restaurant servers assuming your change is their tip

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by Deschodt

Totally agree with Motion here... I'm good with 20% on cheap meals - even more sometimes, but 20% on a fancy $200 "city" dinner kinda hurts. - same work performed overall, sometimes worse in the fancy place with snooty waiters.

Again, the server is taxed on your check. If you have a $200 check, the IRS assumes the server made at least $16 on it, no matter how much you leave. Might not matter if one or two don't tip well, but if every customer felt like the higher rev. places didn't warrant the same percentage tips and the lower ones, it would definitely attract a lower quality of server.

[sammyg2]

Originally Posted by Holger

What is this with the tip in the USA? Automatically added to the amount? WHAT?
When I go out I pay the amount on the reciept, and then it is just polite to give some tip based on the service provided. But noone suggests or DEMANDS a tip and nothing is added automatically. That is just stupid and adds to the lazyness and bad service.

Agreed. AFAIC They need to earn a tip.
Other than me reminding them they should have paid more attention and gotten better grades in school like everyone told them.

[avi8torny]

I love it when they round up and don’t give you
the coins. They just got their tip.

[ckcarr]

A forum devoted to Porsche & BMW owners who create a thread and grouse about a few dollars for people probably making 1/10th the average annual income here... Love it!

[drkshdw]

Originally Posted by ckcarr

A forum devoted to Porsche & BMW owners who create a thread and grouse about a few dollars for people probably making 1/10th the average annual income here... Love it!

Do you think if I went into WalMart and stole a $4 quart of oil that they would have leniency on me because I make 1/10th their average annual profit? No. Theft is theft is theft. It doesn't matter if it's 25 cents or $25 million dollars. Just because the amount is trivial to me doesn't make the theft 'okay'. And that's exactly what this was. Theft of my change.

Could I have left her a tip? Sure. Would I have anyway? Absolutely not. She chose to spend her time on her phone and chatting with coworkers rather than tending to her customers. It's a hard lesson to learn but I don't believe in 'participation trophies' just for showing up. You gotta earn it. Just like my tip.

[Jims5543]

Originally Posted by Holger

Automatically added tip does not do that.
When I go out, I get a receip after the meal. If the service was good, I'll tip, if not ... meh. That is how it works to get the service up. Not automatically added amounts to the bill - where is the incentive to provide good service?

Also, I get the receip, and I immideately tell the amount I want to pay incl tip. If the receip says 25 Euro I say for example "28 Euro please". That is then charged on my card or the difference is handed out as change if paying cash.
Cannot get easier. And is no problem in Europe.

And the waitress is relaying on my tip? So what? I too have to work for my money. If you dont like the work ... change.
I have no problem whatsoever NOT tipping at all if the service is bad.

Ah, I see you have never been to the Bahamas. Every place I go to there adds an 18% gratuity to the tab, be it for 1 beer of a dinner for 5. Helps me a lot, I tend to overtip, this way they just get their 18%, the service there sucks. It is very rare to get decent service there, I put it on par with what I saw in Ireland and in Montreal, there the servers are paid a living wage, the establishments seemed to always be understaffed and the service reflected it.

In the Bahamas, it is just a NFG attitude most everywhere you go. While they work for tips there, it seems the mandatory 18% put them on level with non tipping countries.

[sammyg2]

Originally Posted by ckcarr

A forum devoted to Porsche & BMW owners who create a thread and grouse about a few dollars for people probably making 1/10th the average annual income here... Love it!

Sooooo, because the "servers in question" made poor life decisions which led them to take lower-paying jobs, and because their have moral deficiencies which led them to steal money that doesn't belong to them and which also led them to some false sense of entitlement, you gleamed that we are at fault for not approving of their thefts.

Interesting.

[tadd]

So to counter the whole service thing... part of what makes a waiter or waitress money is turning over their tables. Do you leave extra if you hang around and take your time leaving (anything beyond sitting down, shutting up, and eating)? They don't control that you do. Most don't even think about that when eating at a busy place.

I guess the biggest question I have to those about earning the tip is: Almost every other job is doesn't depend on it, why should this be any different? Yearly reviews and you get a raise (cause you have done good work) or you don't (cause you get complaints).

Personally, I just want to order, get my food and eat. I am not there to chat with the staff. I'm there to eat and talk to who I brought. More you stay away, more you get ....well that and I've seen it second hand through the wife (back when we was young and poor) and she was paying the lions share while I was in grad school. I don't think she could have lived long enough for me to ever pay her back for that stint as waitress once I finished the PhD and was earning.

[tadd]

Sammy:
Not every waiter or waitress made poor life decisions... sheesh. Some folks are just young and climbing the ladder. The wife was doing that job cause I was climbing. Short term pain for long term gain?? Both our parents were school teachers and not a penny came to either of us after High school. We made our own way and paid our own way. Only reason it wasn't me was that my field (chemistry) would pay a lot more than hers (unless she got very lucky).

What job(s) would you have suggested to support ourselves out of HS?

Maybe you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth and never had to do crappy work to improve yourself...

[Tervuren]

There are two issues being discussed here:

1: Someone walked off with your money that was not set aside for the person that walked off. This is like the person at the check out counter where you buy groceries pocketing your change.

2: The amount people tip and what they think those amounts should be.

I'd just like to point out that separation.

I don't want to be served by a dishonest person.

The person in the OP might have even gone to pocket it, not sharing it with anyone else if it had actually been a tip.

[Por_sha911]

You reap what you sow. Bless the server if they did well. What is an extra $5-10 really? If they did fair to poor then I'll leave the minimum 15%.
I won't punish the server if there is a problem with the food being late or incorrect unless they are obviously sitting around instead of checking on my order. If there is an automatic tip then that's all you get and you'll probably end up with less than what I would have given.

If they did something bad being rude, blatantly bad service (like sitting around on the phone instead of serving tables-had that happen one time) or assuming the change is his/hers, I'll leave no tip and speak with a manager explaining why. In these cases, the issue is not the money but the principle of not rewarding bad behavior.

Originally Posted by HardDrive

Sweet lord are there some cheap ass mother fuchers on this forum.

Originally Posted by ckcarr

A forum devoted to Porsche & BMW owners who create a thread and grouse about a few dollars for people probably making 1/10th the average annual income here... Love it!

I do agree that it is absurd that people who are so blessed that they brag about their expensive toys or travel the globe on vacations and bike trips are so cheap. This is what makes the USA such a bad place. Again, you reap what you sow.

[Jims5543]

Originally Posted by sammyg2

Sooooo, because the "servers in question" made poor life decisions which led them to take lower-paying jobs, and because their have moral deficiencies which led them to steal money that doesn't belong to them and which also led them to some false sense of entitlement, you gleamed that we are at fault for not approving of their thefts.

Interesting.

There is a waiting list to get a job working at Berns Steakhouse in Tampa Florida.

Typical waiter/Waitress there makes in excess of 100K a year.

They, of course, have to pay their dues as Berns is not an ordinary restaurant.

They have to work on the restaurant owned farm for a certain amount of time first, then they can work in the kitchen, then they can give kitchen and wine cellar tours, then they can work they way to being a junior server then finally a senior waiter or waitress. By that point they have probably invested over 5 years getting to that point and most of the staff there has been there over 20 years including the kitchen staff.

Everyone starts somewhere, there are people that actually enjoy the life stlye and the energy that being a waiter or waitress brings.

I agree working in a Denny's must suck. I never judge anyone, I treat a Denny's Waitress the same as I would my last waitress at Berns.

[Jims5543]

Originally Posted by drkshdw

Do you think if I went into WalMart and stole a $4 quart of oil that they would have leniency on me because I make 1/10th their average annual profit? No. Theft is theft is theft. It doesn't matter if it's 25 cents or $25 million dollars. Just because the amount is trivial to me doesn't make the theft 'okay'. And that's exactly what this was. Theft of my change.

Could I have left her a tip? Sure. Would I have anyway? Absolutely not. She chose to spend her time on her phone and chatting with coworkers rather than tending to her customers. It's a hard lesson to learn but I don't believe in 'participation trophies' just for showing up. You gotta earn it. Just like my tip.

While the discussion has gone off topic and is about tipping, in your experience I agree, when she walked off and never offered change, that was rude and poor manners.

I too would have asked for my change. I have a stupid rule, never leave less than $5 no matter the tab. If I ran a $10 tab at a greasy spoon, I will leave a $5 just because it is my own personal rule. I have my reasons.

If that happened to me then they just blew a better tip. Dumb move on her part for sure.

[KFC911]

Jim, are you a native northerner? The reason I ask is this....I had to learn. Not talking about wait staff, bartenders, etc. but being a southerner, I was amazed at what folks up north tipped for when I came of age....like every damn thing under the sun .

I usually tip 20% ....but remember when the "norm" was 10% growing up.

[ckcarr]

A lot of truth in this article...

Tipping Your Hot Waitress | So You Have A Girlfriend

[Jims5543]

Originally Posted by KC911

Jim, are you a native northerner? The reason I ask is this....I had to learn. Not talking about wait staff, bartenders, etc. but being a southerner, I was amazed at what folks up north tipped for when I came of age....like every damn thing under the sun .

I usually tip 20% ....but remember when the "norm" was 10% growing up.

Yes, but I grew up poor, the only time I ate in a nice sitdown restaurant that was nicer than a pizza hut was when my grandfather took me out. He taught me how to navigate a formal setting and other gentlemanly behaviors.

I moved to Florida in my late teens.

I was not in a comfortable position until I was in my mid 30s, having fought my way to where I am, I will never forget what it is like to struggle.

I tend to be over generous and I am ok with that.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk

[Tervuren]

Originally Posted by Jims5543

While the discussion has gone off topic and is about tipping, in your experience I agree, when she walked off and never offered change, that was rude and poor manners.

I too would have asked for my change. I have a stupid rule, never leave less than $5 no matter the tab. If I ran a $10 tab at a greasy spoon, I will leave a $5 just because it is my own personal rule. I have my reasons.

If that happened to me then they just blew a better tip. Dumb move on her part for sure.

It brings you joy to do so I am sure; being generous is a key to happiness.

Our business system is in the United States has a foundation of meeting other people's needs for monetization, those that give themselves to the former of those two often will end up doing very well in life once they can connect the two.

Invention is being able to spot a need that people were not aware of a solution to and giving a solution.

People miss out on a lot of joy and opportunity by being to narrow minded and tight.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by KC911

being a southerner, I was amazed at what folks up north tipped for when I came of age....like every damn thing under the sun .

LOL! I know, right? I was visiting a friend at his family’s cabin in the Catskills. They were from Manhattan. We took some trash to the dump and my friend tipped the guy at the gate $5. He looked at the money like it was some alien life form.
My friend’s father was a real New Yorker. On another trip to the dump a different guy at the gate said, “You got some trash today?” He was like, “What, are writing a book? Here’s $5, open the gate.” Cracked me up.

[Arizona_928]

Originally Posted by john70t

(I think)
If they are hired as waiters, they can legally be paid below minimum wage.

my very limited experience with the service industry. If you do not make at least min wage by tips, the restaurant has to pay the difference to min wage. maybe an AZ thing. hence why you only claim half your tips, and pocket the rest.

anyways I don't tip for ****. these college girls think that bringing you the bill counts as service... I do tip my subway kid at the px, not expected, very appreciated.

yeah I am a cheap ass.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by Jims5543

Yes, but I grew up poor, the only time I ate in a nice sitdown restaurant that was nicer than a pizza hut was when my grandfather took me out....

Poor is a relative thing I reckon...compared to how my parents (and many of their generation) grew up. Eating out...what was that? I'm not knocking being generous and giving back, karma, etc. kudos to you sir. I was just thinking the cultural differences might be entering into this. My parents (for example) have done well in life, but certainly not rich, and it's all been by simply working their butts off their whole lives (probably harder than 99% of the folks here)...throwing $ at wait staff ain't gonna happen, but they give more to charity, others, etc. than most (% wise). They tip 20%, as do I....but they're not gonna leave 5 bucks tip for a meal only twice that....me neither. Unless I'm 25 years old, drunk, and at Hooters or something .