Changes at Ferrari

[5String43]

Wait - what? Marco Mattiacci is on the job just seven months, replacing long-time Ferrari team principal Stephano Domenicale. He barely knows the names of his drivers, much less those of the wrenches who fettle the cars. Starting from scratch, with a number of top-level team members being sacked after years of laughably dismal performance, it is his job to get the team back onto the top step of the F1 podium, which for a variety of very good reasons, will not be remotely possible until next year (which of course starts tomorrow, but that's another story).


So today was the last race of the season. The geniuses at Ferrari inform us that now Mattiacci, having barely dampened his toes in these treacherous waters, is outta there, to be replaced by a chap called Maurizio Arrivabene, whomeverthehell he is. Now it is his job to get the team back to the top step of the podium, etc., etc. Furthermore, it is his job to do so without the great Fernando Alonzo, who can and will drive the ass off of anything you care to put him into. Nando is moving on, having driven steaming piles of Ferrari for the last five years, making them look reasonably good in spite of them being the almost undriveable heaps of slag they were. He is being replaced by four-time world champion Sebastien Vettel, who won his races in a totally dominant car and who couldn't win a bingo game in this year's less competitive car.

I have thought for awhile that this whole deal would become an Italian comic opera. Was I wrong? I mean, good god, what in the hell is in the water there in Maranello? I suspect that at McLaren's Woking headquarters, they are, as they say, rolling on the floor, laughing their asses off. Alonzo is, after all, going to drive a McLaren next year.

[tabs]

Boy are you in the wrong fking Forum.

[kach22i]

Italians are communist, even their cars are red.

[cairns]

The smiling knife got knifed. He handled the Alonso situtation terribly poorly. Questioning Alonso's commitment was a very stupid thing to do.

I would expect there will be a long dry spell at Ferrari- you can't run the Fiat dynasty and micro-manage an F1 team.

[legion]

Things seem pretty bleak for Ferrari. The firing of two team principles (what difference could the second one have made?) and a chairman in a year is alarming. Their impending spinoff suggests that Fiat is no longer interested in dumping cash down that hole. I wouldn't be surprised if the F1 team ceases to exist after the spinoff, or the company goes into bankruptcy if it does.

[nota]

Originally Posted by legion

Things seem pretty bleak for Ferrari. The firing of two team principles (what difference could the second one have made?) and a chairman in a year is alarming. Their impending spinoff suggests that Fiat is no longer interested in dumping cash down that hole. I wouldn't be surprised if the F1 team ceases to exist after the spinoff, or the company goes into bankruptcy if it does.

low information ?
DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE CONCORDE AGREEMENT IS ?

you do know they sell out all the very over priced cars they can make
in fact most cars are sold BEFORE THEY ARE BUILT

the F-1 team makes money it does not cost the parent corp
because of secret deals with under the table payments
THERE IS NO NEED FOR FIAT TO FINANCE FERRARI
not the car builder or the F-1 team
both make money on their own

[Tilikum Turbo]

I really wonder if Ferrari will survive without the teat to suckle off the funds from Fiat to make it as a highly profitable business to even stay in F1?, as selling a handful of boutique sportcars just doesn't seem like it could it at the astronomical R& D costs for not only it's cars, but F1

For instance, by itself, the Viper is a negative-return car based on it's ROI, however a halo car for the parent company. Break off the Corvette from parent company GM, and it most likely won't make it on it's own as well.

Strange thing is, the writing is on the wall for all sports cars...when the autonomous driving car comes(and it is coming even if we don't like it, just as manuals are disappearing), slowly but surely, the old guard will change as the ability to drive a car will become as archaic as the need to ride a horse when the Model-T came down the pike full chat.

[Flieger]

Ferrari reports fewer sales, more profit to prove strategy is working - Autoblog

[jyl]

The Ferrari F1 team is at least self supporting, due to payments from F1.

Ferrari the car company is about as profitable as other good car companies. I can hunt up the numbers if anyone cares.

In case you hadn't noticed, we are in a period of fantastic prosperity for the very wealthy. I think Ferrari should be much more profitable at this peak of the cycle, because come the next trough, they will be losing money.

[ckelly78z]

From the view point of most Americans, who cares ! Ferrari will somehow survive and thrive in the F1 arena regardless of who is in charge. I know if I started complaining about the changes in management of the current NASCAR teams, there would be a lot of backlash also.

[javadog]

I think the changes were ill-advised. Granted, I have no direct knowledge of the situation but I am wary of the Italians running the show. In the modern era, their record in Formula 1 has been pretty poor, with only the Schumacher/Todt/Brawn/Byrne combination doing anything worth mentioning. Prior to that, you have to go back to the 70's, where they one a handful of titles with Lauda and Scheckter.

I fear the recent form will continue.

Ferrari does not need Fiat, for anything.

JR

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by javadog

Ferrari does not need Fiat, for anything.

JR

Actually Fiat makes a great reference point. By comparison, Ferraris are incredibly reliable

[dan79brooklyn]

I keep hearing that Ross Brawn is going to Ferrari next year. He has a VERY successful record.
That said I do think next season looks rough. And I don't expect much from Vettel or Iceman. I thought Alonso deserved a better car. He certainly can drive above the cars potential.

[Captain Ahab Jr]

OP, stoooooooooop, please for your own sake!

You have less than no idea about what is going on within Ferrari.

You write like someone that thinks they have a handle of the situation within the team but in reality you haven't got a clue.

Just one last thing, no one at Woking will be laughing as they now have a new Honda engine

[javadog]

What's your take on things?

I can see the new guy as being tight with Bernie but the ink's barely dry on the newest agreement with the teams, so I don't know what a big picture guy will do for the team right now.

I think the main job is getting the right people in the right jobs and getting the results they should deliver. I'm not sure all of the jobs have been filled by the right people recently.

Did Mattiacci not have things headed in the right direction? Or was this a result of Luca leaving and the new guy on top wanting his own choice in the position?

JR

[strupgolf]

Wow Captain, aren't you the freaking expert on all things Ferrari.

[jyl]

Wow Captain, aren't you the freaking expert on all things Ferrari.

He is in F1.

[Tilikum Turbo]

Originally Posted by jyl

He is in F1.

Not always, but sometimes you can't see the Forrest from the tree's...

[Typ616]

Originally Posted by Captain Ahab Jr

OP, stoooooooooop, please for your own sake!
You write like someone that thinks they have a handle of the situation within the team but in reality you haven't got a clue.

That's rough... Factually the OP was 100% correct on Ferrari.
Domenicali is gone. They fired Mattiaci after a few months. They let Alonso go, and he was by far the best of their 2 drivers. Vettel could not drive his way out of a wet paper bag this year, and Ricciardo embarassed him. Doesn't sound like the guy you'd want in your team to direct development (Kimi either, apparently)... It kinda looks like Ferrari is back to their old ways. If you have some insider information, please share !

On the McLaren front though, I agree nobody should be laughing too hard after the new Honda engine only ran for 5 laps !
Except those 2, for some reason...

[Captain Ahab Jr]

Originally Posted by javadog

What's your take on things?
JR

Thanks for asking, my take on F1 things in general is based on previous experience, current knowledge and knowing of a few of the characters involved.

F1 is a super political game played at many levels by ruthlessly competitive people. It's a games played at the top of the sport all the way down to individual departments within a team.

I've worked for a number of teams and still work for a team, coming up to nearly 20 yrs. I've always tried not to be a player or one of the pawns within the political games that go on within a team. I have no time for it as from my experience all it achieves is instability and loss of focus on the extremely difficult almost impossible task of trying to win.

For me, Mattiacci went due to political reasons within the company and within the sport of F1. I guess the new-Mattiacci must be considered to be a stronger player, the results over time will be the judge of him being the right man.

As for Alonso I'm guessing he left because of repeated promises of a championship winning car that never happened and buckets full of cash from Honda would have helped too.

I can sympathise as faced the similar dilemma a number of times, not the buckets of cash but promises of change for the better, it doesn't you get tired of waiting and see no reason for it happening. So you either sit tight and wait for something that may never happen or take charge and make the changes happen by moving. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose.

I would agree Alonso can drive the wheels of anything better than any other F1 driver but his Ferrari cars took him to championship winning position in 2 final races of the season. Not winning cars but far from a being dogs.

I agree with the team letting Alonso go, there is no point chaining someone to a team when they don't want to be there, it serves no purpose other than lowering moral of the other people in the team.

I understand the Ferrari F1 team makes money and doesn't suck money from Fiat or Ferrari.

By the nature of F1 boundaries are pushed to the limit, often there are disagreements of how, when and which boundaries are pushed. This applies to rules, engine reliability, aerodynamic stability, structures strength, design and manufacturing time, etc, etc the list is endless.

While pushing these boundaries most people involved are also working as fast, hard and for as long is humanly possible.

Mistakes happen, wrong choices made, the right people are not heard or listened to, the right people are in the wrong job, unforeseen events conspire against you, its the nature of the game etc, etc.

When the inevitable happens and the results are not what are expected there are two ways a team can react. The people above you pick you up, dust you off, give you extra support to find a solution for fixing it or learning from the failure. In short what doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

Or the other reaction is someone is taken outside and shot in front of the rest of the team as an example of what happens to people that make a mistake or to save face for someone who failed to take responsibility for not listening to the right person when they voiced their concerns. F1 is very inbred so some shooting victims go onto be very successful in other teams but occasionally the right target is dealt with and removed from the team.

One reaction makes the team stronger so it can put more effort into finding new performance boundaries to push, improved ways of working both on solutions and as a team. This over time creates a higher chance of producing a winning car but is in no way guaranteed

One reaction creates a culture of fear, people don't want to be targets so naturally back away from boundaries, voicing their concerns if in disagreement, distancing themselves from the few brave people that still push boundaries to the maximum in case they associated with them and get caught up in crossfire. The team gradually slows down from running flat out but to a slower pace and over time the car becomes less competitive.

The other factor to consider is a F1 team is made up largely of specialists but it needs a few master blender generalist. These master blenders are usually referred to as chief designers and technical directors. As an F1 car is so complicated there are very few master blenders that know what the right blend is, how to blend the different parts, in what order of priority for blending, what quantity of each part to blend, when to stop blending the different parts before mixing, how long to mix the different parts and how late to leave the pouring. People like Ross Brawin, Adrian Newey, Rory Byrne, Gordon Murray can do it, for every special person can do there are at least another few dozen that think they can do it but in reality can't.

There are also things like investing in the right areas for the the now, short term future and long term future, playing the long strategy game with the rules to put the team in the best place to make use of its advantages, finding the right people and getting all of them to run in the right direction at the same time. An F1 team is a huge complex thing to get right and there is no hiding from the results as its put out there for everyone to see.

Sorry I could go on but hope this helps

Originally Posted by strupgolf

Wow Captain, aren't you the freaking expert on all things Ferrari.

I've been doing I what I do long enough to be considered an expert but certainly not all things Ferrari.

Originally Posted by Tilikum Turbo

Not always, but sometimes you can't see the Forrest from the tree's...

Very true

Originally Posted by Typ616

That's rough... Factually the OP was 100% correct on Ferrari.
If you have some insider information, please share !
[/IMG]

If the OP is still reading his thread then I hope he will accept my apology for being a bit harsh but fair, no offence was intended.

I never disputed the facts but challenged his knowledge of the content which he type so convincingly about.

Sorry I have no insider information to share!