Ford Expedition, experiences?

[Nathans_Dad]

Hey all, time to mine the pelican braintrust once more.

Some of you may know I have been kicking around the idea of getting rid of our 2003 Tahoe. It has about 75k miles on it, is the primary kid hauler/beatermobile and is startign to show its age. Nothing specifically is wrong with it right now, but I have a deep, innate distrust of GM products and since it is 105 degrees outside, I'd rather not have my wife stranded on the road with 3 kids in tow.

Anyhow, she has been talking about wanting a Sequoia for about a year now. She likes the newer body style. I recently got a small raise at work which will net me about $500 a month more after taxes.

Since that is about what I expected a payment to be, off we go to the dealers to look. The 2008 Sequoias that are left are all limiteds, which sticker somewhere in the low 50s, dealers were taking 10k off the sticker so low 40s plus TT&L. That was more than we were looking to pay.

We discussed our other options, she doesn't want another Chevy product. She likes the looks of the Expeditions and they can be had new or gently used pretty easily for mid-30s, even the Eddie Bauers and Limiteds with leather, etc.

So, anyone have any experience with Expeditions? Good truck?

Also, out of the following options, which would you choose?

1). Keep the Tahoe for another year or so until it has a problem.
2). Get the Sequoia and pay more but it might be the car she REALLY wants (around $43k + TT&L for a 2008 Limited or $36-37k +TT&L for a 2010 SR5 with cloth interior)
3). New Expedition (XLT with cloth interior for $32k or so, Eddie Bauer with leather for $38k)
4). Gently used Expedition (fully loaded Eddie Bauer here locally with about 24k miles for $28k asking price)


Oh, and don't suggest minivan, I have tried and beaten my head against that wall for over a year now, she ain't having it.

[VaSteve]

lolz. I'm going through a similar deliberation:

Toyota Sequoia...decent family hauler/tow vehicle?

FWIW, I heard that the new Sequoia's are smaller than the prior year's model. With kids, no way would I buy a new car. They destroy it. What they can't accomplish, my wife finishes off. Who leaves a banana peel on the leather seats? Really?

[911boost]

I can already see the "Buy the Toyota, they are greeeeat!" responses coming.

With that said, I had a 2001 Tahoe, that had over 100,000 miles on it before I sold it, and it NEVER let me down. It was a tank, and I would have trusted it with my wife and kids all day long.

Now that GM is owned by the Government, I wouldn't buy another one. I recently purchased a diesel powered Excursion because I needed the towing power. I would get the Expedition.

Bill

[Porsche_monkey]

My Expedition was totally reliable but full of little annoying glitches. Loose/corroded wires, broken trim, dash squeaks etc. I still liked it.

[Aerkuld]

My parents leave their 2004 Expedition with me while they're at home. They only use it when they come over to visit as it's the tow vehicle for their travel trailer. I obviously have to keep it running while they're not using it.

It's a fine vehicle. Eddie Bauer edition with the Class IV towing package. Bought used for a bargain price compared to new. It's been very reliable so far, very comfortable to drive or ride in for long distances, and dos a great job towing.

Personally if I was in a position to need something similar I wouldn't hesitate. Also, I'd never buy a new car but that's just me.

[ChkbookMechanic]

My parents have bought Expeditions since they first came out. Compared to the cars I've bought, the Expeditions have been ridiculously reliable requiring only basic maintenance (oil change, etc). The only time they've upgraded them is when old Honda Accords have rear ended them at red lights.

You can probably get a fully loaded Eddie Bauer new for close to what that used model is going for.

[TechnoViking]

Originally Posted by Porsche_monkey

My Expedition was totally reliable but full of little annoying glitches. Loose/corroded wires, broken trim, dash squeaks etc. I still liked it.

+1

I've had a 2001 for about 4 years now. Lots of little annoying crap:

Front windshield wiper fluid hose broke
Rear windshield wiper fluid does not work (cause TBD)
Right rear door lock only works manually (cause TBD)
Replaced 3 "coil on plug" ignition things. Stealership charged me $400 for the first one, then I figured out how to do it for $50 for the next two
Radio gets stuck in MAXIMUM VOLUME for a while...then goes back to normal
Occasionally discharges raw fuel into the engine compartment from some leak I can't find. You know it when you smell it.

And there are several other things that I can't seem to remember. But the list is long.

It's an American car, so that's what you get. But from a utility standpoint, it's a decent vehicle. It runs (on 8 cylinders most days) and it tows, and it fits two baby seats with plenty of room.

And I think you can buy an older one for slightly less per-pound than scrap steel right now.

Why not buy an older one for $4K and see if you like it before dropping big bucks? It will depreciate to basically $0 in a few years.

[Tobra]

Had a few Fords, they all seemed to end up with wiring issues.

I have known many guys and gals with Chevy/GMC trucks, I did live in Texas for 10 years. I only knew one guy who ever had trouble with one, and I think it was a flood salvage.

Do you really need something that big? Expedition is like a Suburban, isn't it?

[dad911]

2005 expedition here, 88k miles, only problem was a broken exhaust manifold.

Approx 10k of mileage has been towing an open or enclosed trailer, and it has made 2 non-stop round trips in the last year from NJ-Key West without issue.

Brakes also last at least twice as long as my prior suburban & tahoe.

[onewhippedpuppy]

In-laws owned a 2000 Expedition. Bought new, only a few minor issues. However the build quality was crap, it was horribly underpowered, and was the worst riding SUV I've ever driven. I test drove 2005 models a year ago and had largely the same impression. There's not much that they do better than competing SUVs and they are SLOW, even the new ones.

I'll give the same advice I gave Steve: Nissan Armada. Better power than the Ex or pre-2008 Sequoia, much more room inside, and Toyota levels of build quality. They ironed out the issues after 2004, the newer models are very reliable. They're more money than an Ex, but less than a 2008 Sequoia. When I looked for Steve, I easily found 2008 and 2009 models with under 10k for $35k or less. You can also easily find the new bodystyle Tahoe/Yukon in that price range, they're a huge step up from the model you have. If you want to spend a lot of money, you really can't go wrong with the Sequoia either.

Go to CarMax and drive a bunch of them. We thought the Ex looked decent in pictures until we were able to touch and drive it, then we realized that it was crap. If you decide you like one, don't buy new. They are depreciation nightmares. Buy one with 10k and let someone else get screwed.

[JavaBrewer]

We went from a Series I Discovery to the Series II, to a '03 Expedition, back to an '03 Discovery. The 18 or so months with the Expedition were great. IMO it (fully loaded with EB package, 4x4, DVD, captains seats) way out classed the Chevy/GMC alternatives. It was dead reliable, got reasonable MPG for it's size, was very comfortable and did everything we asked of it without a wimper. It sported the large triton 5.4 V8 and it simply cruised on the open road at 80 mph without any problem. We sold it to go back to the Discovery...even though the Ford did just about everything better and with way less drama...the wife said it had no soul...

YMMV.

[kaisen]

I'll chime in, and try not to kill the thread

My wife has the Lincoln version of the Expedition, a 2005 Navigator, and it will turn 85K miles soon. Zero problems so far.

In 2003 the Exped and Nav went to the 'new' platform that got independent rear suspension.
In 2005 the Exped and Nav got the 3 valve-per-cyl SOHC w/ Variable Valve Timing (~300hp / 365 lb-ft)
In 2005 the Nav got the ZF 6 speed, the same exact unit as a BMW 7-series (Exped stayed 4 spd)
In 2007 the Exped and Nav got Ford's 6 speed

I have no idea why Matt calls them slow, or underpowered. It is way faster than the old-body Sequoia and the 6 speed versions are dead-on with a Nissan Armada. A Nav or Exped tows 8600 pounds.

If you can find a 2007-2008 used Exped that you like, that would be my vote

Listening to people with experience with pre-2005 Expeditions (and certainly the old-body pre-2003) would be apples and oranges as nothing in the drivetrain is the same.

Of course, my personal bias would be to find a 2005-2006 Navigator as they are just plain great buys given their level of equipment, nicer interior, nicer ride, and better bumper-to-bumper warranty. The same advice would apply to the 2007-up, I guess, but I personally think the grille and dash are hideous and (slightly) prefer the ZF trans to Ford's unit.

If you're thinking Sequoia, just buy a new one and enjoy it. I don't think the reliability will be any better than a new Expedition. I don't see the fit and finish being better either. But then, the new Sequoia/Tundra is much more Americanized than previous generations.

[daepp]

I've had two - they were both awesome!

The older one esp. had a great ride. I believe it was a 2000.

[onewhippedpuppy]

We test drove a 2005 Expedition back-to-back with a 2005 Armada. The Armada was dramatically more responsive and felt substantially more powerful. I also recall thinking that the Ford motor was thrashy at higher RPMs. After driving the Expedition, the wife's comment was that she was afraid she wouldn't be able to pass on 2-lane roads. The interior was noticably cheaper as well, enough so that my wife noticed it. Lots of cheap hard plastic and exposed edges. The car we test drove had the 2nd row bench seat, I recall the flip-forward seat having absolutely no cover over the underside, leaving many sharp edges to scratch and snag kids when crawling to the 3rd row. I thought that was a particularly blatant oversight, most vehicles with flip forward seats (including our MPV) have a plastic cover over the seat underside mechanism.

We really tried to consider a Ford. The Expedition we drove had 30k, it was cheaper than a similar Armada with 60k. When we moved our focus to a minivan we test drove an uplevel Ford Freestar because they were also so cheap. Unfortunately, we had similar complaints. We ended up buying an older MPV with more miles because it was a better driving van with a higher quality feel.

Maybe I'm just picky, I don't know. Even in my father-in-law's nearly new 2008 F150 I can find nits to pick. Lots of hard plastic and a few exposed seams, it still feels cheap to me. Kaisen, I will say that I really liked the new GMC Sierra that I drove, so I don't hate all domestics. I also liked my Cadillac SRX until it started falling apart.

[gr8fl4porsche]

I have been driving Ford products since 1989. My current Mountaineer has been the worst of the lot. The other 6 or 7 did fairly well. All models lasted over 200,000 miles with only 1 transmission being replaced in the mid 90's.

My 02 Mountaineer

Wheel bearings (which are not serviceable and require a new hub up front) only last a couple of years then they go out. I've replaced 7 since 2002 and I have one bad again.

Transfer case has been replaced.
AC condensor replaced.
Most of the plastic hoses under the hood have cracked.
Multiple sensors including MAF have been replaced.
Ball joints have cracked boots and need to be replaced.
Interior trim pieces on all 4 doors are broken - all exactly the same place.
Entire window mechanism in passenger front door replaced due to small plastic clip breaking.
Steering wheel leather fell apart within the first year and they replaced the steering wheel with a cheaper Explorer model which has held up better.
Gear selector is wearing out, I have to shift into P or D in 2 stages as one of the plastic pieces is very worn.
Seat heater blows fuses regularly.
Plus lots more that I cannot remember right now.

Other than the above it has been a nice vehicle

Actually I do love the truck. The 4.6 AWD V8 is a geat combo. Plenty of power and the AWD is fantastic. I have owned a Subaru for 10 years so I know about AWD. Fords are very comfortable, ride nice and feel like an old shoe after a while.

I will miss it. Shopping for a Range Rover HSE Sport right now. I am a gluten for punishment.

[kaisen]

Matt, the 05 Armada had a 5 speed auto and 4.10 gears. The 05 Exped had a 4 speed auto and 3.73 gears. Overdrive and drive are similar, so the Armada has 3 gears where the Exped had 2 so the Armada's first and second were geared for 'launch'.

As I mentioned, that changed somewhat when the Exped went to 6 speed in 07. The 07-09 Exped feels much faster, as it should with 2 more ratios.

It's all about gearing as the engines are pretty similar.

In my experience, the Exped returns slightly better fuel economy than the Armada. I drove Armada company cars for a while then requested an Altima or Maxima when I couldn't stand to feed it anymore. But all full-size SUVs suck and none are consistently over 20mpg, so does it really matter?

[onewhippedpuppy]

Makes sense. Nobody in their right mind buys a full-size SUV for MPG, so quibbling over 18 vs 20 MPG is a waste of time. Either way it royally sucks. That's why we ended up with a minivan, even though the wife still lusts for an SUV.

[v2rocket_aka944]

Bumping this up, looking at 03-10 Expeditions with 5.4L engine.

Not interested in GM products here (terrible interiors) and definitely not interested in Chrysler products (terrible everythings). Toyotas are out of my price range, though nice. Not interested in Armadas.

Don't really like the interiors of the 07+ Expeditions so I am focusing on the 2003-2006 models. Please share your experiences with ride quality, reliability, overall satisfaction, and maybe even MPG (expectations on MPG are low).

[kaisen]

At this point, a 8-12 year old soccer-mom's SUV is going to be pretty well worn out.

[v2rocket_aka944]

I'm aware of that but not concerned, they are equipped with one of the most-solidly-reliable powertrains in recent automotive history so mileage isn't so much an issue. Suspension could be expected to need work at this point.

Its more the "soft" parts that I am concerned about reliability, the electrics and how well the interior holds up. My price range is under $10k, I don't want to spend more than that, plus insurance and other costs are much higher of course for newer vehicles. When you can get a decent-mileage good-shape truck for $5k (at least in my market) it seems like a good deal...