I agree Vin, but that is not the same as no threat from wildlife.

http://i.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2009/SHO...r.mitchell.jpg
Taylor Mitchell, 19

A simple .380 auto with any decent ammunition would have saved this beautiful young girl who was killed by Coyotes in the past year.

http://articles.cnn.com/2009-10-29/entertainment/canada.singer.killed_1_coyotes-taylor-mitchell-canadian-folk-singer?_s=PM:SHOWBIZ

"Bird said hikers saw the coyotes attacking Mitchell and called 911"

If ANY of them had had a gun, this girl would still be alive today.

"Bird said the area where the attack occurred is popular and well traveled."

It can happen, and it can happen to you- whoever you may be.

Oh, I totally agree. Never said there was "no threat". I just worry more about running into some dirtbag, than the local fauna.

I don't care if it's a coyote, a scumbag or an alien invader that attacks me. If i can kill it with a 147gr+P FMJ flat nose 9mm, i'm going to try my best to do so. ;)

As an outsider to this discussion it always amazes me the contrast of opinions on gun ownership and carry practices in the US.
This subject always inflames passion and conviction.

You guys should consider yourselves very luck that you even have this problem.

Absolutely.

We are, unfortunately, surrounded by ready examples of those who have nothing left to argue about. Your country is one of those ready examples.

The most basic, intrinsic right of free men is to arm themselves. How the entire world's population outside of the United States have managed to give up this right to their respective governments is simply beyond me.

Jeff

Well said. It seems that we are little children that can not be trusted with firearms.
No carry for civilians... End of story. Only Cops Criminals and some Security Guards.

Also... If you get caught carrying a folding knife it's a $10,000 fine and/or two years in prison.

That's freaking insane.

Fortunately for us here in the US, our founding fathers were all "gun nuts" and rebels that believed "a man should be at all times armed."

i stopped reading this at page 2. YOU are a PATHETIC DORK!



"why do you need to carry in a national park?"



what a freeking joke?




i DONT GO ANYWHERE(thats ANYWHERE I CANT CARRY) EVAR.



why? because i can. LEGALLY CCW!



and because i have been shot at TWICE NOW in my 53 years and i really dont have to explain to ANYBODY with A FREEKING BRAIN what the hell its like to be SHOT AT!



and yeah because i am so insecure................thats why i BOUGHT ANOTHER SMITH AND WESSON 29-2 this weekend in NICKEL!



ya just cant go wrong EVAR with a .44 mag-numm!



over penetration is when YOU can hit the opposite side of the grande canon!!! LMFAO!



i think YOU SHOULD COUNT HOW MANY RANGERS ARE ON DUTY FOR THE ENTIRE GRANDE CANON PARK AT ANY GIVEN TIME and REALIZE HELP IS A DAMN LONG WAY AWAY!

I'm thankful for our rights and I spent 9 years in the military defending them, so I NEVER take them for granted.

One of the things I find particularly astonishing (and disheartening) about this whole situation is that the United States - that beacon of freedom and democracy - is seeking to impose the rest-of-the-world standard upon its citizens, rather than to export this freedom around the world.`

Polital leaders are the same everywhere. They despise a citizenry with rights that transcend their government's ability to regulate and impinge. Thank God our "founding fathers" recognized that universal trait of those who would govern, and took steps to mitigate it very early on. Even so, it is a constant battle to keep our public officials from stripping us of those rights. And not just guns rights, either.

The 2nd Amendment is there to protect the rest of them...

The dope growers will not appreciate stumbling on you. Even if out for a short walk.

During the LA riots I can't tell you how many converts to self defense approached me for ammunition. I tell you what, they needed it and it was against the law for me to provide it. I have had two occasions in my life where my preparation saved both me and others. It was not a pleasant experience and I still hate the thought of it, but we weren't lucky, we were prepared.

all NPS rangers are armed. you are thinking of Ranger-Naturalists, & etc.

i honestly cannot EVEN CONCEIVE going ANYWHERE in the wilderness without a spoon. it actually hurts my brain to think that way.


not only does it hurt my brain but my sphincter is slammed shut because of this BEYOND STOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO-PID THOUGHT!


.380-9mm-.38-.45 for your average STOOO-PID criminals on the street.



.357-.44 mag-.30-.30-.30 carbine-.308-12 ga-.338 win mag-.45/70 for really STOOO-PID criminals in the outback and errant pesky mtn lions/bears/velociraptors/teradactyls.



.22
.380
.38
9mm
.357
.44
.45
.30-.30
.30 carbine
.308
.338
.45/70




you really are going to play hell convincing me of any other rounds i need or want for anything!


well a 155mm howitzer would be nice, but ammo is very spendy! and they are a real PITA to tow around and nobody makes holsters for them.

SOME fears are irrational, yes, phobias for example. But fear is a perfectly legitimate response to danger. It has developed in people and animals over the eons as a survival tactic. It is one of the basic motivators of human behavior. There are perfectly good reasons to fear dangerous things.
What is not rational to take steps to defend yourself against something you don't fear. That's just crazy.
Yes, I took the class and the test for a carry permit but decided it wasn't worth the hassle. But as I age I become less sure of myself and I eventually may feel like I need a weapon to protect myself. When that happens I'm not going to fool myself about why I'm doing it. It's because I fear I can't take care of myself any more.

Everyone has their reasons. My experience was that there is no second chance. Also, the human animal is unpredictable. A compact 45 makes them fear me more than I fear them.

I see choosing to sometimes carry a sidearm in the same veign as choosing to carry various forms of insurance. Or like choosing to have fire extinguishers, particularly in the garage and in the kitchen. I see it in the same veign as carrying a spare tire, tools, flares, water, and a blanket in the car. Or in wearing a full face helmet and full leathers when I ride my motorcycles. Or a compass, space blanket, power bars, maps, etc. when in the wild.

None of this strikes any "fear" in me, per se, but I do recognize a need for prudent caution. A need to be ready for whatever may happen. I see carrying a sidearm exactly like that. I do not live in fear; that is not why I carry. And I'm certainly not "crazy".

At the end of the day, a sidearm is no more than a tool like any other tool. Those who live in fear of them - Col. Cooper's "hoplophobes" - seem to assign all manner of significance to them beyond that. Far more so than those who are around them, and use them regularly. It's the folks that fear them the most that seem to be the most fixated on them, and seem to like to transfer that fixation - repleat with the necessary sexual and psychological connotations - to those who are entirely comfortable with, and not so entirely fixated on them. It's those who fear the gun that seemingly cannot understand the gun owners' lack of fear.

No, we are not afraid of anything. Just prepared. And, more importantly to most of us, free to be prepared. I often carry just to remind myself of that.

if you ever decide to go to the "wilderness" seriously think about what you carry.


a .22/.380/9mm/.38/.45 are ALL BETTER THAN NOTHING.......................but when it comes to kritters. think real serious about these handgun flavors:


.357
10mm
.41
.44
.454



anything bigger please watch you tube(pick yer flavor.460/.480/.500) and watch the recoil. yer really only going to get (1) shot off, if that, in a life or death kritter charging you type action.


i cant think of anything better than my marlins in .357 and .44 and their amigos smith and wesson model 66 4" in .357 and model 29 4" in .44 for the perfect combo of CONTROLLED FIRE on dangerous kritters not including any grizzly territory. then i would not leave home without my .338 win mag nor my marlin 1895GS in 45/70.


for grizzily duty i will have some garrett .44 mag defender rounds or corbons. and garretts or buffalo bore in 45/70.


when a simple javalina here that weighed 57#(on my wall) can take (3) .308s and (2) .357's before meeting his maker....................well i think that kind of shows how TOUGH WILD ANIMALS REALLY ARE!



come to think of it has anyone ever heard of a human being taking (3) .308 hits and (2) .357 rds and still keep fighting? i seriously doubt it!



then throw in rabies into the mess, and you have a really pissed off kritter that isnt afeared of anyone or anything!



another fave i have for just general drill................a springfield SOCOM in .308. ya just cant beat them for being light and packing a lot of horsey power in a small package.

I am certain I have spent more time in wilderness and primitive areas than you or anyone on this bbs, and I have never needed a gun. The closest times to when I might have needed one were:

one bear encounter in the N. Cascades

and two primate encounters, one as above & one near the Mexican border in a primitive area in TX

I have needed a gun and so has my brother and I'm glad we both had ours when we truly needed them.