Looks like I'm going solar...PG&E makes it an easy decision

[biosurfer1]

Just moved into a new house and got quite the sticker shock with my first PG&E bill. I know I was spoiled with my old house being in Roseville (municipal utility) but wow.

Now on top of it, they have another rate increase proposed and they will be moving to time-of-use in the not too distant future.

Currently I have their typical E-1 rate which is $.18, .24, and .40 for baseline, 101%-200%, and 200%+ respectively. I've just started looking into solar and know I need to act fast to get in under Net Metering 1.0, but even with the new net metering rules, it still seems like it's an easy ROI.

So far I've received two quotes, both for ~5kW system, and both were within $500 of each other, $20k give or take before the 30% tax credit. 6-7 year payback currently with out any rate increases.

The hardest part is now deciding between a single inverter, micro inverters or the optimizer system. Seems like all have pro's/con's.

Any thoughts from those out there who have done this?

[SeanPizzle]

Rocklin here. 700 peak PGE bills in the summer in not a big house (2400 SF). The pool is sucking watts and the house isn't well built, in my opinion.

I have gotten several quotes for 9KW system. I hate that I can buy all the components for about 14K, yet have to pay 28-34K for a full system. I have watched these systems go up, and it's two men about a day to do the whole thing, plus an electrician to tie into the panel.

Here's the component cost of your 5Kw system for comparison:
http://www.wholesalesolar.com/1890905/wholesale-solar/complete-systems/4.73-kw-grid-tied-solar-system-with-solaredge-and-15x-astronergy-315-panels


I am seriously considering a DIY

Sean

[porsche4life]

Buy all the parts from RedBeard!

[Evans, Marv]

When I got my system installed, I looked at the 30% tax credit as offsetting the labor cost. For the OP, an after tax credit cost of $14K isn't too bad. I was under the impression the 5% level for the net metering program had been met - may be wrong though.

[SeanPizzle]

Originally Posted by Evans, Marv

When I got my system installed, I looked at the 30% tax credit as offsetting the labor cost. For the OP, an after tax credit cost of $14K isn't too bad. I was under the impression the 5% level for the net metering program had been met - may be wrong though.

You still can get the 30% if you DIY. My numbers would be about 15K (install parts, outsourced electrician for about 200 bucks, roof flashing/mount materials). So, $10.5K after Fed credit. I paid $3800 last year for electrical. ~3 year payback.

[Evans, Marv]

Not bad!! I decided to just do the bidding route and pay for it & get the installation over with. My 7.7KW system came in at $27K minus the 30%, & that's OK with me. The guys didn't take one day but three days to get it installed. It was a little more complicated & time consuming. It would have taken me a lot longer with going through the permitting & all that. Plus the net metering program was close to finishing & I wanted to maximize my chances of getting in on it.

[John Rogers]

I would suggest checking with Home Depot, Lowes and Costco vendors to see what they offer, of course they will have to come over and do an "assessment" and then give an estimate. You'll need a years worth of electrical bills that you can get on line.

As I posted earlier, I went with SunRun who is a Costco contractor for several reasons, better equipment I felt, better install plan and Costco gives you 10% of the hardware cost back as a rebate card. Mine took 80 days from estimate to turn on!

[quicksix]

SP,
Rocklin also, if you diy let me know and I will give you a hand, I'm over by the golf course formerly known as Sunset Whitney.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by biosurfer1

Just moved into a new house and got quite the sticker shock with my first PG&E bill. I know I was spoiled with my old house being in Roseville (municipal utility) but wow.

Now on top of it, they have another rate increase proposed and they will be moving to time-of-use in the not too distant future.

Currently I have their typical E-1 rate which is $.18, .24, and .40 for baseline, 101%-200%, and 200%+ respectively. I've just started looking into solar and know I need to act fast to get in under Net Metering 1.0, but even with the new net metering rules, it still seems like it's an easy ROI.

So far I've received two quotes, both for ~5kW system, and both were within $500 of each other, $20k give or take before the 30% tax credit. 6-7 year payback currently with out any rate increases.

The hardest part is now deciding between a single inverter, micro inverters or the optimizer system. Seems like all have pro's/con's.

Any thoughts from those out there who have done this?

Optimizers (SolarEdge) are mini-MPPT (Maximum Power Point Tracking) modules which allow each solar panel to put out maximum power for it's conditions. They are extremely good when you have an array which might have partial shading. No trees or shading structures, and they are not doing you much good. The system is then connected to basically a string inverter, with long strings in series. Better than string inverters, supposed to be less expensive than micro-inverters.

Micro-inverters take it a step further. Each solar panel independently converts power to AC, and then all the panels are connected in parallel and directly connected to your house wiring in 15A bundles.

A string inverter you just connect the solar panels in series back to a single large inverter.

Which is "best"? No shading then a regular string system will be fine and should be least expensive.

I am not a fan of standard Grid-Tied solar. I prefer battery based systems so that you also have off-line capability.

[red-beard]

If you want to "DYI", go with Micro-inverters. Most of the time the voltages on string inverters reach near 600V. Some of the new ones can create voltages in the 1000V region. Micro-inverters put out either 120VAC or 240VAC, single phase. Much safer for a DYI.

The biggest issue with DYI is the roof mounting. You want to create a very strong connection and you do not want to create roof leaks.

On our systems, the maximum voltage is around 120VDC. And if you do miss the net metering, our system can create net metering, by storing your excess solar in the battery bank, for use later in the day.

[red-beard]

One final thing. Even if you can't get full net metering, you will get paid for energy you export, just at a truly more reasonable price. Net metering was implemented when there was very little solar and it was easier for the utility to just "net" your energy than to measure all of the inflows and outflows.

And at the prices I see you have to pay in California, solar makes a lot of sense. Ridiculous!!!

[flatbutt]

A slight tangent plz. How do you maintain/repair the roof with solar panels in place?

[widebody911]

Originally Posted by flatbutt

A slight tangent plz. How do you maintain/repair the roof with solar panels in place?

I've wondered this myself

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by flatbutt

A slight tangent plz. How do you maintain/repair the roof with solar panels in place?

Step 1: Remove solar panels
Step 2: Repair roof
Step 3: Re-install solar panels

It is best to put in a new roof just before solar. OTOH, solar panels will extend the life of the roof.

[Evans, Marv]

I'm posting a pic of my roof mounts. If the roof ever needs replacing, it's going to be a real pain to remove the anchors. For this area, the power company recently changed from a three tiered pricing schedule to a two tiered schedule. Now the bottom 40% + or - is 19 cents, & the rest is 39 cents. I'm amazed at how the PUC lets them do anything to increase profits.

[John Rogers]

The main reason I went with a company was the city and utility company's permits. I would look very closely at what they require and things such as what sort of drawings are required, what sort of folks are required to do the conduit runs, breaker box work, ETC. There is way more to the solar install than just bolting panels on the roof.