All Evolutionists, go see the movie "Expelled"

[Rodsrsr]

Originally Posted by nostatic

Of course it isn't my business. You don't know what you're talking about when it comes to science. Res ipsa loquitur.

You also seem to be challenged with the English language. I never said any of the things you keep attributing to me.
I think I have a fairly good command of the English language.

If you do not have scientific training, I fail to see how you can make cogent, informed arguments on how evolution is "wrong". You are trying to dismiss a couple hundred years of peer-reviewed work that is currently accepted by 99.9+% of the scientists in the world. You better have some serious firepower to back that up.

Maybe when discussing microevolution but this is clearly not the case with Macreoevolution.

If you believe in ID, that is fine. I have no problem with that. But at least be intellectually honest and admit that it is based in *belief*, not in science.

Per your own admission you believe in a higher power, although you are being deliberately nebulous with your description of your belief.

[Rodsrsr]

Originally Posted by nostatic
Of course it isn't my business. You don't know what you're talking about when it comes to science. Res ipsa loquitur.

You also seem to be challenged with the English language. I never said any of the things you keep attributing to me.
I think I have a fairly good command of the English language.If you do not have scientific training, I fail to see how you can make cogent, informed arguments on how evolution is "wrong". You are trying to dismiss a couple hundred years of peer-reviewed work that is currently accepted by 99.9+% of the scientists in the world. You better have some serious firepower to back that up.

Maybe when discussing microevolution but this is clearly not the case with Macreoevolution.
If you believe in ID, that is fine. I have no problem with that. But at least be intellectually honest and admit that it is based in *belief*, not in science.

Per your own admission you believe in a higher power, although you are being deliberately nebulous with your description of your

Let me clarify.

[Rodsrsr]

Originally Posted by nostatic

Of course it isn't my business. You don't know what you're talking about when it comes to science. Res ipsa loquitur.

You also seem to be challenged with the English language. I never said any of the things you keep attributing to me.

If you do not have scientific training, I fail to see how you can make cogent, informed arguments on how evolution is "wrong". You are trying to dismiss a couple hundred years of peer-reviewed work that is currently accepted by 99.9+% of the scientists in the world. You better have some serious firepower to back that up.

If you believe in ID, that is fine. I have no problem with that. But at least be intellectually honest and admit that it is based in *belief*, not in science.

I will put it to you this way. We know that changes in species are brought about through natural selection by a decrease in genetic information. When science can explain exactly where the new genetic information comes form to design a wing lets say, along with hollow bones and a different respiratory system, than you may have something. So I'll make this really simple. Take a land creature, that according to you grew wings and started flying. Where did the genetic information come from to redesign the entire animal suitable for flight? With all the top scientists in this pelican forum this should be no problem.

[DaveE]

Seems to me if there is no immediate scientific answer available we should just credit one of the various Gods out there and move on........................................

[Rodsrsr]

Originally Posted by DaveE

Seems to me if there is no immediate scientific answer available we should just credit one of the various Gods out there and move on........................................

No, you should continue looking for the answer, which is what we do by the way and leave open the possibility that a designer may have had a hand in all this as a cause. Why would you assume that we would just stop because we believe in I.D. That would be like saying it just evolved so lets move on.

[DARISC]

[QUOTE=Rearden;3897883]What if I told you that you don't really exist../QUOTE]

You say I don't exist?
Well now you've got me pissed!
I'll turn you into mist!
'Cause I'm a solipsist!

[sjf911]

Originally Posted by Rodsrsr

I will put it to you this way. We know that changes in species are brought about through natural selection by a decrease in genetic information. When science can explain exactly where the new genetic information comes form to design a wing lets say, along with hollow bones and a different respiratory system, than you may have something. So I'll make this really simple. Take a land creature, that according to you grew wings and started flying. Where did the genetic information come from to redesign the entire animal suitable for flight? With all the top scientists in this pelican forum this should be no problem.

Another argument from ignorance and argument from incredulity.

You are correct, it is very easy and well documented. Take a look at the human genome some time and marvel at the 3+billion base pairs with less than 2% committed to true genes. Where did all of this "junk" come from and what does it do? How can we be so phenotypically different from chimpanzees and yet be almost genetically identical? This is the true story of evolution and cannot be summarized in a series of paragraphs. If you have even a shred of curiosity and intellectual honesty you should make an effort to learn about these things.
How can evolution occur if it means selectively decreasing information? Simple, the genome increases (lateral gene transfer, gene duplication, retro-viral insertion, parasitic DNA, etc.) faster than selection decreases it. Also, subtle changes in the developemental regulatory genes create enormous changes in phenotype without overall change in information content.

[Don Plumley]

I don't like to engage in these God vs. Science threads.

But when I hear the visceral, emotional denial of scientific principles when they are in conflict with a belief system, and recognize that they are not lone voices in the wind but representative of a very significant population, I am very, very worried about the future of our Country.

I like Ben Stein quite a bit - I read his column in the Sunday Times every weekend and think he is an Economic genius - articulate, sage and understandable. But as I learn more about his movie from the reviews, I am sadly disappointed.

[kstar]

Originally Posted by DARISC

You say I don't exist?
Well now you've got me pissed!
I'll turn you into mist!
'Cause I'm a solipsist!

Your on a roll today with your quatrains.

Best,

Kurt

[trekkor]

Originally Posted by Rearden

What if I told you that you don't really exist. The world as you know it is nothing more than a Playstation game being controlled by a 14 year old boy in the future. Prove me wrong.

If you were kidding, I'd laugh

If you were serious, I'd be concerned

If it were true, I'd be sad

So which is it?


KT

[Rearden]

Originally Posted by trekkor

If you were kidding, I'd laugh

If you were serious, I'd be concerned

If it were true, I'd be sad

So which is it?


KT

I proposed to you that the "intelligent designer" is a kid in the future playing a videogame and that everything you experience is a result. Like other intelligent design proposals, you just have to take my word for it that it is true. Or not.

[DARISC]

Originally Posted by kstarnes

Your on a roll today with your quatrains.

Best,

Kurt

Quatrains to try to mitigate the pain
from disregard for scientific fact
in groundless gushings, all of them in vein.
I wish together they would get their act!

Oh... my head's hurting worser and worser .

[trekkor]

Originally Posted by Rearden

...kid in the future playing a videogame

Wow! Video game content has really slipped.

Bunch of fat dudes typing on keyboards into the night. sounds like a real hoot!

KT

[Rearden]

Originally Posted by trekkor

Wow! Video game content has really slipped.

Bunch of fat dudes typing on keyboards into the night. sounds like a real hoot!

KT

Why do you presume to limit the workings of the creator when it is beyond us to comprehend? They are from a place of 'time indefinite'.

[trekkor]

Hmmm. green.


KT

[Rearden]

Originally Posted by Moses

Consider this simple example;

If we want to examine the effects of change in a human population, it would take a long time as our generation time averages more than 20 years. So let's look at a healthy strain of unmolested E. Coli with a generation time of less than 30 minutes. We can study genetic changes that occur over 50 generations in a single day!

We'll start with a population of a few billion bacterium. We'll add a stress to our healthy population, say, Penicillin. The Penicillin kills 99.999% of our population, but after a few days, the colony is as robust as ever! When we sequence the DNA of our new population and compare it to the original, the new bacteria all share a series of mutations that allow penicillin resistance. If we do this experiment 100 times, we get similar results, but the mutations are generally different.

The point is that the genetic strategy a population uses in order to survive is random. You can't apply any type of environmental stress to a lizard and expect to get a bird. Evolution is non-directional and not likely to be genetically repeatable.
The idea than man evolved from apes is a theory, but genetic evolution is a demonstrable fact.

Experiments such as this are commonplace in modern-day high schools. High school kids today even conduct basic genetic engineering experiments. For you old timers, sign up for a biology lab at your local community college and give it a go. What seems perplexing to you now will become more clear.

[IROC]

Originally Posted by Rodsrsr

Your own top atheist Richard Dawkins admits that he believe intelligent Design probably initiated the entire process with evolution taking over. The difference is that your spokesman believes that aliens "seeded" the planet billions of years ago and they were the intelligent design.

Actually, you missed his point entirely with the "seeded" planet thing. He does not believe it to be true, he was trying to throw you a bone.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-dawkins18apr18,0,2798612.story

[Milu]

Originally Posted by IROC

Actually, you missed his point entirely with the "seeded" planet thing. He does not believe it to be true, he was trying to throw you a bone.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-dawkins18apr18,0,2798612.story

Already covered earlier in this thread. Rodsrsr has a method with replies, he reads them very selectively, ignores anything that he doesn't like and then puts words in posters mouths in his response. Very sad, Rodsrsr seems to think he is making valid and well thought out points.

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa

Why?

yeah, you die either way

[Rodsrsr]

Originally Posted by Milu

Already covered earlier in this thread. Rodsrsr has a method with replies, he reads them very selectively, ignores anything that he doesn't like and then puts words in posters mouths in his response. Very sad, Rodsrsr seems to think he is making valid and well thought out points.

Yeah sure, and Hillary was throwing us a bone when she said she ducked sniper fire. Nice try to spin what you regret that you said! Milu, don't be so gullible.