for the record, i've had several positive encounters with LEO's. the very last one, a couple of months ago, for example. pulled me over, ticketed me, professional, no BS. i was speeding, i got caught. lesson learned.

the DN a couple of summers ago..... well, his lieutenant came to understand just how pissed off i was about the treatment i received from his ego-tripping county 'sheriff'.

The trouble is the DOUBLE STANDARD...get out of JAIL card...if you are a LEO you can SPEED anywhere.any time.all my relatives are cops.
My Father was a Sheriff .
my Nephew a cop.
I have enough ID with me...you CANT give me a ticket !
SO. It all so SUCKS!
WE have Them against a us !

I've had one good encounter with a LEO. I was rolling up I-57 north of Marion, Ill. one Sunday morning keeping it at about 100-105 in my E320. I noticed a lot of cop cars at the crest of the next hill and slowed down, but as I passed them one pulled out and lit me up. I was sure I was going to jail. He said the airplane overhead (and pointed to it) clocked me at 79. I don't know if they got the wrong car or what, but I was going at least 25 mph faster than that. I took the ticket and got the hell out of there before anyone said, "Hey - that's the 100 mph guy!"

Is PURGERY
In Court ..did the one writing the ticket see you doing the crime ? NO !
DONE deal.your off -they lied

Patrick, I know that event was in the past, but for future reference:

The only way an airplane can "clock you" is to time you between two measured points on the ground*. Those points must be measured accurately with a calibrated instrument, and the stopwatch used must also be calibrated. Subpoena the calibration records, and the training records of the person who did the actual "clocking". Find out if he did the math manually or used a computer program. If a computer program, ask for its calibration and software certifications. If manually, subpoena his calculation notes. Don't forget to also subpoena the aircraft logs to be sure that you know who was in the airplane that day. I would also subpoena the aircraft logs and the pilot logs and call into question whether the plane was being flown legally.

That's the way we do traffic court here... subpoena every possible record on everyone that was ever associated with the stop. If they want my money, they're going to have to work for it.


* Because of whats known as cosine error, they cannot accurately use radar or laser from the plane.

I have had mostly positive encounters with LEO. My son has also, but he does not recognize this. He has done some stupid things, as kids will do, and they have gone "light' on him.
In all professions there are good and bad.

Was it Columbine were a teacher bled out because the police dressed for combat would not enter the building?

That was one of the lessons learned. They have to get in quick so as to at least disrupt the shooters. It does not mean they shoot it out from the get go AND it is very dangerous for the entry team as they have to make the bad guys on the fly. But to not go in gives more time to the bad guys to do as they please, that ain't good.

I think the root cause of this militarization of civilian police is TSA money/grants. Local police depts, no need for this equipment, have a "use it or lose it" attitude wrt to the funding. I've had mostly positive encounters with LEO, but I still view them mostly as tax collectors or jackbooted thugs looking for a fight. They should spend that TSA money on training on how to de-escalate situations and weeding out the guys who want just a little too much to become cops. If they went after the real dangers on the roads, they'd have all the money they ever needed and make the roads a lot safer.

The militarization of law enforcement started long before the TSA.
It started post Vietnam, when the black bread van started being seen on LA streets.
It started when Lt. 'Hondo' Harrelson could be seen on American TVs, and when every small town donut chaser decided to get in a d*ck measuring contest with their TV superheros.

My guess is they wrote me a ticket for 14 mph over the limit to get my $60 and get it over with. If the fine had been significant, I'm sure my atty would have done just as you suggest.

I was being searched and humiliated by the police long before the TSA came along.

Never had a bad experience with police but then again I never go over 84 on the highway.

No offence meant, but you are not a dude, invalid.

No. Not really.


Michael Paxton said he was playing with his 7-year-old dog in his backyard in Austin on a “quiet” Saturday when an officer showed up in his driveway. His dog, who ran out to the officer’s feet, was dead in seconds. The police officer, responding to the wrong address, shot him and killed him.

Spot on, and very sorry to say this...

I agree, but let's not lump everyone into the same category.

BTW - the money for para-militarization of the police really started to flow with Nixon, and the rise of SWAT; then there was that bank robbery shoot out down in LA somewhere that the police were clearly outgunned in

I think the militarization of civilian police was well underway by the time of the 1997 North Hollywood shootout.

After the 1980 Norco shootout, the San Bernardino sheriffs dept ran out and procured an M16, an AR15, and some Ruger mini 14s.

After the North Hollywood event, the DoJ helped out by giving the LAPD several hundred fully automatic M16 rifles.


Although letting civilian police forces turn themselves into a paramilitary organization is in itself dangerous to the public at large, what I think is more dangerous is the attitudes displayed by these heavily armed cops.

Shoot first, deny responsibility later.

Of course you can't realistically paint with a broad brush with complete accuracy but....

I dated a former cop - one for over 15 years - and she said most of them are a bunch of a-holes that she wouldn't trust as much as a private citizen. She said they don't think twice about lying when it fit their agenda. And yes they tend to stick together ready to back each other up especially when the public is upset about an incident involving a cop abusing his "power".

Of course there are probably some exceptions though.....