that what we are doing in Iraq is not encouraging Iraqis to step up and fight for their own freedom in sufficient numbers, despite the fact that it is impossible to find anyone in Iraq that believes that things were better under Saddam.

As much as some might want to install freedom and replace tyrrany for other countries, the oppressed must choose vigorously defended freedom over peaceful serfdom for themselves.

I do believe that Saddam posed a real threat to our national security. I just wish that the mechanism by which Saddam met his demise had come from within Iraq.

[Racerbvd]

Originally posted by Dottore
The sad thing is this guy joined to "make a difference". To help in the battle against tyranny.

But he just didn't have enough information to make an informed choice. So he joined a pointless war that has replaced one tyranny with another one that in the long run will be much worse than the old one and will destabilze that part of the world still more - all at the cost of many billions of dollars and countless innocent lives - including his own.

There is nothing noble about another kid making ill-informed choices and losing his life in the process. That's tragic - and to hold this up here as some fine moral example for other kids is the worst sort of mendacity.

So how do you and off-ramp know so much more about this than the guys who have been there??

[Dottore]

Originally posted by Jeff Higgins

What grieves me the most about Lt. Daily's death, and so many like him, is what is becoming painfully obvious in Iraq. That is that the Iraqi people do not deserve men such as Lt. Daily. I hate to say this about anyone, but they deserve the very tyranny from which Lt. Daily was attempting to liberate them.

I'm sure men like Lt. Daily would go whether or not they felt a people "deserved" their help. They would go because the leadership of our country asked them to, with no further justification required. They trust our leadership to make good decisions, and not to squander what they have to offer. I applaud that trait in men like him.

What grieves me about Lt. Daily's death is that it was unnecessary and pointless AND that no one is accountable for it.

You say the Iraqi people do not deserve men such as Lt.Daily. I agree with you there.

But the folly of attempting to impose a Jeffersonian democracy in Iraq was entirely forseeable. It was entirely forseeable that toppling Hussein would only create a power vaccum that would be filled by Iran and eventually result in an even more totalitarian theocracy. THIS was entire forseeable - and yet your criminal administration still chose to mislead your nation into this quagmire with appeals about Saddam's tyranny. And these appeals were found compelling by Lt. Daily and others.

It is this mendacity that I think is inexcuseable, and in this context Lt. Daily's death is tragic.

If there is any lesson in this it must be that people like Lt. Daily should not trust their administration to make good decisions for them. They should instead look critically at their administration and make some informed choices about whether that administration is wise and has the nation's best interests at heart - or whether it is incompetent or corrupt or both - as this one clearly is.

[rrpjr]

http://www.ocregister.com/ocregister/news/local/article_1547107.php

Lt. Daily’s funeral is this Saturday in Irvine, the Mariner’s Church, 10:30 am. The public is invited.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by Racerbvd
So how do you and off-ramp know so much more about this than the guys who have been there??

The same effect was observed in men who served in Vietnam. Soldiers in a war zone, in actual combat, have tunnel vision in their daily focus on survival. They do not have time, nor should they spend one moment on, making observations about the tactical or strategic value of their mission. To do so invites death and dismemberment.

Lots of guys "adopted" views of the combat they were involved well after the time they were actually in it, none of those views have any additional validity over those of people making dispassionate and objective evaluations of the events or actions.

[Moneyguy1]

Actually, any of us, placed in a hazardous situation, make the best out of that situation. And in order to do that, it takes a positive attitude and a belief that what we are doing makes a difference. Without that mindset, one cannot perform at peak. Resignation and thoughts of defeat prove to be self-fulfilling prophicies.