sure to be a hotbutton issue: dontmarry.wordpress.com

[scottmandue]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

wow, thats about the most sexist thing said in this thread, and its by someone in defense of marriage .... yikes.

So... you are exactly the same as a women?
Are you capable of birthing a child and nursing it?

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by scottmandue

So... you are exactly the same as a women?
Are you capable of birthing a child and nursing it?

why did you edit the rest of my post?

i perfectly clarified my statement, and you simply decided to edit it out, and add a straw-man for good measure.

[Seahawk]

I get all that. Here is what my wife and I did: I changed my career so she could succeed.

I was a fleet guy in the Navy on track. It is a hard life but my wife and I were ready to accept that challenge since I was on my way. We evolved a bit and it was apparent that we should husband her career as well as mine. WE made this decision.

My wife is really, really smart, folks.

So we did. I went from a fleet guy to becoming an Aerospace Engineering Duty Officer. This entailed spending time apart, doing the Au Pair thing, managing a lot of added burdens most couples don't face. In total time since we married, including fleet tours, we spent 6 of the first 14 years of our marriage apart so she could stay in one area and further her career unimpeded.

So, given OUR choices, she has matched her male peers step for step and has done spectacularly well.

Again, these were our choices, our puts and takes: Gross measurements of wages between men and women are meaningless and mask the every day decisions that BOTH men and women make together that occasion how we earn.

I don't need a government supporting drone to help me in figuring out the math of life...not you MBA

Originally Posted by MBAtarga

There is a Freakonomics podcast on this subject that I listened to recently. They had a guest (female) researcher/professor (Harvard I think) that is THE expert on wage inequality. From the podcast transcript:

The True Story of the Gender Pay Gap - Freakonomics Freakonomics

If you take women who don’t have caregiving obligations, they’re almost equal with men. It’s somewhere in the 95 percent range. But when women then have children, or again are caring for their own parents or other sick family members who need care, then they need to work differently. They need to work flexibly, and often go part-time. They often get less-good assignments because their bosses think that they’re not going to want work that allows them to travel, or they’re not going to be able to stay up all night, or whatever it is. And so then you start — if you’re working part-time, you don’t get the same raises. And if you’re working flexibly your boss very typically thinks that you’re not that committed to your career, so you don’t get promoted.

[EMJ]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

right, legal blackmail. you can't leave otherwise it will hurt you even more.

thats a terrible reason to get married.



wow, thats about the most sexist thing said in this thread, and its by someone in defense of marriage .... yikes.

women are just as capable of acting like adults and making rational and reasonable decisions and being held accountable to them.

Not legal blackmail at all. It's called commitment in the eyes of the law; besides, marriage has been around for thousands of years. Good luck finding a woman who will have your kids and commit herself to you when you won't even marry her. Lonely life. Men's lib stuff.

Ironically, you'll wonder why there are issues in the relationship and can't imagine why.

[scottmandue]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

why did you edit the rest of my post?

i perfectly clarified my statement, and you simply decided to edit it out, and add a straw-man for good measure.

Why did you bother to start this thread? You obviously have a closed mind on the subject.

[dennis in se pa]

Did not get married until I was 36. 2 kids raised and 26 years later we were not happy together so we ended it on friendly terms. I live with 2 dogs so I am not alone. 2.5 years into being single I have no drive/desire to even date anymore. Being 64 and at peace, learning to be content/happy where I am. That's a good place to be. I am glad I was married, I am glad I have 2 kids, I am glad to be at peace now. It is all good. This is different for everyone. So arguing about it is silly.

[aschen]

Originally Posted by dennis in se pa

Did not get married until I was 36. 2 kids raised and 26 years later we were not happy together so we ended it on friendly terms. I live with 2 dogs so I am not alone. 2.5 years into being single I have no drive/desire to even date anymore. Being 64 and at peace, learning to be content/happy where I am. That's a good place to be. I am glad I was married, I am glad I have 2 kids, I am glad to be at peace now. It is all good. This is different for everyone. So arguing about it is silly.

I was trying not to get sucked into what I think is essentially a baiting argument, but your comments reminded me of the reaction I had to some earlier posts.

There were some comments about happy marriages that end after 20 years. Its not the best possible outcome, but its hard to have to have too many regrets if you were really happy during the time and perhaps have loving children as a result.

I got married at about 35 and I have only been married 4 years so I may still be in the honeymoon stage. I dont know what the future holds but I always thought that there is no way I could hate my wife, even if things get bad. She gave me my children and that is enough for her to get a do not hate pass. I hope I never have to test this hypothesis of course.


Also I think there are just as many men that try to get commitments from apprehensive women as the other way around. Hell probably some of you ugly dudes have hot sweet wives that you tried to get locked into a marriage ASAP

Again get married if you like or don't. Aint no need for drama either way. Writing an essay about your profound and novel thought that marriage sucks is about as useful as writing an essay about the futility of driving a sports car

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by scottmandue

Why did you bother to start this thread? You obviously have a closed mind on the subject.

nice dodge.

im open to new evidence and experience, but no one seems to be presenting any, despite my frequent requests of it.

and a lot of defenses of it, really show how crazy it really is.

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by EMJ

Not legal blackmail at all. It's called commitment in the eyes of the law; besides, marriage has been around for thousands of years. Good luck finding a woman who will have your kids and commit herself to you when you won't even marry her. Lonely life. Men's lib stuff.

Ironically, you'll wonder why there are issues in the relationship and can't imagine why.

why would i want to have kids?


i've been given the ultimatum twice in my life, once explicitly, once pretty quietly, and said no thank you each time. some of the best decisions ive made in my life.

and you continue to make sexist remarks about women. if a woman is acting like a child, irrational and ridiculous ... why would i ever want to date her, never mind marry her? dear lord, dump that the second it shows up and save yourself the mess, no need to wonder why.

[aschen]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

im open to new evidence and experience, but no one seems to be presenting any, despite my frequent requests of it.
.

There is exactly as much supporting evidence for marriage here as there is evidence against it.

[aschen]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

im open to new evidence and experience, but no one seems to be presenting any, despite my frequent requests of it.

and a lot of defenses of it, really show how crazy it really is.

I think this is disingenuous, there is just as much evidence in this thread supporting marriage as there is against it.

You know there are no new experiences that could change your opinion on the matter. Its just as crazy to be against marriage as it is to be for it.

Hell if 40% of people who get married are regretful, then the "science" says you should get married. You have a better than even chance of wedded bliss.

You might as well have an argument with a shark about the merits of being a vegetarian

[Baz]

OK......I have a question regarding MARRIAGE.

What is the #1 overall reason a man marries a woman....and what is the #1 reason a woman marries a man?

I'm talking about the #1 MAIN reason if a poll was taken of every person who marries in the entire country.

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by aschen

There is exactly as much supporting evidence for marriage here as there is evidence against it.

no one has cited something a legal marriage has, that no other relationship can have. especially if you take the child rearing of the table.

[scottmandue]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

nice dodge.

im open to new evidence and experience, but no one seems to be presenting any, despite my frequent requests of it.

and a lot of defenses of it, really show how crazy it really is.

You obviously are not 'open' to anything but your own preconceived notions about women and marriage.

I'm out.

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by scottmandue

You obviously are not 'open' to anything but your own preconceived notions about women and marriage.

I'm out.

you not having a compelling point isn't a fault with my argument.

[motion]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

no one has cited something a legal marriage has, that no other relationship can have. especially if you take the child rearing of the table.

There is probably something involved with wills and probate, where a 'girlfriend' will not be entitled to anything, in the event of the man's death. All assets would shift to next of kin (children). With a marriage, assets would be shifted to the wife. Same goes for SS benefits, and possibly disability, pension, etc.

[aschen]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

no one has cited something a legal marriage has, that no other relationship can have. especially if you take the child rearing of the table.

I agree with you marriage is pointless, as is nearly everything in this context. People get married because they want to. You dont because you don't want to.


And taking childcare off the table is a pretty big caveat as well for most people. Bacon is pretty healthy as well when you take out the sat fat and sodium.

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by motion

There is probably something involved with wills and probate, where a 'girlfriend' will not be entitled to anything, in the event of the man's death. All assets would shift to next of kin (children). With a marriage, assets would be shifted to the wife. Same goes for SS benefits, and possibly disability, pension, etc.

that is true, i will grant you that.

[aschen]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

no one has cited something a legal marriage has, that no other relationship can have. especially if you take the child rearing of the table.

I cant get this logic. Marriage has one thing no other relationship can have which is getting married. Thats it and that all some people want out of it.

What does nonmarriage have that can't be had in a marriage where both participants agree to no formal commitments but get married anyways? Its an absurd circle.

[aschen]

I interpreted the discussion as philosophical more than pragmatic, but in this new light I submit insurance.

As sombody who had a baby with my wife before I was married, let me assure you this is a big one. The benefits people will try to hold back their laughter if you ask them to add a non legal dependant to your plan.