Strange turn of events...

[lendaddy]

Originally Posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts

It is my opinion that George Bush honestly believes / believed in what he was doing and at the time thought it was the right thing to do. I do not think he lied or fooled the American people into following him - I believe he was probably misled by his own advisors and their own personal agendas. In fact, I think that GW's religious background and philosophy has hurt him in this Iraw conflict - I think that he is trying to be "the good Christian", when what is needed is probably a mean son-of-a-B when dealing with Middle Eastern cultures. I think GW is completely incompetant, but not evil-hearted at all. Just terribly misguided and not a very good leader of anything. With the electrion process now, and looking back 4 and 8 years, it's hard to believe that he actually got elected. Just goes to show what wet blankets Gore and Kerry were. At least this time around, the candidates seem to have some fire and substance to them.

-Wayne

I probably give him a touch more intellectual credit than you but otherwise I agree entirely.

[WI wide body]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

WI, is there any other topic you can talk about? Is playing gotcha with those who hate Bush less than you do all you have? No one is gonna change your mind and no one but you can cure your BDS. I know I'm only feeding the troll by responding, but seriously....we hashed out all the am too - am not, Bush is Satan stuff years before you came here.

Rick, I would ask why you resort to mindless bul***** when you have no logical or sensible response or point to make?

When I see something that is undeniably incorrect I will point it out. Even if it's just an opinion that's what this board is about. But guess what my slow witted friend ...there is a way to avoid that...don't post bull*****.

Also, you do not have a clue as to how I personally regard Bush. You do not even bother to try to find out. You simply use some dumbass and sophomoric reasoning to denigrate the messenger when you cannot actually fault the message.

Grow up. If you have something to say...say it. If you are so Bush biased that you don't have anything to say but you simply can't stand the truth...why not just shut up and let those speak who do have logical or decent reasons to defend Bush. Because you obviously can not.

[911nut]

Originally Posted by WI wide body

So you ARE saying that President Bush did indeed lie when he gave us his reasons for requesting the authorization from Congress to take action?

Essentially, yes.
When the data coming from the CIA would not support the reasons the administration wanted to justify an invasion, CIA Director George Tenant had a report cooked up to give Bush what he wanted.
When the scam was uncovered, Tenant had to fall on his sword.
Just to show you how screwed up our politics are, we impeached Clinton for receiving a BJ while Bush was allowed to squander thousands of lives and billions of dollars and no one has said a peep.
Meanwhile, on the home front, GW thumbs his nose and the domestic auto industry because in his opinion they don't build "relevant" products. The housing industry collapses, energy prices skyrocket (did I mention he was from the No.1 oil state) and he genuinely doesn't understand why his approval rating is resting on the bottom of the ocean. After all, he's keeping us "safe".

[lendaddy]

Originally Posted by WI wide body

If not oil, then what do you think are the "factors" that caused President Bush to stay in Iraq after the WMD's were proved false and Saddam and his regime were toppled?

That is when it began to make no sense. We accomplished all of the goals given by Team Bush and then for whatever "factor" we stayed and it has cost us at least 24,000 additional casualties and hundreds of billions of dollars with no end yet in sight.

WHY???

The belief that freedom and capitalism can spread in the region and thus save the world from an impending WW started in the middle east over religious BS. Leaving the country a sitting duck for Iran would have been crazy given our interests.

If it is for oil, when do we get that ****? Damn it's been years man! Why ain't we dippin' that honey pot?

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by WI wide body

Rick, I would ask why you resort to mindless bul***** when you have no logical or sensible response or point to make?

When I see something that is undeniably incorrect I will point it out. Even if it's just an opinion that's what this board is about. But guess what my slow witted friend ...there is a way to avoid that...don't post bull*****.

Also, you do not have a clue as to how I personally regard Bush. You do not even bother to try to find out. You simply use some dumbass and sophomoric reasoning to denigrate the messenger when you cannot actually fault the message.

Grow up. If you have something to say...say it. If you are so Bush biased that you don't have anything to say but you simply can't stand the truth...why not just shut up and let those speak who do have logical or decent reasons to defend Bush. Because you obviously can not.

Man, that really stung. If you did some searching, you'd see there are more Bush-bashing/Iraq threads here than your total post count. Seeing your thread titles is starting to look a lot like some 911 noob asking for advice on which oil to use. We've all BTDT.

[WI wide body]

Originally Posted by lendaddy

Actually I never mentioned terrorism, are you sure you read my post? I did not say we invaded solely because of UN resolutions, only that those resolutions presented us a crossroads. Again, did you read my post?

Now that's interesting since "the UN bull****" started 8-10 years before Bush took office. You really have to keep up on this stuff if you're going to try to get smarmy about it.

Again, I said nothing about Iraq having any involvement in 9/11 whatsoever. I enjoy a spirited discussion as much as the next guy but if you're not even going to pay attention and just make **** up I'd rather watch the Orange Bowl.

Okay, let's take a closer look:

I realize that I actually mentioned "terrorism" and you did not. But previously you typed "We invaded Iraq because we made the very bold and IMHO proper statement after 9/11 that the US was done fukcing around when it came to our national security." What were you talking about if it was not terrorism?

You say here "Now that's interesting since "the UN bull****" started 8-10 years before Bush took office. You really have to keep up on this stuff if you're going to try to get smarmy about it." Nothing smarmy about it. That was my point. Bush simply used the UN resolutions as ONE of the many excuses to invade Iraq. Please try to keep up to speed.

You say here "I said nothing about Iraq having any involvement in 9/11 whatsoever." But previously you typed "It always amazes me how quickly everyone forgets what Iraq was even about." So that is why I mentioned the Iraq and 9/11 connection that Bush did in fact make. What confuses you about that?

You also previously typed "We were lost after 9/11 wondering how we got to a point that this could happen..." . So would "this" not be a terrorist act?

Maybe you are watching the Orange Bowl too close. (I did that earlier when watching the Iowa caucuses on TV and duplicated a post!)

[fintstone]

Don't feed the troll.

[lendaddy]

If you're going to page one of the nutball playbook with "Bush blamed 9/11 on Iraq" then I'm done. You win, whatever I've got more important things to do than fight that battle. You and I just don't work in a debate and I'm cool with that.

Maybe another day, good night.

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by fintstone

Don't feed the troll.

I'm only doing so to keep my wife off the computer while I download Asian porn. Will be done in a few more minutes.

[WI wide body]

Originally Posted by lendaddy

I probably give him a touch more intellectual credit than you but otherwise I agree entirely.

That's where I might disagree Wayne.

I do not think that Bush is a bad, immoral, or evil person. I do think that he is incredibly stupid. Note that I said stupid and not ignorant. An ignorant person usually has no knowledge or info on various subjects. Whereas a stupid person does have some bits of knowledge and info...but they simply cannot process it correctly and often come to incorrect conclusions.

That is George Bush in a nutshell...simply stupid.

This has caused him to do damage to our nation that will probably affect our great grand children...and not in a good way!

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by fintstone

Don't feed the troll.

True, I bet he has never ever spoken with anyone who has honorably served this country who has been there. If he had, he might have a clue,or get the crap beaten out of him. This started long before President Bush, and was done to show that the USA wouldn't be pushed around & take any crap, but liberals like him would rather that we don't defend our selvess (like liberals who get upset then a criminal is killed while committing a CRIME) and stick our heads up our ass like tthey do. Fuch no, my father didn't raise me to be a ******* puzzy & get pushed around!! notice how when it comes to election time, board fill with new liberals to try & pass off their excrement It isn't just the Porsche boards either, I have noticed this on the cycling boards too. These are just posers who can't think for them selves and no one would befriend, so they hit the web boards!!!

[WI wide body]

Originally Posted by fintstone

Don't feed the troll.

You remain a dip***** sciolist who seems to hope to reach orgasm by use of a word that obviously fascinates you.

Try making a logical point. That works for some intellectuals.

[WI wide body]

Originally Posted by Racerbvd

True, I bet he has never ever spoken with anyone who has honorably served this country who has been there. If he had, he might have a clue,or get the crap beaten out of him. This started long before President Bush, and was done to show that the USA wouldn't be pushed around & take any crap, but liberals like him would rather that we don't defend our selvess (like liberals who get upset then a criminal is killed while committing a CRIME) and stick our heads up our ass like tthey do. Fuch no, my father didn't raise me to be a ******* puzzy & get pushed around!! notice how when it comes to election time, board fill with new liberals to try & pass off their excrement It isn't just the Porsche boards either, I have noticed this on the cycling boards too. These are just posers who can't think for them selves and no one would befriend, so they hit the web boards!!!

You would lose that bet my friend. You appear to be another dip***** who makes stupid and incorrect assumptions. I had two uncles who actually fought (as opposed to the chickenhawks who advocate war but never for themselves) in WW Two. One in France and Germany and the other at Iwo Jima and Guada Canal. You might be able to figure out which one was a Marine. My older brother was in Korea and later in the Honor Guard (you probably don't even know what that is) in Washinton, DC for over a year. I was in the Navy but never had any actual combat. So what is your "battle" experience tough guy? Or was how your dad "raised" you the extent of it?

For a short time my buddy and I ran a tavern in a factory district and I probably saw more big talking but chicken***** guys than you can even imagine. (or...maybe you can relate to them) They were often white collar jerks who were out of their element and not smart enough to realize it. They would run off the mouth until push came to shove and then they would look behind the bar for help. My buddy would often say "fuch'em...let'em sweat for a while" before stepping in. That ever happen to you? Or was your dad talking to you about it the extent of it?

People who truly "can't think for themselves" are dummies who go to the cliche crap like "liberals...left" for whoever doesn't fit their agenda. These are the same people who often stick their "heads up (their) ass" because of an inability to think for themselves so they pick a political party and back it regardless of facts. Let me give you a clue: anyone who actually believes that either political party...or that the "left" or the "right" is far better than the other is either clinically naive or incredibly stupid. So how do you plead?

[WI wide body]

Originally Posted by lendaddy

If you're going to page one of the nutball playbook with "Bush blamed 9/11 on Iraq" then I'm done. You win, whatever I've got more important things to do than fight that battle. You and I just don't work in a debate and I'm cool with that.

Maybe another day, good night.

Well, you are wise not to fight a battle that per the facts you can not win. No one said that "Bush blamed 9/11 on Iraq." The point was that Bush tied and associated 9/11 with Iraq to get support for his stupid invasion of Iraq.

Or do you think that when he mentioned "9/11" and "Iraq" 23 times in a speech prior to our invasion it was simply a strange and unexplainable coincidence? Hmmm...................

[Moneyguy1]

Wayne and len...

I respectfully think you give the president far too much credit for being an intellectual. Stubborn and unswayable, yes. And those are not always positive qualities.

No bashing, just an observation of my own.

[WI wide body]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

Man, that really stung. If you did some searching, you'd see there are more Bush-bashing/Iraq threads here than your total post count. Seeing your thread titles is starting to look a lot like some 911 noob asking for advice on which oil to use. We've all BTDT.

Rick, wake up. There are probably at least twice as many people on this board who either consider themselves anti-left/liberal (even if they can't define it) or anti-Dem or Bush supporters regardless of what he might actually do.

As for total posts...your 10K plus should about equal what I'm talking about!