Macan, first sports car in SUV class?

[Tsunamiboy]

I currently own a 1979 SC and 1997 Boxster but I admit the new Macan has struck a cord with me. With over 300+ hp adjustable air suspension, all wheel drive and a boat load of utility this just may be my next Porsche!

I have scheduled a test drive at Sunset Porsche as soon as they show up in the showroom. What does the collective feel about this product line?

[onewhippedpuppy]

Not my cup of tea, but I'm sure it drives well for an SUV. I've always thought small SUVs were pretty pointless compared to a good sport wagon - smaller inside, worse handling, worse MPG, slower. I would pick up a lightly used E63, CTS-V, or one of the hot Audi wagons first.

[GeorgeK]

[QUOTE=Tsunamiboy;7896292]...adjustable air suspension,.....[QUOTE]

This is the HUGE no-no. Long term reliability of the air suspension is a big issue, even in the MB S-Class and GL- Class.

Kind of a Wonder how semi trucks go 500K miles on them, but a 2-ton car can not go 100k without issues.

Of course, Porsche considersthe whole car a consumable item. Gone are the days when they would congratulate you for 200K miles, etc...

[HHI944]

When jag developed the current XJ, air suspension was a large consideration. There's no denying the ride quality. In the end they factored that the majority of strut failure were front end and decided on coil spring up front with air in the back to maintain self leveling.....they still fail consistently and the x351 is only a few years old

[onewhippedpuppy]

[QUOTE=GeorgeK;7896323][QUOTE=Tsunamiboy;7896292]...adjustable air suspension,.....

This is the HUGE no-no. Long term reliability of the air suspension is a big issue, even in the MB S-Class and GL- Class.

Kind of a Wonder how semi trucks go 500K miles on them, but a 2-ton car can not go 100k without issues.

Of course, Porsche considersthe whole car a consumable item. Gone are the days when they would congratulate you for 200K miles, etc...

Former diesel tech here. Semis go millions of miles on air suspension because when they leak (not if) they are simple and easy to fix. I replaced a lot of leaking fittings on air lines.

Even Lexus couldn't manage to make a reliable air suspension, they put one on their version of the Land Cruiser and made a bulletproof truck problematic. It's not a question of if they will leak, but when. Fortunately the average owner of a new premium luxury vehicle doesn't keep it that long anyway, it's us poor sap enthusiast owners that get stuck with the problems.

These don't have an air suspension:

[island911]

Originally Posted by GeorgeK

This is the HUGE no-no. Long term reliability of the air suspension is a big issue, even in the MB S-Class and GL- Class....

pneumatic tires too....

meh. I love having the adjustable air suspension in my Cayenne. I did have a problem with it faulting because the computer though the pump not pumping pressure fast enough. $30 pump piston ring and seal . . . 15 minutes and done. (read; not a "HUGE no-no"). It's kind of sad that people get scared away by problems that they don't understand. Some even convert over to steel springs, just so they can understand the system.

On the Macan - my only reservation would be the size. The Cayenne is already pretty small. (compared to other ut's) Really great urban vehicle. Great on long interstate trips too.

[BReif61]

I could see myself scooping one of these up (equipped options dependant) once they've had a few years depreciation in them.

[HHI944]

Originally Posted by BReif61

I could see myself scooping one of these up (equipped options dependant) once they've had a few years depreciation in them.

Same here....and once arnott has had time to get a replacement air strut to market.

[HardDrive]

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy

Even Lexus couldn't manage to make a reliable air suspension, they put one on their version of the Land Cruiser and made a bulletproof truck problematic.

We own an 03 RX330 that has it. Its a ticking time bomb.

When it finally goes south, I'm going to convert it to standard. Lexus wants $1500 each for air front struts. GD criminals if you ask me.

[nostatic]

I am still totally happy with my X1, so I could see liking the Macan if it has enough space. I have specific requirements and the X1 has *just* enough room in the back to carry my gear. Ymmv.

[HHI944]

Originally Posted by HardDrive

We own an 03 RX330 that has it. Its a ticking time bomb.

When it finally goes south, I'm going to convert it to standard. Lexus wants $1500 each for air front struts. GD criminals if you ask me.

Check out arnott.com
1500 is the jaguar price, arnott sells remains for around 500

[David]

I've been thinking about a Cayenne and my research has shown a very reliable air-suspension system. I rode in a friend's Q5 which is the same chassis as the Macan and I really liked it. I'm sure the Macan will be even better but I'd rather have the larger towing capacity of the Cayenne.

[aigel]

I have no use whatsoever for a vehicle in this class. I need a heavy duty 4x4 with good cargo space for hunting and camping, a sports car for fut and a gas saving commuter that has room for at least one dog. I guess you could claim that a compact SUV can bridge all this? It'd do everything poorly though. Including saving me money.

Being on the road it looks like a lot of people think a compact SUV fits the ticket. If I was one of them, I'd certainly consider the Porsche!

G

[cantdrv55]

Originally Posted by nostatic

I am still totally happy with my X1, so I could see liking the Macan if it has enough space. I have specific requirements and the X1 has *just* enough room in the back to carry my gear. Ymmv.

Oh man, that is cool! X1 with a full suspension tandem mtn bike on the roof. Bet you get a lot of looks on the road. I think it's the best looking small crossover.

[kach22i]

MARCH 2012 ILLUSTRATION BY CHRISTIAN SCHULTE
2014 Porsche Macan – Future Cars – Car and Driver



http://www.rennteam.com/forum/page1.html;jsessionid=1o2tk0r44x70dgkdl6dk3b02z?vs =0

[gunlover05]

Nice, they will sell well i'm guessing. Reminds me somewhat of what i just bought - a well maintained 2008 FX-35. I wanted a sportish small SUV, and while not a Porsche or 300hp, it drives like a sporty car, they are pretty reliable, AWD, and sure cost me a lot less ;-) But anyhow, look forward to hearing more about the Macan and seeing one.

my 85 911 thinks the FX isn't too bad either

[GeorgeK]

Originally Posted by island911

pneumatic tires too....

meh. I love having the adjustable air suspension in my Cayenne. I did have a problem with it faulting because the computer though the pump not pumping pressure fast enough. $30 pump piston ring and seal . . . 15 minutes and done. (read; not a "HUGE no-no"). It's kind of sad that people get scared away by problems that they don't understand. Some even convert over to steel springs, just so they can understand the system.

On the Macan - my only reservation would be the size. The Cayenne is already pretty small. (compared to other ut's) Really great urban vehicle. Great on long interstate trips too.

Island,
Good points you make. However, in my driving life, I have *never* had or seen a spring fail first hand. Pneumatic failures litter the web, and I have seen them.

And a spring tends to be much cheaper than an air bladder.

[island911]

Yeah, GK, I get that; why use air when coiled steel has a phenomenally good history? Seems reasonable.

Well, there is a compelling reason; or two. First, the obvious - Porsche clearly wanted the Cayenne to perform exceedingly well regardless of the road (or no road) conditions. Ground clearance vs aerodynamics at speed. The Air-sprung Cayenne will sling closer to the road (ala 959) at speed - which it has PLENTY. Off-road, the user can push it up high for ease of clearing rocks and rut-mounds.

Now for what is not so obvious - damper control. The PASM system (Porsche Active Stability Management - aka, air suspension) also comes with lightning-fast control over the shocks. The computer is sensing and processing massive telemetry and load data against user input (steering angle, gas, brake...) and adjusting each damper force on the fly. The result is impressive. The relatively top-heavy, heavy Cayenne has handling manners better than say a super low CG car (911). While cornering seems strangely better than it should be, Braking is where the system really shines. Ya know how threshold braking a 911 takes some skill ... the timing of loading up the front suspension... getting front tires to dig-in w/o locking up while the car's inertia transfers to the front suspension? Yeah, you don't have to wait much/any for that on the PASM system. Those front 'shocks'(dampers) lock-down quickly for a stunningly quick deceleration. --That is, full weight transfer to where the rubber meets the road happen now!

If you choose steel springs you trade all of that performance for piece of mind, on the system reliability.

[GeorgeK]

Island,
Very good points.
The system would be clearly the only choice, if only it was long term reliable, anf affordable.
I don't want to be held hostage of a system where the manufacturer dictates a price with none of the sympathy there was years ago (priced a 964 accelerometer, or left side fan recently...).
And, I don't feel in danger in my steel sprung cars....

[island911]

Yep. I totally understand. Of course all the new age digital finesse has its price. I still have one foot safely planted in the mechanical world of the 911SC (also my other utility, a syncro vanagon) and the other foot (cautiously) in this digital Rube Goldberg world of newer Porsches and Mercedes. Having specialized computers to talk to those cars kind of sucks. Liek you say, it's like being held hostage to a mfg. ...but also is kind of cool; being able to watch a real-time plots of engine torque and/or left-bank exhaust temp.... And, the aftermarket supplies needed solutions.

Decades out, I expect that the 911 toughness (and relative system simplicity) will outlast these early boxes of digital finesse*, but hey, for now it's pretty damn nice to have both.

*that is if those 911 A-arm bushings don't fail; causing the steel (T-bar) springs to snap.