Atlas Shrugged, anyone?

[CJFusco]

Hmmm interesting points. To be honest, economics is one area of politics/government of which I have next to no knowledge nor understanding. It's an area that simply did not get absorbed in H.S. (although I was a very good student), and has flown over my head ever since. We all have our areas of weakness, I suppose...

Fine, I'll add the book to my reading list, after about a dozen others!

[Rearden]

To echo what Moses and others have said, the financial industry is perhaps the most regulated/meddled with (Federal Reserve, FDIC, Fannie, Freddie, SEC) and politicized (housing policy, HUD, Community Reinvestment Act, etc) industry in the US economy.

Check out this video, as recommended in another thread:
http://www.aynrand.org/site/PageServer?pagename=reg_ls_financial_crisis

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by CJFusco

Hmmm interesting points. To be honest, economics is one area of politics/government of which I have next to no knowledge nor understanding. It's an area that simply did not get absorbed in H.S. (although I was a very good student), and has flown over my head ever since.

CJ,

Unfortunately, your lack of knowledge of economics is rife today...which is really too bad. The adage, "follow the money" is more important today than ever but the general public malaise surrounding the various stimuli(ous) packages is astounding.

No offense, but the folks spending your tax dollars count on your apathy. It is up to you.

[MichiganMat]

Originally Posted by Moses

The EXACT opposite is true. In a free market, no bank would dare make sub-prime loans to folks who couldn't afford them. Congress used Fannie and Freddie as a tool to allow poor people home ownership. Congress forced the relaxation in lending standards to pursue "equality" in housing. Without this government interference, Fannie and Freddie would never have failed.

So fly-by-night mortgage companies were forced to give out NINJA loans?

NINJA = (No Income, No Job, No Assets)

Thats not what I've heard. Some loan officers were making as much as $30K a week approving loans to anyone and everyone they could put into a house. Sounds pretty unregulated free-market to me.

[Moses]

Originally Posted by MichiganMat

So fly-by-night mortgage companies were forced to give out NINJA loans?

NINJA = (No Income, No Job, No Assets)

The answer is a resounding YES! Fannie and Freddie were financing more than half the mortgages in our country and congress relaxed the lending rules.


Remember ACORN? They SUED Citicorp for not making "NINJA" loans.

[Chuck Moreland]

Mat, consider that no lender left to make decisions on their own would ever give out a NINJA loan. Out of pure self-interest, the risk of default is too great.

Instead the gov interferred, and created an environment that seperated and hid the risk of default, and forced / encouraged risky mortgages.

This video is an Excellent overview of what has happened.
http://www.aynrand.org/site/PageServer?pagename=reg_ls_financial_crisis

It is lengthy, but well, well worth taking the time to watch.

[varmint]

ran with a girl in school. if you took her copy of the fountainhead, and laid it on it's spine it would just fall open to the "fireplace" scene. so naturally i became an objectivist.

one of the more prescient thngs in atlas shrugged was her description of various business leaders collaborating with the government. they will sacrifice principle for a momentary advantage. got to keep an eye on people like that.

[CJFusco]

^ And what exactly happens in the "fireplace scene," pray tell?

[VaSteve]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

I'm about halfway through it right now - it's eerily prophetic.

I'm waiting for the Obama administration to announce the "Equalization of Opportunity Act". It'd fit right in.

Same here. 1/2way through. Bought it based on the posts in PARF in January. Very interesting.

[the]

CJ, move Atlas up on your reading list. I'd love to hear your critique of it.

Fountainhead is ok, but it is not predictive like Atlas.

Whether you agree or disagree with the philosophy set forth in Atlas, you can't deny that what it said was going to happen to the US (and this is set forth in great detail) has happened, and is continuing to happen.

Many of the things being said by current politicians are almost verbatim out of speeches by politicians in the book.

[JonT]

I've read Atlas Shrugged 2x and on the 3rd. It is THE most amazing, thought-provoking, book I've ever read. It does seem drag on and on in some parts and Rand's writing style is not for everyone. You literally have to "plow" through some of it and re-read to understand. I would say it's more proof that things have not changed in the US political system in the past 50-60 years than being a prophetic story.

[legion]

I bought it on CD. Edward Herman reads it. I highly recommend it. It gives you more time to understand her concepts instead of just trying to parse her long sentences.

[strupgolf]

Well, I'll have to go and get a copy. So many views on this book, it has to be good.

[VaSteve]

Originally Posted by JonT

I've read Atlas Shrugged 2x and on the 3rd. It is THE most amazing, thought-provoking, book I've ever read. It does seem drag on and on in some parts and Rand's writing style is not for everyone. You literally have to "plow" through some of it and re-read to understand. .

That and the type is making me go blind. I read on the cover that she was born/grew up in Russia? Amazing command of English and nuances in her writing.

[gr8fl4porsche]

Picked up a copy today - too bad the print is so small I can barely read it!

[legion]

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw_7_6?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=atlas+shrugged+audio+cd&sprefix=Atlas+

[daepp]

I would say that your most impressionable years are as a young adult. Rand was attending university in Moscow during the Bolshevik rebellion. She fled to the US via family in Chicago IIRC. She worked, in of all places, in Hollywood as an editor of screenplays. I fail to follow/agree with to her atheistic logic, and her real life story was fairly sordid, but Atlas Shrugged remains a testament to her ability to predict what weak government etc types can do to capitalism!

[daepp]

From Chapter 10:

"Wesley Mouch, Top Co-ordinator of the Bureau of Economic Planning and National Resources, was issuing a great many statements, the content and purpose of which could not be defined, except that the word "emergency powers" and "unbalanced economy" kept appearing in the text every few lines"

Wow!

[Porsche-O-Phile]

It gets better. Keep reading.

[m21sniper]

If someone wants to lend me their copy i'd be happy to read it myself.