Client brings employee in says 'he has problem with unemployment'

[RKDinOKC]

Basic income...

Had a brother on social security disability, he had Multiple Sclerosis. His SSD was so low the VA supplemented his income some, but not much. I tried several times to get him in home work he could do that he would end up doubling to tripling his income in a very short time and not even working full time. He refused because for every $1 he made he would lose $0.50 of SSD income. Just couldn't convince him that once he lost that free money he would be getting twice as much as he was getting for free. That's the Entitlement mindset Basic Income will breed.

And the children those people raise will have the same mindset as well.

Had my brother's son for a couple of years because my Brother couldn't handle the stress of a teenager with MS.
Gave my nephew the use of my lawn mower to make money for the two years he was with me.

There was a guy on our block that had two houses. The nephew got paid $20 to mow each of those two yards. However, the guy only wanted them mowed once a month. The grass got so tall it took him 4 hours mowing each of those 2 yards. There were several other neighbors that wanted their lawns mowed, but would not pay $20. They wanted their yards mowed once a week. Mowing them once a week he could have easily knocked out each of those yards in only 20 minutes.

The nephew would not move for less than $20. He felt he was Entitled to $20 a yard. Of course none of the neighbors that wanted their yards mowed weekly would pay over $5 to $7. Tried to explain to my nephew at the end of the month A $5 lawn made the same $20 but he would have only had to work an hour and 20 minutes instead of 4 hours. He refused to mow a yard for under $20 even though it would be less time worked for the same money. That is the Entitlement mindset.

Besides a part time job I mowed yards as a teen thru my first year of college. I did the $5 to $7 a lawn weekly mowing thing. Most want to pay me $15 to mow it every other week. I offered to mow it for half or less if they would let me mow it every week. Took care of 46 lawns. Spent 15 hrs/wk making $276/wk mowing lawns. Also worked 36hrs a week part time for $2.50/hr. or $90/week. Minimum wage was $2.30/hr. Figured mowing lawns I was making $18/hr.

Couldn't convince my nephew he was doing it wrong. He was his father's son. After he turned 16 he moved back with his Mom cause I wouldn't buy him a car (he was entitled to someone giving him a car). He didn't understand how when I turned 16 I bought my own car, and by the time I went to college I had given an out of work brother my first car and owned 3 others. On top of that had the money to go to college WITHOUT a student loan.

Basic Income becomes Entitlement and People do not want to lose it even if they could easily work a little and make more. That is basic human nature.

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by red-beard

The basic issue, many people who would never steal or defraud a person, have no issue with stealing from a government.

So true.

A close friend was laid off a few years ago and the employer couldn't even come up with his severance or vacation pay. He filed for UI the same day and truthfully disclosed that he had received no severance or vacation pay, was deemed eligible and started collecting. A few mos. later his former employer finally coughed up the money and told the UI Dept. they had done so. My buddy was in no rush to see his UI docked, so he sort of dragged his feet on reporting the sudden cash windfall. They came after him immediately. He's otherwise as honest as the day is long. But UI in AZ is less than min. wage, so he didn't feel like he was really doing anything wrong by waiting to see if the UI Dept. got wise.

[epbrown]

Originally Posted by red-beard

IF you must put people on "basic", make it like in the Novel "The Expanse".

I liked that concept in the books, but wasn't that a healthy chunk of the population?

[asphaltgambler]

A few of my wife's family members are quite satisfied with not living but just existing on disability benefits even though they are capable of working. So instead of bettering themselves, they all choose to move to Tennessee, to the poorest county with no personal property taxes so their day-to-day costs are significantly less than in the Northern Va area.

Even with that their 'income' level is such that they qualify for state benefits / assistance. I have witnesees no less than 3 generations of perpetuity of ' working' the system AND everyone else around them. Case in point: 'Grandmom' is now early 50's - has a 7th grade education, no skills other than above and working men on the internet to meet, have sex and scam money. 'Daughter' is now in mid 20's on exactly same path...........with the same resume. 'Grandson' is 10 yrs old, given up by Daughter to Grandmom who now receives additional $$ from Fed and state to take care of him.............which she does not. He appears well on his way to becoming a real problem as Grandma has moved 4 times in 3 years and we're pretty sure he has not attended school.

And this is just a small slice of the complete picture which as I type this crap ......................makes me so angry. They are a product of system where they choose to just exist, know better but refuse to move 1 inch forward. I have read that there are so many people on disability, especially younger ones that Social Security may have be tapped in the next 10 years to cover the shortage...........

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by epbrown

I liked that concept in the books, but wasn't that a healthy chunk of the population?

In "The Expanse", if you choose for anything other than basic, you have to go into government service for a couple of years to prove you will be a useful citizen, before they spend money on you.

"Basic" is a place to live and access to minimal food and clothing. As is shown in the novels, especially #5 and "The Churn", is that these people "supplement" their income with scams, prostitution, drugs, etc. And the police don't police those areas.

[Crowbob]

Originally Posted by asphaltgambler

A few of my wife's family members are quite satisfied with not living but just existing on disability benefits even though they are capable of working. So instead of bettering themselves, they all choose to move to Tennessee, to the poorest county with no personal property taxes so their day-to-day costs are significantly less than in the Northern Va...

And this is just a small slice of the complete picture which as I type this crap ......................makes me so angry. They are a product of system where they choose to just exist, know better but refuse to move 1 inch forward. I have read that there are so many people on disability, especially younger ones that Social Security may have be tapped in the next 10 years to cover the shortage...........

That won't help. There is nothing in SS to tap. Also, SSI (not SS Disabiltiy) comes out of the general fund because it is a welfare program.

[Evans, Marv]

I've told this before in another thread discussing people who live off of the system. I does illustrate how people get into these systems without realizing how bleak their futures may be. This was a woman in her fifties living the welfare life. She had a fourth grade level of educational ability, was crude enough to make the proverbial truck driver's face turn red with her language, but didn't have any criminal tendencies. She had had ten kids and had been living for years off of the money and benefits for them & herself from the welfare system. One day she was lamenting to me her last kid (who looked like a total gang banger) was turning eighteen soon. At that point, she wouldn't be receiving anything but her individual cash aid and benefits and was worrying about how she was going to survive. She didn't catch the irony when I said, "Oh, don't worry. I'm sure one of your ten kids will take you in and take care of you."

[asphaltgambler]

^^^^^^Tell her not to worry, I'm sure at least 1 or more of her kids will have kids of their own, who will abandon them - Grandma steps in, takes custody and receives benefits for that child...........eazy- peezy 2 legged retirement plan

[Evans, Marv]

Ha!! How did you know??

[asphaltgambler]

See my above story - but there's another brother who's wife does the same exact thing ...........she has 2 daughters 1 who just turn 18, another who is 23. Both had products of the system, they imitated Memaw, have kids of their own which they don't want, Memaw now has possession and receives benefits and other welfare for them.

[group911@aol.co]

So, how do you all propose to change the system?

[asphaltgambler]

Not sure of the answer as it requires more people and other resources to control it. Maybe Trump will have the solutions.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by group911@aol.co

So, how do you all propose to change the system?

Close the borders. Make a serious effort to find and punish severely anyone employing illegals. That should create a demand for entry level employees and push up competition and wages for them slightly. Announce that in 6 months you will cut of WIC, Section 8 and WIC...and in one year, the remaining income-based social welfare programs. Wait 6 months and then turn off WIC, Section 8 and the EIC. Give it six more months and turn off the rest of the income-based social welfare programs. Problem solved.

[RKDinOKC]

If you are on welfare for longer than 1 year you get spayed or neutered. If you are over 18 and give your kid(s) to another person(s) on welfare you get spayed or neutered if not already spayed or neutered from the 1 year limit. If you are under 18 and being supported by welfare and have more than 2 kids, you get spayed or neutered.

Had an uncle that built and rented single family homes to welfare recipients. The homes had to meet certain standards. He was guaranteed the rent from the government. He was also paid to maintain the homes while the recipients were living there. Periodically the homes were reviewed and if they didn't meet certain standards (the recipients had torn them up too much) the recipients were moved to another home. Then the government paid to have the home put back into the rentable standard.

My Uncle ran his business putting all the profits back into the business by buying and/or building homes for this purpose He only took enough out of the business for him and his family to live middle class. His home was 1400 sq ft and nothing fancy. He always drove a nice car, but nothing new or fancy.

When he passed his 3 kids inherited the business. After his passing they stopped buying and/or building new homes, just maintained what they already had. Within 6 months all three kids became cash millionaires. Within a year the daughter that managed the business in her fathers place became one of the most prominent and wealthy people in the small town they lived in.

Remember being 4 or 5 and my uncle driving me and my Dad to a neighborhood on the edge of the town they lived in. Proudly showed us a new house the he was planning to buy and what his plan was. It was his first rent house. It was a very small home and not at all impressive. My Dad passed before his BIL, the uncle and I don't think my Dad or anyone else ever really knew just how much the uncle was worth. It was a huge surprise to everyone in the family including his three kids just how much his business was worth.

[David]

Can I take it that all you folks against supporting the poor are big Planned Parenthood supporters?