Cub Scouts, knives and guns

BertPage · 10-14-2009, 05:51 AM

Even though this has been reversed, the people responsible for this should be put in prison for life – no exception. The only way this will ever change is to teach them a lesson they won’t forget.
Dr. Tian Dayton: 6 Year Old Zachary Christie Sentenced to 45 Days in Reform School for Bringing Camping Knife to School ... to Eat Lunch With

Christmas 1959 in eastern North Carolina, one month from my 12th birthday, I got what I had desperately wanted since I was 5 or 6 - a double barrel shotgun. We had a good dog, Lady an English pointer and my father and I quail hunted every week during season.

That spring, needing a subject for a speech report at school, I decided on my new shotgun. My mother, a teacher, thought it would be a good idea an approved.

So when the day came I left home walking to school (across the street – not 5 miles and up hill both ways – this is a true story) with my shotgun under one arm and books in the other hand. The principal always was out front of the school every morning and saw me coming. He mentioned what a nice looking gun I had and asked if he could see it. I said sure and handed it to him. He asked if it was loaded and of course it wasn’t. I told him why I was bringing it to school and he said fine, handed it back to me and off I went. When I got to my room the teacher asked me to stand it up in the corner until time for my report. I gave the report and at the end of the day took my gun home. The principal again committed when I was leaving on what a nice gun. (it was a nice gun – a Fox 410 double with ejectors and rib vent). The End of what was and should have been a dull story.

The world has really changed and IMO not for the better in that regard.

Jeff Higgins · 10-14-2009, 06:02 AM

Hand-wringing ninnies such as those responsible for this kind of nonsense would like nothing more than to drag the rest of us down to their level of cowardice and fear. Boldness and self-sufficiency scare the bejeebers out of these folks, as does making any sort of decision for which they can be held responsible. They nip any demonstration of the former in the bud whenever possible, and they hide behind "zero tolerance" and other such "policies" as a shield, absolving themselves of the need to display any sort of judgement. The ones responsible for this need to be sued until they are living out of a shopping cart, under a bridge somewhere.

masraum · 10-14-2009, 06:03 AM

Wow, that's a really messed up story. I don't know about "prison for life", but I get what you're hinting at.

I just don't understand people these days.

berettafan · 06:19 AM

you might think the co-president of the PTA would be hip to the rules about bringing weapons to school.

the article is nauseating to read with all the 'aint he such a sweet kid' nonsense. take away all the coded messages screaming 'it's ok, he's just a good white kid, not some surly black or mexican kid' and this story changes in tone completely.

the boy did not, IMO, need a 45 day punt over to pre-jail. a LOT of damage is being done to this child by sending him there. a LOT. i mean he's 6 for pete's sake.

however, my son (4 at the time) told me (this was last year) about a kid on his bus who said he had a knife in his pocket. i immediately called the daycare and the school (pre-k) and they took it quite seriously. of course i didn't know anything about the kid in question and frankly didn't care if he was a boy scout or not. i was NOT cool with anyone, at any age, for any reason, bringing a knife to my sons school. and i make no apologies for that.

idiocy all around in this story. but damned if i ever want to hear about kids bringing knives to a school my son attends.

M.D. Holloway · 10-14-2009, 06:16 AM

I remember always bringing a pocket knife to school - most of the boys did. I never ever heard of any kid getting stabbed or even using it in a fight. When a fight was to happen, we always emptied our pockets and the trusted blade, bubble gum and loose change was held on to by a friend until afterwards. Seemed like someone got into a fight a few times a year - nothing big though. A few punches, a little rolling around in the dirt and tears. Done deal. I ask our Son if any fights occur at school, on the playground and he looks at me like I am insane. Maybe I am.

FWIW - a Cubscout (in this case a Tiger Cub) is not allowed to carry a pocket knife until they get their whittling chip award - easy to get. They learn basic knife safety, how to sharpen a blade proper as well as how to whittle and carve. Takes 30 minutes to do with a Scout. This Scouts mess tool had a blade which makes it a no-no. Again, FWIW.

m21sniper · 10-14-2009, 06:18 AM

I carried all through school, and still carry, a knife every where i go. To date no one has ever been harmed by any of my knives.

What kind of idiot is alarmed by a cub scout with a swiss army style knife?

deanp · 10-14-2009, 06:20 AM

Here's another from upstate NY. Eagle Scout, 17yrs old, completed Army basic training over the summer - keeps survival kit locked in car...

New York Eagle Scout Suspended From School for 20 Days for Keeping Pocketknife in Car - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News - FOXNews.com

URY914 · URY914's Garage

There was a story about a kid that drove a pick-up truck to school on Monday. Over the weekend the truck was used to move some house hold items. A butter knife was left in the bed of the truck. Knife on school grounds = suspended.

No one wants to be responsible for making decisions these days. Too many people will second guess your decision later on. So rules are made that are hard and fast with no room for discussion. One rule for everyone no matter what.

berettafan · 10-14-2009, 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m21sniper

What kind of idiot is alarmed by a cub scout with a swiss army style knife?

me if he's on the same bus or in the same school as my kids.

how do I know he's a good kid? how do I know his parent(s) aren't using cub scouts as a defacto reform school because he can't get his **** together and play nice with the neighbor kids?

dhoward · dhoward's Garage

Case resolved.
Delaware 1st grader has 45-day suspension lifted - Yahoo! News

Zero-tolerance removes any responsibility for the school district to make a decision.

Quote:

how do I know he's a good kid? how do I know his parent(s) aren't using cub scouts as a defacto reform school because he can't get his **** together and play nice with the neighbor kids?

You gotta be kiddin'

m21sniper · 10-14-2009, 06:27 AM

All my friends had knives when i was growing up. So did i. We were all cub scouts, none of us ever stabbed anyone.

But then, the country i grew up in is dead now, isn't it?

Zero tolerance= zero thought.

The Gaijin · 10-14-2009, 06:30 AM

This is where "zero tolerance" gets us. No room for any discretion, no room for any exceptions.

Along the same lines is kids getting in all kinds of trouble for having an aspirin at school.

dhoward · dhoward's Garage

[shrill]
"What if MY kid's on the bus with that unregulated aspirin? Then what? Huh? Jeeze, you guys have no consideration for other's safety... I ought to report you all..."
[/shrill]

berettafan · 10-14-2009, 06:53 AM

it's a ****ing knife Dan.

ignore all the 'feel good' bs about how this kid is the most pure human walking the planet and just focus on the fact that a kid brought a knife to a SCHOOL.

dhoward · dhoward's Garage

No.
Its THE SAME PRINCIPLE.
And you should be called out on it.

m21sniper · 10-14-2009, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by berettafan

it's a ****ing knife Dan.

ignore all the 'feel good' bs about how this kid is the most pure human walking the planet and just focus on the fact that a kid brought a knife to a SCHOOL.

So do you skitz out when your kid goes to some other kids house where there are kitchen knives? Do you insist the parent lock up all the knives first?

Boys and pocket knives go hand in hand. At least they do in my world.

The Gaijin · 10-14-2009, 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by berettafan

me if he's on the same bus or in the same school as my kids.

how do I know he's a good kid? how do I know his parent(s) aren't using cub scouts as a defacto reform school because he can't get his **** together and play nice with the neighbor kids?

So a school has a rule: no knives. Ok, fine.

But the problem is the mandatory suspension and the threat of real reform school.

Take the knife, send a reminder note home to the parents/guardians whatever. But to make a national media case out of it? Just ridiculous.

m21sniper · 07:46 AM

Maybe if we'd have let knives on planes 911 would have never happened. No way 4 guys with box cutters are taking on a plane full of passengers with pocket knives.

Just sayin'.

When we as a society cannot even trust cub scouts with small pocket knives we have TRULY lost our way.

M.D. Holloway · 10-14-2009, 07:48 AM

Prior to 9/11 I used to carry all sorts of knives on board - I give them to customers. Heck at any given time I would have a dozen 4 inch lockblades in my pack. Maybe these guys knew how to use a boxcutter but I would have tossed those lockblades about to some burly rednecks on that flight and a short knife fight would have ensued.

berettafan · 10-14-2009, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Gaijin

So a school has a rule: no knives. Ok, fine.

But the problem is the mandatory suspension and the threat of real reform school.

Take the knife, send a reminder note home to the parents/guardians whatever. But to make a national media case out of it? Just ridiculous.

i believe i was quite clear that i have a major problem with the proposed punishment.