"Freeways" ain't gonna' be free no more. . .

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Can Kalifornia possibly profiteer any more off of their own failures to allocate the taxpayer money correctly the first 20 or 30 times around?

I'm SO getting sick of this kind of crap from this state. . .

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http://www.whittierdailynews.com/ci_9048038

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Toll lanes proposed for local freeways
By Fred Ortega, Staff Writer
Article Launched: 04/24/2008 10:53:59 PM PDT

LOS ANGELES - San Gabriel Valley motorists are close to trading in their carpool lanes for toll roads under a pioneering deal between local and federal transportation officials.

The Metro board approved an agreement with the federal Department of Transportation on Thursday to bring so-called "congestion pricing" to the Southland.

Under the arrangement, Metro would receive nearly $214 million from the feds to convert portions of carpool lanes along the Foothill (210) and San Bernardino (10) freeways into specialized toll lanes, a Metro spokesman said.

It is still unclear how tolls would be collected or how much drivers will have to pay under the program, which still needs approval from the state Legislature and the California Transportation Commission.

"It would be based on the time of day, so peak driving hours" would cost more, said Metro spokesman David Sotero.

Sotero said Metro officials still must determine whether vehicles with a certain number of passengers would ride for free - or whether they would simply be charged less under the plan.

"There is also some discussion about probably allowing solo drivers to use the toll roads while paying the most amount for the privilege," Sotero said.

Metro needs to get legal authority from the Legislature and CTC by October in order to access the federal funds, and the lanes must be operational by Dec. 31, 2010, Sotero said.

Once the money comes through, Metro will buy a fleet of buses to ply the toll roads - with the rest of the funds going toward setting up the toll ways along the 210 between the Long Beach (710) and San Gabriel River (605) freeways and on the 10 Freeway from downtown to the El Monte Bus Depot.

Any remaining money would be used to establish a toll road along the 110 Freeway, Sotero said.

But opposition was already mounting to the idea of charging drivers to use Southland freeways.

"We are not going to support any kind of toll service in our area - that's an outrage," said Baldwin Park Mayor Manuel Lozano, who accused the Metro Board of sneaking the measure past local stakeholders.

"They should have sent a letter to each and every one of us, so that we could have our opinion represented," Lozano said. "Toll roads along the 10 - that's crazy. It might work in Orange County, but not out here with all the congestion."

Staff Writer Tania Chatila contributed to this story.

fred.ortega@sgvn.com

(626) 578-6300, Ext. 4444

[mikester]

They have been talking about this for a while; primarily through the down town corridors.

I think it's lame; Europeans do it but they have better public transport infrastructure than we do in LA. In LA people would simply be SOL and I am totally 100& against congestion pricing. It'll just make sure that rich people get where they are going. Screw the little people. If there was a good public transport infractructure in LA it wouldn't be a problem and this likely wouldn't be needed.

a$$hats the lot of them...

[Hugh R]

The only good thing about it is that I doubt that they'll be able to exempt the poor, or the illegals. Finally everyone will pay for what they use on a least on item. Oh BTW, I think it sucks too, but that is at least one bright side. Let the illegals get on the road at 3AM for free instead of clogging it up at 7AM when I'm on the road, if they don't want to pay.

[pwd72s]

Gee...what an amazing coincidence. The Orygun Governor is talking the same thing...

[madmmac]

They are bringing it up in Washington also.

[varmint]

they were having a fit about this on the radio today. the people who bought green cars will have to pay as well. and if the prius is no longer exempt, you can be sure they're going to start sticking it to motorcycles.

the government of california hates it's citizenry. they won't be satisfied till they driven us all out.

[pwd72s]

Originally Posted by madmmac

They are bringing it up in Washington also.

Kind of funny how these socialist/communist ideas spread from state to state, isn't it? Well folks, we vote these bozos in, don't we? Why don't we vote them out????

[Gogar]

They've had it here for a few years already on our main corridor carpool lane.

Not "congestion pricing", though. HOV lanes still operate as before, but if you're not HOV and would like to pay to use it, you have that option.

[the]

Originally Posted by pwd72s

Kind of funny how these socialist/communist ideas spread from state to state, isn't it? Well folks, we vote these bozos in, don't we? Why don't we vote them out????

Actually, isn't a "pay as you go" system LESS socialist/communist than the current "free for everyone" system?

[pwd72s]

Originally Posted by the

Actually, isn't a "pay as you go" system LESS socialist/communist than the current "free for everyone" system?

Nope...because it restricts citizen freedom of movement...one of the goals of many despots.

[the]

Not having a car restricts freedom of movement, too.

Would it be anti-socialism for the govt to make sure everyone has a car, and give them one if they don't or can't afford it?

[varmint]

Actually, isn't a "pay as you go" system LESS socialist/communist than the current "free for everyone" system?

taxpayers already paid for these roads decades ago. and pay far out the ass for the insufficient maintenance. this is simply a power grab by green/pinko politicians who hate cars and want to drive us all onto buses they can control.

[pwd72s]

Originally Posted by the

Not having a car restricts freedom of movement, too.

Would it be anti-socialism for the govt to make sure everyone has a car, and give them one if they don't or can't afford it?

Sure does...not having a car restricts movement. But, based on the cost of Portland, Oregon's "light rail"? You could have bought everybody in the metro area a compact car, could have fueled it and paid car insurance for at least a decade.

Restriction of movement? Communism/Socialism...pure and simple...the government, through pricing, telling the people where and when they travel...

[the]

Originally Posted by varmint

Actually, isn't a "pay as you go" system LESS socialist/communist than the current "free for everyone" system?

taxpayers already paid for these roads decades ago. and pay far out the ass for the insufficient maintenance. this is simply a power grab by green/pinko politicians who hate cars and want to drive us all onto buses they can control.

that's the correct answer.

[Wickd89]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

Can Kalifornia possibly profiteer any more off of their own failures to allocate the taxpayer money correctly the first 20 or 30 times around?

I'm SO getting sick of this kind of crap from this state. . .

This state. Have you lived in other places?
The Northeast is nearly 50% toll!
It was so much worst over there in NJ, NY, PA, etc...
For example two North-south roads in Jersey: Garden State Parkway or the Turnpike: BOTH TOLL ROADS, with booths.

I agree we have it good here, and it should not change, but it is not a state problem....

[KaptKaos]

This is all about raising taxes on people, no more, no less. There are budget shortfalls in nearly every state. That's what happens when they overspend.

In California, they want to fund all kinds of crap, but they can't raise taxes easily (various props and super majority requirements) so they look at adding "fees" which are essentially taxes.

The state government in California is so corrupt it's not funny. This is what happens when you have single party rule for so many years.

The fuchers in the state senate were due to be termed out, so they funded a blatantly false plebecite to change the term limits. That failed. Now the President of the State Senate is funding a recall of a Republican senator in hopes of getting him tossed out and replaced with a Democrat that will vote to raise taxes. California requires a 2/3 majority to raise taxes. If the Democrats take 2 more seats, they will be able to raise taxes at will.

Corruption.

[Evans, Marv]

I hate the fact that toll roads are (will be) multiplying all over the state. We already pay road tax on every gallon of gas we buy, but the state government won't use for what it's supposed to be used for.
In the area south of San Diego, a toll road just opened. I refuse to use it. It costs $2.50 to go five miles on it - 50 cents a mile !!! The old route people used to use to get to the highway the toll road leads to is now less congested and it takes five minutes longer to go that way compared to using the toll road. So it takes 5 minutes via the toll road and 10 minutes via the old way. I'll use the old way and let the rich people use the toll road.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

I don't have problems with toll roads provided:

1. They're built with private money
2. There are alternatives and the use of such toll roads is discretionary.

The infuriating part about this is that we ALREADY paid for these "free"ways many times over. Our taxes paid to conceive, design and build them many years ago. People's homes and businesses were seized by eminent domain to build them. Our registrations and gasoline taxes (highest in the nation) pay to maintain them.

Why the f*ck do we need to pay for them AGAIN?

This is nothing more than another shining example of the government's colossal FAILURE to do something correctly the first time (plan, design, execute and maintain infrastructure) and then to turn around and penalize the citizens for their own stupidity, short-sightedness, incompetence and ineptitude.

The brilliant "traffic planners" of this state (the same morons that brought us such innovations as the on-ramp traffic lights which do nothing but delay merging traffic and force vehicles to burn more fuel by accelerating from a stop rather than a roll, the red-light camera, the ridiculously-low speed limits in certain areas, etc.) are the ones who FAILED to design the freeway infrastructure for current/future intended needs. Furthermore, the local and state governments have allowed southern California to be utterly destroyed by overdevelopment and overpopulation. Did they not realize that with huge development/population increases there needs to be huge infrastructure to support it? They clamor to get business/development in their communities (because it increases the tax base), then go "oh *****" when they realize it actually costs more $$$ to support those folks being there and the "extra tax revenue" isn't just a windfall, but actually is needed to offset the loads placed by those people on the infrastructure system.

So what do these geniuses do as a solution? Levy another tax. Brilliant!

I honestly think we're getting to a point where the policymakers need to be rounded up and either driven out on a rail, or publicly shot. I don't care which.

I've lived in Massachusetts, Florida, Illinois, Oregon and California in my days for extended periods of time. I've never been made to feel so much like my government truly hates me, wants to attack/control/rob me as much as I do here in Kalifornia. I simply can't believe the citizens of this state have let it get to this point, where our own government (who supposedly "represents our interests") is our biggest threat and the biggest enemy to our freedom and happiness. If a magnitude 9.0 earthquake wiped Sacramento off the map tomorrow, I'd lament the loss of a few beautiful buildings and the innocent people affected, but I wouldn't miss the loss of our government for one second. It'd probably be the best thing that could happen to this state. I'm THAT fed up with this kind of endless stupidity oozing out of "our" halls of government.

Un-freekin-real.

I can't seriously believe I'm considering opening a business in this state. I seriously need to consider the alternatives (AZ, NV, NM, TX come to mind).

[Aerkuld]

Genius!
Now you're going to pay tax on your vehicle when you buy it, pay tax every year to use it on the road, AND pay an additional amount to use a public road that you pay taxes to have built and maintained.
Maybe they won't need to issue so many speeding tickets now?

[djmcmath]

Meanwhile, has anyone seen the advertising from California on how great of a place it is to live? Am I the only one who thinks it's a cry for help? It's like this tragic desperate plea, "Move to California!! Please!!"

Weird.