I don't entirely disagree with you JD. In no way is a YouTube video guaranteed to be representative of an entire generation; I hope and pray it's horribly distorted and that those interviewed are are exceptions to their peers.

Your point about videos not being representative loses no validity regardless, but I'm curious, did you watch the video?

I did. It's sad. They not only represent millennials poorly, but their country, and the entire species! I dislike stupidity whether it comes from the young, the old, the white, the black, the men, the women, the neutral?

What I also dislike is when people use "the stupid" to generalize about a generation. I've been guilty of it in the forum too, mostly because I was trying to fight some fire with fire, but was ironically immediately called out as ageist. This has been going on forever. With a lot of criticism being given to the millennials. Not sure if the overall criticism volume has varied throughout the years, but I feel like the millennials are certainly getting a lot of attention. But hey, it could be the same as it always has been, but social media now allows for the criticism to be even more public and widespread. An argument could be made that we are the first generation to be young adults during this technological transition period, and as such are seeing what normal levels of generational criticism will be like in the future. What used to be water-cooler talk, is now front-line media. "Millennials are lazy according to tail end baby boomers". "Millennials are weak, scared by Trump written on sidewalk".

For example. Check out these millennials. I'm worried about the future!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1463587672.jpg

Or how about those Americans! I'm worried about the future!

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/_mWtWz_aGyk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


Stupid will always exist. Unfortunately, they get a lot of attention....

Someone from across the ocean might see the above video, and really think Americans are stupid. Sure, quite a few might be, but as a whole, I think you guys are pretty smart! Not so much the government, but the people!

PS. Responded on my phone. May have grammatical inconsistencies.

There are winners and losers in every generation. Based on my own experience, I think there is a greater proportion of losers in the millennial population. I've hired and fired 5 assistants in 3 months, 2 of whom cried a few times on the job, one of whom couldn't handle the stress of doing inventory. Had never seen anything like it. Ended up with a stoner Gen X who was worlds better.

As mentioned earlier, I also blame it on the every kid gets an award mentality combined with parent's need to be their kid's friend. But mostly on schools in which no one shines brightly because it would hurt the less intelligent and less motivated kids' feelings. One of my strongest memories in life was 3rd grade. Our teacher created a star system and awarded stars for how well you did in class and on homework. There was a huge poster on the wall, each kid's name and a successive row of stars added across the sheet as the year went by. In the last 2 months, 2 girls and I were neck and neck and all three of us were doing extra homework, skipping ahead in the lesson plan, raising our hands more, and more vigorously, etc. so we could win. My doubling of the number of homonyms required in a homework assignment and doing a few synonyms sealed the deal, though the other two girls were more intelligent. I just worked harder. And loved the competition.

That poster would never be allowed today.

If this is truly the case, it is not the kids fault, but the teachers and parents. The kids just went to school and participated. They never controlled the rules and policies.

Which means the generation of losers is the tail-end baby-boomers for being such $hitty role-models and educators for the youth. That would be how they produced such dysfunction, IF you believe there is more dysfunction now in millennials than anytime before. Which I believe is false.

PS. My dad has hired a ton of just awful tail-end baby boomers. He's a tail-end baby boomer. I'm sure when I'm doing the hiring, I'll go through a whole bunch of people my own age who I can't believe exist, as well as some young "slackers". It's the way of life.

Don't get me wrong, as a millennial, I rant all the time about how stupid the "everyone is a winner mentality" really is. Should be outlawed.

The best part is, at some point, anyone who as a child became skewed by this mentality, will get into the real world, and will learn that not everyone is a winner.

Adult sports, your neighbour, the workplace and most of the people you meet will teach you that not everyone can win. Ya sure some people might want things for free, and they might get a few things for free, but that will have limits. A lazy millennial won't get that nice house, or that nice car, or that great wife, or that great job, etc etc etc....

They'll figure it out. I did, many years ago. Some will figure it out earlier, some later.

Re the psychedelic bus of the Merry Pranksters, they were purposefully and demonstrably _counter_ cultural. Demographers (and idiots like me :) ) are interested in what _mainstream_ millennialism is about. The trends, what's embraced (social media, Uber, tech) and what's rejected (home buying? Car buying?).

As you state, every generation wonders if the next one is different in some unique and or significant way. As a 50 year old I watched and listened to the discussions about Gen X (mostly "pull up your pants" and Gen Y "I worried about all the video games Marge!"

From my vantage point, the discussion about Millenials is different. They are the first generation to come of age in the period following the economic collapse of 2008, and I think this profoundly affects their buying habits. And depending on how you define it, they/you are also the generation that doesn't remember a world before the Internet.

As someone who has reproduced thrice, and is himself from the tail end of the baby boom, the subject of Millenials is near and dear to me. My oldest is working in mid-town Manhattan making good living and good use of her classical liberal education. My next Millenial graduates from the Naval Academy next Friday with a degree in Chinese. And my youngest Millenial is a second year (dreaded?) STEM major. We are solidly middle class, and I'll be honest, I/we do not encounter the level of ignorance seen in that Watters video in my work life (I own a construction company so...) or in the friends of my Millenials. Those answers were appalling. But you're also right hat those Boomers in the video you posted are no better. Point well taken - there's plenty of stupid to go around.

I'll pray that (what I think is) your assertion is correct - that the Millenial generation is not as bad off as I and others have suggested. I really do hope you're right! For everyone's sake!

Good post! This is the stuff I like. The youtube video post activated my keyboard warrior self and I start hurling insults :D

One thing to note, "Millennials" are a broad demographic. It's a bit of a gray area. Gen Z is in my mind born 2002+, whereas a millennial is technically defined to be born as early as the early 80's to 2000's, which is a bit vague, because Gen Z according to the wiki can start as early as 1995.

There is some consensus that it is early 1980s to 1995 for Millennials. Since I was born in 1991, I consider myself a Millennial, which is a Gen Y.

The kids who are really immersed in the technology and social-networking are those of Gen Z. Some say they are also early, mid or late 1990's, although I believe it is those born 2002+, because the are considered the iGeneration, and mid 90's is too early for that.

I remember when we got dialup, my PC 133mhz computer that I hated, playing NHL 95 in MS-DOS, and The Simpsons! Whereas my youngest brother, born around 2005, only knows wifi, highspeed, and windows 7.

That would be my argument. I could very well be wrong, and all the children of the pelicans, their friends, the ignorance that you HAVEN'T encountered in your line of work, and my experiences, are all an anomaly while the vast majority of people my age are completely useless! But if your in a room with 20 kids, and 4 of them start throwing a tantrum, those are the only one going to be noticed. With social media as ripe as it is and the current media, I think that is where this stigma comes from and keeps gaining momentum. Sure, we will have our generational differences because of recessions and changes in technology, work ethic can also change, but I wouldn't write off a generation just yet.

Only time will tell, and like you, I hope I'm right. SmileWavy

Funny example of Millennial thinking I'll add. Dad asked me to unload about 15 bags of mulch. I agreed, but I'll do it my way. He said just take the bags and unload it (wheelbarrow broke). I said no. I put 2 maybe 4 foot 2x4's on the ground, put the bags horizontally on the wood, and my brother and I carried 5 bags a load! Worked amazing. I felt 1 bag at a time was too much effort so found a more efficient way of doing things. He scoffed at my idea, because it made "hard work" a little easier. I could see him smiling and he said "lazy bugger".:D:D

Now put someone who is perhaps older, grumpier and more stubborn (sammyg2 is a perfect example) in that position, and they would of called us young slackers! And voila, a stigma is born.

Clarity! And even some agreement - I like that.

Good luck in your future - it needs to remain bright much longer for you (and my own Millennials) than for me!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4IjTUxZORE

if only we had another generation as terrible as the boomers were. they were given everything, they destroyed it, and they blame us for being entitled. lol.

this is why i've never understood the bashing of the younger generation.

you guys raised us, your just saying you guys were ****ty as parents, politicians, economists, and teachers. congrats boomers, you were terrible!

I mis-speel stuff all the time on porpoise, but not when I'm calling someone else dumb or stupid.
Kinda takes something off the punch if you know what I mean.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1463596982.gif



I think we need to go back and start blaming the hippies again.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...sagreement.svg

no one cares. get a real counterpoint.

Oh boy. You're pathetic.

That is much longer to type on mobile. Get over it.

Wasn't talking to you douche bag, ya sniveling cowardly POS.
And I mean that in the nicest way.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1463597777.jpg

lel

http://f.tqn.com/y/netforbeginners/1/W/-/V/haters.jpg

come back when you have more than insults and grammar corrections.

Since we are doing a spelling and grammar check, "kinda" is not a word in the English language.

Kind of takes something off the punch if you know what I mean.

But you probably used "kinda" because you don't need to include the space or the "of" so it's easier to type in an informal setting. Right?

Perhaps if you can wrap your brain around the concept, my incorrect usage of your, was for the same reason, as your use of "kinda". It's shorter, easier to type, and everyone knows exactly what your saying in an informal setting.

That Punk is in, I'm out. There's no being civil with him.

All was good until Sammy chimed and and busted my balls about my your usage after we had a good discussion.

can't hack it?

figures.

the boomers were given cheap college, a US manufacturing industry second to none, a world where a single blue collar income could raise a middle class family, and they protested our involvement in foreign wars.

they hiked up the price of college astronomically, killed the US manufacturing industry, destroyed the unions and cut middle class wages, and got us involved in nearly constant wars.

and don't try to blame us, we were not even adults, much less of voting age. you were. you did this.

and now we get called entitled, because we are working harder than the boomers, for less money than the boomers, and we are on average 10-50 grand in debt because of the boomers, and we still can't get jobs because you crashed the economy for us.

and we are entitled? WE ARE ENTITLED?

there is nothing in the world more entitled than the boomers. you were given it all, and you wrecked it. the greatest generation fraught and died for your lifestyle, and you sold them out, and gave us ****. and now you try to accuse us of being the problem?

take your own advice sometime, take some responsibility for your actions boomers. you did this.

When I come across a hard working teen or early 20-something who wants a job, I want to hire them. And I sometimes do. But I insist on hiring experienced people.

Those (millennials) who have no relevant experience are told "no but thank you for your interest".

Those who ask where can they get experience if no one will hire them, I tell "Not my problem. Ask Obama, he didn't have any either".

I don't blame the millenials for the problems that the boomers created, and they are not done creating more - I just think it's really hard to find a millenial that is accountable and willing to work. That's not a pejorative statement, it's just a fact. And the reason that I insist on experience? The minimum wage has gone up 25% in the past 2 years. That's hyper inflationary. And it'll go up another 50% in the next 5 unless the Greatest Generation rises up in protest to stop the boomers from wrecking the economy. The millenials are too stupid and naive to know that the country will be destroyed by a $15 per hr. minimum wage. They listen too much to Sanders and Obama, thinking that they are leading the country to a better place, blah blah blah

Not to derail too much into a min wage debate, but what about the purchasing power of min wage now vs in the past?

A number of resources indicate that the real purchasing power of min wage has declined substantially since 1968.

Lets just for argument sake assume that it has and accept that point as true. Do point out if I am completely wrong. I can link to a couple of these things but just do a google for min wage and real purchasing power.

Obviously, if the min wage has to be increased substantially, in order to reinstate its real purchasing power, this will have negative effects on businesses and the economy.

So if the min wage cannot be raised to its once former glory, and relative to other countries the current min age isn't actually that bad, what does a country do?

Relative to other countries, the wage isn't that bad, relative to previous real purchasing power, it is far worse, but increasing it will wreck the economy. Moreover, it isn't like a ton of well paying family supporting jobs can just be created out of thin air. The companies, and those who hold all the money (certain big corporations, not the small and medium sized businesses) could do just fine paying employees more money, but won't because that will hurt the bottom line and shareholders won't be too pleased.

Looks like some kind of Chinese finger trap.

The min wage is the Boomer's favorite experiement.

The issue is whether you're keeping up with inflation or not. And some regions have higher economic activity and higher costs of living than others. So this should be handled at the local, not even state or federal level.

The answer for you is that the best solution is to allow small businesses to grow. Cut back their taxes and regulatory oversight. Their growth will drive up wages and employment. Period. End of report.

Good answer.

Wouldn't increasing the min wage locally drive those businesses that have to conform out of that area to a cheaper area? It would be like musical chairs but instead of moving ones buttocks, you move economic activity.

the minimum wage compared to the cost of living is WAY down. if it had kept up with the cost of living, it would be over 20 dollars an hour right now.

so ... swing and a miss.

Even if that is the case, and the minimum wage is way down compared to the cost of living, increasing it to over 20 dollars an hour, or even 15 dollars an hour, that fast, would have some serious ripples in the economy, especially small and medium sized businesses.

No, it's not about businesses not wanting to pay more, it's about the ability to pay more.

You either maintain margins or you close. (see the Idiot's response above. So dense there is no use in even discussing with him)

Here's how it works: When you are busy, you are making more money. You pay more to your better employees because everyone else is busy too, and they can switch employers. You know that, they know it, and you give them a raise. You hire more employees. Thus, wages and employment increase. You can also afford to raise prices because of your higher costs, and you're confident because you're busy that sales will not fall.

When you're not busy, and there is a recession (as there is now), you cut back. You control costs or you go out of business. When the government mandates a wage increase, you are forced to raise your prices or you go out of business. If sales fall as a result, you close.

When there are regional differences, such as in a urban center vs rural areas, and a government mandated minimum wage raises payroll faster than inflation (hello "Idiot" this is for you), then you can't pass those costs on fast enough to offset employment costs and you close, despite which area you're in. When the urban area can absorb the employment cost increases, the rurual area may not. It does not matter if a business from the urban area relocates to the rural area - it will close too. That results in an entire region having higher unemployemnt and less economic activity, other than government assistance such as welfare. If you really study California outside of the coastal cities, you can see this in action in real time, with real people and real dollars.

That is exacly correct, JD. You understand.

I 'am a boomer ..... I have been totally pissed how things have unfolded from the time of Regan as Ca. Governor, forward...... A total head shrink on the boomer generation, "The powers that be" wrapped then selves in the winning "cloths" of the baby boomers, they would play the songs of the baby boomers as background music to sell any thing from pesticide to automobiles. The baby boomers wanted a taste of the good "things" in life as advertised. Regan was able to convince the public that the working man was undeserving. The air traffic controller take down was embraced by the media and businesses started taking down their employees unions by offering them cash to become "independent contractors", they would make more per hour and not have to pay union dues..... This worked and you would meet people in the gym that would say "screw the unions they never done anything for me".... Sadly ... a lot of those workers today have little or no private pension because of their choice...
Before the internet bubble there was the tech bubble that sucked in a lot of boomers trying to make up their retirement nest egg by buying stocks... When the market fell apart the Republicans were able to convince the public that it was the Democrats fault and they needed to vote Republican to save the market.... This lead to runaway government investment in arms and oversees operations and gave "comfort" to US companies to build and invest in foreign countrys.

I certainly haven't blamed Millenials for anything.

I think the so-called "Greatest Generation" only looks so in comparison to the generations that followed it. I don't think they were "great" relative to the ones that came before it.

And that generation, while great at some things - maybe even many things - failed in some key areas. And I know many of them who would or who did agree.

They failed to stamp out the seeds of progressivism in the 1920's-30's that allowed the Frankfurt School to take a hold of the universities in the 40's and 50's. You know, we really had almost no PhD before then in the US. Today the least free place for speech in America is the college campus, and teacher programs uniformly act to ensure Johnny can't read. And the Greatest Generation failed to stop the programs that willfully set to dismantle a great education system in this country.

They failed to understand the scope and the extent of the assault on the family. Some saw it - like the Esteemed Democrat Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan for one - warned prophetically about what the country would be like if children were raised without a father in the home. But most on both sides of the aisle ignored the warning signs.

And that Greatest Generation took for granted that the things that make us uniquely American. I don't think they understood how they needed to be actively taught, that they're not absorbed like through osmosis. And while they understood freedom was under attack by the Nazis and by the Japnese, I think they missed the more subtle attacks on the American values that support and promote freedom, liberty and natural law.

So no - I don't attack Millenials. I did my level best to raise three of them, and now they are productive members of society. I do fear for their future at times, but that's pretty normal when it comes to parents of my age.

yeah it would be a HUGE boon for them.

more customers, with more money. nothing increases the velocity of money like low wage workers making more money.

in fact, most small businesses support raising the minimum wage: Small Business Majority Poll - Small Businesses Support Increasing Minimum Wage

I only mention the "Greatest Generation" because they are retired. Here's what's going to happen. By 2020, when minimum MINIMUM wage is $15 per hr, the cost to the employee for the booger eating fresh out of middle school newbie worker will be a staggering $22 per HOUR. A McDonald's #1 value meal is going to be around $20. We will see everyone from Starbucks to Home Depot simply close up in rural areas.

And the Greatest Generation will have to go back to work, competing with Millenials for minimum wage jobs in order to make ends meet.

You guys on the board are mostly older than me. You want that for you? I don't want that for my parents.

Thats true, but that would take a while. A few extra dollars wouldn't suddenly translate to enough money to buy all kinds of $hit, its only a few extra dollars.

Over time, that might be accurate, and people will spend more. But the immediate effects will be substantial. It would be a huge gamble. You can't just ask all the business in America to take a hit for a few years so people MIGHT spend more in the future.

I'm all for a huge min wage increase. If everyone could make 20 bucks an hour it would be fantastic, well not everyone. The burger flipper shouldn't make 20 bucks an hour. That is a student/transition job. You can't buy houses flipping burgers and you shouldn't be able to. But reaching a more comfortable pay for the majority of workers would take careful planning, time, and honesty.

Kinda is a slang term. The user KNOWS it is not proper English and the user does not try to use it or present it as proper English.
I don't use it to save time, but now that you mention it there are several milliseconds at stake that I could put to a better use!

Now let's talk about your and You're for a millisecond.

Confusing a possessive adjective for a contraction leads people to suspect it is due to a lack of eduma-cation as if you did not know any better.
And no I don't want to super-size that order! ;)

(philosophy major joke)

people will spend more, because the poor live paycheck to paycheck. they spend all the money they make, putting it back into the economy, paying some other workers wages.

don't take my word for it, here is the man gordon gekko was based on, confirming why the poor making more money directly, and nearly instantly increases the velocity of money:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wAa9DqHZtM

FWIW my comments re the Greatest Generation were for that close minded little Punk.

And also re that same demographic, aren't they all retirement age or worse?

Personally I think the Boomers (my age and older) get as much of the blame as anyone. And it's the retired Boomers who may have to get off their butts and get back to work - especially those who retire in their 50's, and I don't care what they did for a living.

really? i don't thread after thread started by folks complaining how lazy, entitled and stupid boomers are.

yet this is a fairly regular occurrence when it comes to millennials.

Here is the deal: I own a small business, am partnered in another. All you folks are doing is making labels and trying to hang them on someone.

We look for smart, talented people with a work ethic. When we find them we pay them accordingly. The four best composite lay-up workers we have are a family from Romania, here legally. Dad was a MIG-21 pilot, Mom ran a fiberglass lay-up shop and their two children are more focused than CP with a paintball gun at $20 an hour.

Nobody in small business cares if you are a Millennial or the Millennium Falcon.

Can you contribute to our bottom line? The average small business hire stays with the small business two years before moving on. I hire talent, not age.

It does not work like that in the real world. Sorry Komrade.

People should get paid based on what their labor or work is worth, supply and demand.

If any idiot off the street can do a job, and there are plenty of idiots WILLING to do it, then that job should pay about 50 cents an hour tops. (no offense CP) ;)

If a a person's work is very valuable and contributes a great deal to the profitability of a company, and there are only a very few people available who can perform that work at that high level, then that job should pay extremely well.

The world needs ditch diggers too Danny.

No minimum wage, no communism. It doesn't work, it never has and never will.

it does actually, in study after study.

Economic Research | The Effects of Minimum Wages on Employment

Effects of raising the minimum wage: Research and key lessons - Journalist's Resource Journalist's Resource

Research Shows Minimum Wage Increases Do Not Cause Job Loss | Business For a Fair Minimum Wage

it turns out the world is more complex than high school level economics.



personally i cannot figure out how someone can be both against raising the minimum wage, and welfare. i mean, im a bleeding heart liberal, but even me, if given a choice of who to give my money to help them, would choose someone working rather than someone not working. in this way, minimum wage functions as non-government welfare, with a perfect record of checking employment status. so if you don't want to raise the minimum wage, great, then your willing to pay for folks to survive who arnt working? or should they just die? or, you pay folks a living wage, even if there job isn't worth it, for the only reason of incetivizing doing SOMETHING rather than doing nothing.

so even from that side, even if you do believe every myth about minimum wage, if you want folks to work rather than not work, then STILL it makes sense to raise the minimum wage.