The reason the 928 was intended to replace the 911..

[PushingMyLuck]

Is it true that the 928 was intended to replace the 911 because it was feared that the air cooled 911 wouldn't be able to pass the Swiss "drive by" noise regulations or American crash standards?

[wwest]

The 928, like the pushrod Corvette and Viper, was to be sold on to fans of BIG IRON.

[pors1968]

i guess they misunderstand the market .

[kiwiokie]

I thought the reason was they thought the air cooled flat 6 would not be able to meet increasingly strict US emission standards not crash standards. If you think they misunderstood the market just compare the dimensions, weight and creature comforts of any 911 after the 996 and the 928 and you could argue they were just 20 years ahead of their market.

[Noah930]

Originally Posted by PushingMyLuck

Is it true that the 928 was intended to replace the 911 because it was feared that the air cooled 911 wouldn't be able to pass the Swiss "drive by" noise regulations or American crash standards?

From what I've read, Swiss drive by noise regulations as well as world-wide emissions regulations contributed to the anticipated demise of the air-cooled flat 6 motor (and 911). The only time I've heard of crash standards being a big concern was the development of the targa bodystyle, as there was fear that convertibles would be banned.

[stuartbrs]

My 928 has a RMB... and it is LOUD.... but, its nothing like a 911 to drive, I think the whole 928 was supposed to replace the 911 thing is a bit of a myth. Well, maybe not myth, but certainly not a literal reason behind the 928`s inception. It was more expensive, harder to make, harder to build, harder to service, and had some very expensive quality materials for some very mundane parts (roller bearings in the pedals for instance...!) The 928 is a GT car, not a sports car, clearly Porsche never had any intention of racing it, unlike the 911. I think it was more the 944/968 range of cars that were going to be the 911`s replacement. That's my opinion anyway.
The 928 is a brilliant car, but its almost alien to the 911, they really are completely different types of performance car.

[wayner]

That may make sense since it was the 944 cup series that eventually lead to later 911 911 cup racing (once the 911 was back on the long term product list).

[javadog]

The 928 project began in earnest when Dr. Fuhrmann returned to Porsche in 1971. They had already been thinking about the next generation of cars and had a sportier car in mind, one that was related to a design project they were doing for Volkswagen, but it got killed. A study had been underway to determine the best layout for a car, based on 40+ characteristics, and the front engine/rear gearbox design seemed to be the best. Emissions, noise and crash safety were just a small part of it. Comfort, luggage space, driving qualities, performance, aerodynamics and various other things were evaluated. They also wanted to consider their current market. The 911 was a step up-market from the 356 and they didn't want to go backwards.

So, when Fuhrmann got there, he re-arranged the priorities (prototype racing was shelved and 911 development and racing were pushed, to buy them some time) and work on the 928 began to take shape.

The 924/944 came along later.

JR

[kach22i]

Some history adjacent.


1987 Porsche 928 H50 Concept
1987 Porsche 928 H50 Concept - Top Speed

The reasons behind Porsche’s decision to cover up the 928 H50 Concept for the past 25 years appears to have stemmed from their observation that the car’s body didn’t meet the company’s standards.

[quaz]

Yes because this car is soooo much better looking

[GH85Carrera]

Dr. Fuhrmann was never a fan of the 911 and really disliked it. He said once it was not profitable it would die. And he would not allow any further development at all. Some development went on in secret, but nothing major. When the American Peter Schutz was hired to replace Dr. Fuhrmann he took a magic marker to the board that had the projected demise of the 911 and extended the line around the room. Peter Schutz saved the 911.

[javadog]

All of that was much later, after the 928 was in production.

JR

[cockerpunk]

i think it was a combination of many things, between emissions of the air cooled engine, the handling and reputation of the 911 as a killer, and with the danger of the corvair, threatening that rear engines would be banned in the USA.

porsche has always hedged there bets, and made sure that they have something ready and are not caught with there pants down so to speak.

note: the 918 spyder is the perfect version of this thinking in the modern age. porsche knows carbon taxes, emissions, and other regulations are going to sink the true ICE super car. better to be ahead then behind.

[Z-man]

To say the pre-996 911 uses an air-cooled motor is somewhat of a misnomer. The 'air-cooled' motor uses oil as the primary cooling medium.

Back on topic - I have also read that the 928 was to replace the aging air-cooled 911. Apparently, new technologies allowed the Porsche engineers to increase horsepower and fuel efficiency as well as decrease noise and emissions on the air-cooled (er, oil-cooled) motors are nearly another 20 years. In retrospect, perhaps the 928 project encouraged the air-cooled motor engineers to push the limits further on the tried-and-true 911 motor. Necessity is the mother of invention...

-Z-man.

[javadog]

They began design of the car that was to become the 928 long before the 911 was "old". It was only 6 years into it's production cycle at that point. Porsche never intended for the 911 to go on as long as it did, even before Fuhrmann tried to kill it in the late '70's and early '80's. Porsche realized the 356 had a finite run and assumed the same thing would be true of the 911. The 928 wasn't replacing the 911 because of any shortcomings, per se, it was just "the next car".

JR

[kach22i]

Conception
Porsche 928 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Project 928: A Development History of the Porsche 928 from First Sketch to Production
Hardcover
by Julius Joseph Weitmann (Author) , Rico Steinemann (Author)
http://www.amazon.com/Project-928-Development-History-Production/dp/3879435189

Hardcover
from $199.94
7 Used from $199.94
1 New from $783.20

[McLovin]

That's an expensive book.

At that price, you can buy a book on a 928, or an actual 928!

[javadog]

Got that book... It's a good resource. The guy that wrote it was a Porsche employee, very high up in the food chain.

JR

[Nickshu]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

and with the danger of the corvair,

What danger? The NHTSA as well as Texas A&M tested the Corvair extensively in the early 1970's and found it to be no more unsafe than any front engine/rear drive car on the market at that time. Nader was the "inventor" of the media grievance industry and made up most of his claims.

...I might be biased though (see signature).

To add to the discussion, I have read all of the above about the demise of the 911...Emissions, noise, air cooled limitations in HP and heat, unrefined to drive, demand for V8's to compete w/ Ferrari and Corvette, not profitable to build....

[jwgn777]

Originally Posted by Nickshu

What danger? The NHTSA as well as Texas A&M tested the Corvair extensively in the early 1970's and found it to be no more unsafe than any front engine/rear drive car on the market at that time. Nader was the "inventor" of the media grievance industry and made up most of his claims.

...I might be biased though (see signature).

To add to the discussion, I have read all of the above about the demise of the 911...Emissions, noise, air cooled limitations in HP and heat, unrefined to drive, demand for V8's to compete w/ Ferrari and Corvette, not profitable to build....

I agree with you about the Corvair, It was unfairly targeted.