Re-Sell on a mod'd M Coupe (Z3)? or bad move

[Blk95993]

Found a well prep'd 99' M Coupe with a welded in cage, coil-overs, A/C Delete, gutted, big brakes, light weight fly wheel, M5 clutch, E30 M3 Rear End (short gears w/ LSD), racing seats, tons of wheels and tires. Car is fern green and has 61k. Weighs in at a little over 2800 lbs with a full tank of gas.

I have owned 911's for track events and really never consider anything else; however, this car has caught my attention at the moment. Seems like it would be an absolute blast on the track or for auto x.

My biggest concern is re-sell. Couple of items that I am pondering...The owner does not have the original interior, nor any of the A/C components. Think it will be easy to sell down the line, or will I be stuck with a "bastard" car that really doesn't have a place in the market?

I'm pretty much sitting on a fence and need to generate some pro's and con's to the situation to help me make my decision. I dont know much about BMW's. I am sure that there is someone on this board that knows a little about these cars. Always appreciate everyone's feedback and advice.

[89911]

Is this the one that looks like a shoe? If it is, these are neat cars. As far as price, that car has a very, very limited buyer. If I really wanted it, I would go as low as possible and then decide if you could live with it or sell it and not get beat up. I know for a fact my car has as much in it as I paid for it, but I would most likely get far less then the same car that had nothing done to it. That is why it's mine for the long haul. Doesn't mean that I can't get something in the future to go along with it.

[grudk]

I had an M-coupe and was very disappointed in it's track performance. Heavy, and pretty poor handling. It's a point and squirt car, without all that much squirt. Stick with the 911 (did I mention I blew two engines in the M-coupe within two months?)

[Blk95993]

This is the good stuff I am looking for...keep it comin....here is a picture of the car:

http://flickr.com/photos/9367581@N04/2390484727/

[tcar]

Re-sell?????

Are you talking about future RESALE value??? Maybe?

Have you driven it? Does it turn your crank? More than a 911?

For any possible resale vaue (to you), you better be getting it CHEAP. Resale sucks for a car like that. If you want it, make the guy selling it to you suck big time on resale.

[nostatic]

resale value? Try about none. Only a track rat. If you can get it cheap then it is worth it. Don't count on being able to get much of anything for it when it is time to sell. And how many of those 61K miles were track miles? Budget for serious engine/tranny work soon.

I love the cars though...one of my favorites.

[Gogar]

Yeah, I don't think "track car" and "resell" are supposed to be used in the same paragraph.

[Blk95993]

As described in my thread, yes future "resell"......couple years down the line. Seems like there is only a limited amount of buyers out there that would be interested in this car. Enough said. My mind is made up, doesn't seem like it will be a good project to take on.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Buy it to keep, or buy it cheap. You eliminate 99% of potential buyers with a car like that. Awesome cars though, I'd love to have an S54 M-coupe.

[widebody911]

As someone who is trying to sell a track car believe me: you could probably fit all the potential buyers in the car.

It looks like a nice car, but it's gutted and still weighs 2800lbs?

[Blk95993]

Per the seller, 2800 with a full tank of gas.. I offered him $16.5k with all the extra spares wheels and parts. He is asking $20k. Based off everyone's feedback, what do you guys think its worth, assuming that I am still on the fence...

[nostatic]

You could probably find a stock one for $20K or less, and that would have some resale value.

Just depends what you want and where you run. Are you racing or just doing track days? If it is open track days that car would be a hoot, but you have to make sure it was built properly and as I stated before, I'd be worried about engine and tranny bills in the near future.

If you're racing then you need to figure out what class you'd be in and whether or not you want to run there.

[Blk95993]

I am a wanna be racer...just do the DE's @ Road Atlanta when I can fit them in and an Auto X every so often. .....Wish I could race, just don't have the $$....

The weld in cage is a nice add on...these cars had issues with their sub frame, the 1/2 cage pretty much makes it a mute point.

The owner said that the car has been inspected with a good report. Clutch was replaced around 2k ago. Total of 6 DE events. No engine mods what so ever. The owner replaced the rear end to help with acceleration. 3.73 instead of the stock 4.10. Apparently the get up and go is quick....

Here is a list of the mods from the ad:

1999 Boston Green ///M Coupe:
* Gutted with working windows, wipers, and fan
* Fall-Line Motorsports Weld-In Back Half Cage
* H&R Coilovers w/ TC Kline Springs
* Dinan Strut Brace
* Sparco Speed Seats
* MOMO wheel, 3.73 Diff.
* UUC Trans Mounts
* Ireland Engineering Sub Mounts
* Rogue Engineering Rear Shock Mounts
* ECIS Intake
* AP Racing 4-Pot Brakes
* KVR Hats and Rotors
* Custom S54 Oil Cooler Housing
* SuperTrapp Exhaust
* Fan Delete
* UUC Pulley Set
* UUC Lightweight Flywheel (less than 1000 miles)
* M5 Clutch (less than 1000 miles)
* 2710 lbs (full tank of gas)
* BBS RC's 18x8.5 Front 18x10 Rears

Extras:
* M50 Manifold (not installed yet)
* Stock Roadstars with Toyo RA-1's
* 4 x VictoRacer's (unmounted and used for less than 100 miles)
* Enkei NT-03's with Michelin Pilot Sport Cups
* Tons of odds and ends, etc.

Mileage: 61,000

[nostatic]

Does it have 5/6/7 point harnesses and proper race seats? Does it have a fire suppression system?

I hate to see cars that have tons of performance mods without proper safety stuff.

And is it a full cage or a glorified roll bar? Is it a production piece or a one-off from a fab shop?

Find out what it costs to do a top-end rebuild and a tranny rebuild. Odds are you'll end up having to do the tranny before the engine, but tracks eat trannies...

[serge944]

Originally Posted by grudk

I had an M-coupe and was very disappointed in it's track performance. Heavy, and pretty poor handling. It's a point and squirt car, without all that much squirt. Stick with the 911 (did I mention I blew two engines in the M-coupe within two months?)

You are an exception. The s50/52/54 engines are VERY good. The cars do handle well once properly setup. The stock suspension on those cars isn't ideal making the car a bit squirrelly at the limit. 911 owners know nothing of this though.

The suspension of these cars has the basic e30 layout; which, while being a bit old school is very capable (think e30 m3).

Since the m coupe you are looking at is a 1999, it has the s52 240hp engine. I wouldn't pay 20k for one of those...

Hold off for a 2001/2002 with the s54 (315hp). These actually have very good resale. Until just recently, they held their value better than ANY other modern BMW I know of. They are quite exclusive for a bimmer.

[Blk95993]

It is a fab up'd one off cage and is a glorified roll bar. Cost is 1k more to get it to a full cage. 5 point harness, no fire suppression.

Car has 6 DE events with 61k on the clock. These engines can last for 200k+. One of BMW's more bullet proof engines.

I offered $16k and he is thinking it over....Based on everyone's feedback, perhaps $14k is more realistic? Kind of hard to put a number on this car. Im just throwing darts in the dark.

[Blk95993]

Thanks for the post Wayne, I will check with Paul Krammer. Maybe a BMW M3 E46, 2001-02 model be a better buy? I am assuming it has a more advanced suspension lay out vs the E30 suspension borrowed for the M Coupe?

[strupgolf]

Looking at a few of these myself, not modded, but stock. I would say after seeing others that miles, condition, race stuff would bring the car down to about 13-14K. But its whatever floats your boat.

[nostatic]

in the end you'll likely end up spending a ton of money so it really doesn't matter a few $K up front for the purchase price. If you like it, then get it. There aren't many around and if you bought a stock one, how much would you spend in doing the track prep?

I doubt you'll get 200K miles out of the engine/tranny if you track it regularly...

[aigel]

Originally Posted by Blk95993

The owner replaced the rear end to help with acceleration. 3.73 instead of the stock 4.10. Apparently the get up and go is quick....

That does not make sense. The 4.10 would help it out of the hole much better. Generally people go to (numerically) higher gears for autocross and track driving.

You can get a very nice prepped 911 for 16.5k that will fetch a good price down the road. The 911 at least has something called RS interior, which makes it look decent.

I would say "go for it" if this were a sporty commuter and if it wasn't gutted with all the removed parts thrown in the garbage.

Anyway, by now I am probably preaching to the choir ...

Good Luck!!!

George