The most contentious topic that you won't see in PARF

[ZOO]

Originally Posted by widebody911

I agree that semi-autos are the future, but the SMGII is like the Windows 2.0 of the transmission world.

Plus eleventy-billion . . .

I love a clutch. I have come to terms with the fact that a traditional manual transmission has run its course in supercars . . . and that I will likely become one of "those older men" who lament the demise of the manual transmission the way the older set laments the demise of the carburetor.

[BlueSkyJaunte]

I'm an engineer. I look at it from a simple, single-minded perspective: Which one has more moving parts?

That's the one that requires more frequent, higher-cost maintenance and is more likely to break.

[dewolf]

Again, anyone passing comment on the SMG had it long term? As soon as you get used to its idiosyncrasies you will start to think it ain't half bad. The thing that people don't do with these cars every 12 months or so is the SMG re-calibration. Get the BMW Inpa/Dis software and a laptop and you can do it yourself. You can also reflash the SMG software to CSL specs. And now we'll hear from people saying "see, now you need a computer to service it". A laptop and software is just another tool in the toolbox for modern cars. Just ask any 18 year old car nut.

[sc_rufctr]

Originally Posted by BlueSkyJaunte

I'm an engineer. I look at it from a simple, single-minded perspective: Which one has more moving parts?

That's the one that requires more frequent, higher-cost maintenance and is more likely to break.

Great philosophy!

[DonDavis]

Hmm, not sure which way I'd go. I'd certainly closely research the SMG.

I second the yoga. From what I've seen on this BBS, you're not afraid of physical work. I'm sure you're aware of the benefits of a regular workout or yoga. I began Crossfit 4 weeks ago and my flexibility and sleep have improved noticeably.

That yellow rig looks sweet.

Originally Posted by BlueSkyJaunte

I'm an engineer. I look at it from a simple, single-minded perspective: Which one has more moving parts?

That's the one that requires more frequent, higher-cost maintenance and is more likely to break.

I tend to agree with this ^.

However, if the car is maintained properly and the driver has above average driving skills ( I would think the SMG needs a driver with the right touch ), would you view it's reliability any differently? . But there's the rub. Like a really hot, high maintenance gf, great to look at but murder on one's sanity.

I suppose I'm reading too much into the whole thing.
I'd have to drive them and compare.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by stuartj

I bemoan the loss of the skill, the heel/toe technique that marked a driver...

I still question the masculinity of guys who accept the automatic choke.

[stuartj]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

I still question the masculinity of guys who accept the automatic choke.

Parking sensors. Hand in your card.

Im seeing the basis of an association here...Automotive Curmudgeons, Inc.

[aigel]

Like I mentioned already - if nothing else, the 6 speed will hold its value much better due to all the guys like us. Watch for the same on the last GT3 with MT. Same happed on air cooled 911s etc.

G

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by BlueSkyJaunte

I'm an engineer. I look at it from a simple, single-minded perspective: Which one has more moving parts?

That's the one that requires more frequent, higher-cost maintenance and is more likely to break.

I would look at which one requires the least skill from the operator when considering which is more likely to break. You can't get much simpler than a sliding gear three speed, but you should have seen what my grandmother could do to a Ford model A transmission.

[widebody911]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

I still question the masculinity of guys who accept the automatic choke.

You sound like one of the sissies with an electric starter and a synchronized transmission.

[widebody911]

I went and drove the car today. This particular car has been very well maintained, and this SMG wasn't as bad as people made it out to be. There are aspects which are not obvious, and the UI really should have been run through UAT once or twice before release. For example "A" is the manual mode and "S" is the auto mode. Really?

[widebody911]

[dewolf]

That is actually telling you which way to move the shifter in order to get into that mode. If the car is in 'auto' mode the lcd display is showing 'S' it is telling you if you tap the lever across you will enter 'sport' mode. I dunno, I'm used to it now. If you lift off just a tad between gear changes like you do a manual you will notice the changes at slower speeds are just as good, if not better that a regular manual. However.....at maximum shift setting, S6, keep foot firmly planted and just flick the paddles for changes that are amazing.

[speeder]

I like M3s but I've always thought of them as the most abused used cars on the planet due to the fact that most of the original owners are rich teenagers, at least around here.

[aigel]

Originally Posted by widebody911

Why are you obsessed with BABY POO YELLOW?

Seriously - that's a pretty ****ty color. And have a ****ty transmission on top of it?

G

[aigel]

Originally Posted by speeder

I like M3s but I've always thought of them as the most abused used cars on the planet due to the fact that most of the original owners are rich teenagers, at least around here.

It is a little different in the Bay Area, I think. I do understand what you mean though - it is the Mustang GT of Beverly Hills!

G

[RANDY P]

I liked your last one. I was looking for a long time for an Imola Red 6SP that wasn't wasted.

I gave up.

rjp

[shoemakj]

I still question the masculinity of guys who accept the automatic choke.

Two of my tractors still use a hand crank to start.

[stuttgart46]

It took me some getting used to it but I really like it. I've been daily driving my E46 M3 SMG for about a year now and it's a great car.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by dewolf

The M3 smg has no real servicing as such apart from changing the oil in the box. You can change the pentosin hydraulic oil if you like but most people don't. It is the exact same gearbox as the manual. Sure things like changing the clutch is more involved but hey to me that's a trade off for a car that can be driven in auto mode as smooth as butter or in manual mode with faultless lightning fast changes. Like all hi-po cars they have some issues that get blown out of proportion much like the IMS Porsche issue. It is a well known fact in the M3 community that the SMG clutch lasts far longer than the normal manual. Clearly the F1 box in the Maser has very different programming to the BMW one.
How is it that you don't feel in control with the SMG? My M3 will let you do everything except destroy it and the engine. It shifts when I want, up or down, except if it's going to over-rev. In fact it will hold a gear on an incline so as not to labour the engine. Down an incline in auto mode it will drop down a gear to maximise engine braking. If you have not driven an E46 SMGII I'd suggest taking one for a drive.
Could you set the shift speed in the Maser like you can in the M3?

I think the F1 box in the Maserati was more like the SMG1 BMW box. There was an auto, manual, and sport mode, that's it.

As for control, your above note says it all. Ultimately the computer controls what you can and can't do, not the driver. I can shift directly from 2nd to 5th, I can hold a hill with my clutch, I can put the car in whatever gear I want to, I can roll start on a hill if my starter dies (has happened), I can easily change my own clutch, and I have to be smart enough to NOT put the car into 1st at 80 MPH. My biggest pet peeve is a silly one, but I HATE having to look at a stupid LCD display to tell what gear I am in. All I need with a manual gearbox is my hand on the shifter.

To each his own, and I'll be the first to admit that an SMG or DSG box is much faster to shift and better in a track car. But for rewarding, involving, fun driving that actually takes a little bit of skill, I'll take a real manual all day long. Looks like 86% of our old farts agree.