US Bombs killed Afghani kids...

[djmcmath]

I heard the story this morning on NPR, and haven't taken the time to look up a link, but the gist of it is a common enough story: the US conducted surveillance on a site, determined it was being used exclusively by The Enemy, and conducted a bombing run. Afterwards, it was determined that 7 children were inside, and are now dead.

Part of me is shocked at the tragedy. How awful! How could we do such a thing!

And part of me says, "But why were the militants hiding with kids, anyway?" I mean, what kind of sick-o keeps his military might and his future generations in the same place, knowing that bombing raids are imminent?


A lot of questions come from this, as it isn't a particularly uncommon case. This happens to Israel all the time -- they strike a building full of terrorists, and school-children across the street get hit by the shrapnel. Terrorists hide in mosques, and the bombs wipe out a structure hundreds of years old, including the sick and elderly who were nearby. It's really an awful thing.

The Law of Armed Conflict says that you shouldn't co-locate war stuff with peace stuff. It is against the rules to park your tanks in the playground of a daycare, for example. But is it ok to bomb the guys tanks, if he's parked them in the playground of an active daycare? If you do bomb the tanks, you lose the war because of bad PR. If you don't bomb the tanks, you lose the war because he's got invincible military strength.

What does this group think about the topic? Is it ok to bomb a mosque full of children, if you know it's also full of suicide bombers and their leadership? Is it prohibited to kill our enemies if even one innocent life is lost? Why?

[Joeaksa]

Sad to hear about. Just saw it on the news as well.

Agree with your comments and terrorists hiding among a family or children is the lowest of scum. Problem as I see it is that the military was watching the compound for over a day and never saw any kids or women so felt that it was safe to take the terrorists out. Only after the smoke clears were the kids found.

Remember, a large number of the guys and gals in the military have kids of their own, and had they known that ANY kids were in harms way the bombs would not have been dropped.

Regarding your question on killing innocent people when terrorists are hiding amonst them, we hope and feel that we hold ourselves to a higher standard and would never harm the life of an innocent person to kill a terrorist. They are willing to sacrifice theirselves while we would never do something like this.

[Jeff Higgins]

How "innocent" are they if terrorists are hiding among them?

I'm going to take the opposing, and very unpopular position on this one. The nature of guerrila warfare (and now terrorism) is that the enemy combatants hide among their families, counting on our civility - a civility they clearly do not share - to keep us from attacking them when they do so. They also count upon our psychological need to delineate between "combatant" and "innocent". Is the guy actually pulling the trigger the only "combatant", or could the kid running errands for him be contributing in some way? How about those allowing him refuge in their community? I'm sure they are supporting him with more than just idle words of encouragement.

Israel has shown the courage to properly answer this question. If you are close enough to get hit by the residuals, then you are certainly not "innocent". No one can tell me that these "innocents", living in such close proximity, had no idea what they were living next to, nor what activities were taking place in such close proximity. Israel has seen through this cowardly, cynical lie. We should too.

[Mo_Gearhead]

These types of individuals (terrorist cowards) USE women and children for just this purpose. Put them in harms way, strap bombs to them, et al. They know the world will be watching as the bodies are dragged out and all the hand wringing will begin, OHHH, how terrible the USA is ...etc ... etc. What's new? It is a propoganda tool that they have embraced and use to their advantage.

IMO, Kill 'em ALL ...and let God sort 'em out!

Now bring on the flamers, I can take it!

[sammyg2]

Ever hear the saying, war is hell?
that's becaise people die in wars, bad things happen in wars.
It isn't supposed to be like a video game. Especially when the enemy does not play by the same rules as you do.

[Racerbvd]

7 less future terrorist, and the problem is??

[stevepaa]

Ah, final solution talk again, I see.

[widgeon13]

"Laws of Armed Conflict" what makes you think they will pay attention to that? But we must play by the rules? Collateral damage.

These idiots have no honor, they only respect the law of Allah

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Have to agree. If these kids were hanging around or being raised by Al Qaeda, they're not "innocents". They're future suicide bombers.

The notion of children being "innocent" is largely a western one - in many other areas of the world, children are used as soldiers, couriers, smugglers, etc.

It's a quaint western notion that we better learn to dispense with if we're going to prevail against enemies that think nothing of using children as a resource to their own ends. Just because we don't like it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

[sammyg2]

In a recent poll taken in the US, about 25% of the muslims asked said that suicide bombings are justified in some circumstances. Almost 40% of the muslims under the age of 30 said they supported suicide bombings in some cases.
I'd venture to guess that the number was much higher but many were not willing to admit it.
Now, that is in the US. What do you think the results would be if the poll was taken in Iraq or Afganistan? Prolly close to 100%. Nothing innocent about it, or them.

[legion]

You have to be willing to fight dirty to ensure a clean victory.

[stevepaa]

Originally posted by Porsche-O-Phile
Have to agree. If these kids were hanging around or being raised by Al Qaeda, they're not "innocents". They're future suicide bombers.
.

Change Al Qaeda to Russian and you justify the Chechan killings at the school.


Good company you guys want to keep.

Samir Qantar, who murdered a four-year-old Israeli girl, her father, and a policeman in a notorious 1979 raid, has said: "In our opinion there are no civilians in Israel." In Onward Muslim Soldiers I quote Muammar Qaddafi's son, Seyf-al-Islam (that means Sword of Islam, jimmychang, wherever you are) Qaddafi, saying the same thing: "There are no civilians in Israel."

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Fine and dandy. I hear Al Qaeda is looking to adopt a few children. Since you're so convinced of their good intentions, why not volunteer your own?

[Jeff Higgins]

Pretty simplistic view, Steve. I'm dissapointed. Not really surprised with your typical liberal hand-wringing, though. What really weakens your case, and the case of most of your kind, is your inexplicable need to sympathize with murderers like Samir Quantar and Seyf-al-Islam. You appear wholey unable to differentiate the good guys from the bad guys. Oh wait - we are always the bad guys. Like I said, pretty simplistic.

[Flatbutt1]

I for one think that the kids are innocents, especially if they are to young to really understand whats going on. The terrorists are obviously using these kids for propaganda. I am sorry for their deaths, truly, but I have a hard time holding our soldiers responsible for them.

[nostatic]

Most of the Afghans despise Al Queda and do not want them to return to power. Odds are these kids are innocent collateral damage, and not bin ladens in training. To dismiss them as "future terrorists" is mean-spirited and rather clueless.

[Jeff Higgins]

That may very well hold true for other kids in Afganistan. The ones in such close proximity to bona-fide terrorists? Doubt it. And we are not bombing "most" Afgans. If they truly despise Al Queda, if they truly do not want them to return to power, then "most" Afgans need to do a better job of dealing with their "minority". Or at least stay the hell out of our way when we are doing it for them.

[nostatic]

Well Jeff, maybe you should go over there and help them out with that.

Have you ever been? Do you know the living conditions and socioeconomic issues? A friend of mine has spent a fair amount of time over there working to create a film school and empower moderate voices. It is a rather devastated place with huge immigrant population due to conflicts in neighboring regions.

You accused others of "simple" thinking, but you're making pretty simplistic judgements and suggestions.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Pffft. It's their own fault, the little bastards. If they spent more time outside playing rather than getting fat sitting in front of a PlayStation gorging themselves on gummyworms and hot pockets sloshed down with Mt. Dew or primping their Barbie dream houses or taking care of their online pets, this never would have happened.

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by Racerbvd
7 less future terrorist, and the problem is??

Ya sleep with dogs and often you wake up with fleas.

Not that the kids are involved with the terrorists, but if they are around them, bet that their parents are either a terrorist or harboring a terrorist.

Do not ever want to see a kid get harmed but the terrorists caused this, not us...