Hassled By Local Police While Walking - Your Thoughts?

[speeder]

Originally Posted by masraum

This, exactly.

Are there some bad cops, I'm sure. If you line up 100 of any profession, you're going to find bad ones. Most of the cops that I've met or known, even if they were pulling me over were good people doing their job.

The difference is that "bad people" working at Best Buy don't have much power over you or the ability to really ruin your day by killing you or taking away your freedom. They can't even detain you when you are walking down the street and hassle you.

So the whole, *bad apples in every profession* canard is really irrelevant when discussing the police.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by scottmandue

In the United States, a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. The 14th amendment to the US Constitution guarantees to every person, aliens included, “equal protection under the law.”

I have a bridge to sell you.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by speeder

So the whole, *bad apples in every profession* canard is really irrelevant when discussing the police.

It is relevant.

A stinker chief financial officer or same CPA can eff you out of your investment in a seemingly stable stock exchange traded company.

A 17 year old at Best Buy is not of the same caliber wrt deviance/greed/power.

[Rick Lee]

I'm sure you wouldn't want to go down this road, but you don't have to respond to any cop asking you a question if you're a pedestrian. If you choose to answer, then the contact is voluntary, though you can still cut it off at anytime.

TX does not have a stop and ID law. So, unless you're under arrest or operating a motor vehicle, as a pedestrian, you can ignore a cop asking you questions or asking for ID. He'd probably then order you to stop and detain you, but you still don't have to produce ID and he'd have to let you go after about 15-20 min. If I didn't have anywhere I had to be, I'd probably be inclined to make this cop work for it, call his supervisor to the scene and let them know I'd be the one asking the questions. Might not make your day any better, but it might make them review their training material or agency guidelines.

If you don't know your rights, you don't have any.

[Arizona_928]

Glad you didn't become a statistic.
Very easy now in days

[wdfifteen]

I don’t know what the citizens of your friend’s native country expect of their LEOs. Here, that’s about normal. if he is used to citizens getting more respect from LEO he won’t be comfortable here. As non-whites you could have been shot and killed for your actions, so you got off easy.

[aigel]

Not cool at all.

That said, people (calling police) and cops may be freaked out with recent school shootings being reported.

Also non Texans or non-Southeners need to understand that NOBODY walks in TX. There are hardly any sidewalks. It is all geared towards cars. Walking makes you immediately suspicious as someone that broke down, can't afford a car or is out on foot because they are up to something. You may be safe if you are obviously exercising, but even that usually takes place inside on a treadmill.

G

[RKDinOKC]

You started with live in a good neighborhood. Just maybe the cops interaction is why.

[HardDrive]

I've had cops ask me questions, and be abrupt about it. I'm a total white boy. They have a stressful, thankless job. I give them the benefit of the doubt.

But I have not walked a mile in a minorities moccasins, so I can't tell you how to feel.

[stomachmonkey]

Originally Posted by scottmandue

In the United States, a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. The 14th amendment to the US Constitution guarantees to every person, aliens included, “equal protection under the law.”

You forgot the green.

[stomachmonkey]

When did going for a walk become a suspicious activity.

OP was profiled.

Maybe by a neighbor.

Maybe by the cop.

Maybe a bit of both.

No other explanation.

[DanielDudley]

Originally Posted by slow&rusty

It was surreal and bizarre. I was left thinking if the officer was just doing his job and following up on the supposed call or was this a clear case of harassment and profiling (seeing that my friend and I are both minorities), taking into consideration we are both almost 50 year old men that were well dressed and walking slowing and talking (enjoying the morning). The way the officer handled it was also unprofessional.


So what says you guys?

Don't overthink it. You handled it well, and maybe there was a call. People are pretty touchy around schools these days. I have been in similar situations, and I am about as WASP as they come. I always try to be civil, but it can be trying, especially after the fact, when you have time to mull it over.

I told an officer once that I had lived in the neighborhood for five years, and had an important job in the community. He then asked me why he had never run into me before, and I said, ''That's a good thing, if you think about it.''. The thing is, I did see that officer a few times after that, and he was always courteous. Once an officer knows you, they don't forget you are a local.

[RANDY P]

Cop ain't gonna know if the caller is a fruit loop or not, and at least you walked away. 50 years ago, they would've MADE you act up so they can bust you.

Certainly your buddy has perceptions of the USA, that's how it is overseas. Nothing can be done. What they believe.

rjp

[stomachmonkey]

Originally Posted by aigel

Not cool at all.

That said, people (calling police) and cops may be freaked out with recent school shootings being reported.

Also non Texans or non-Southeners need to understand that NOBODY walks in TX. There are hardly any sidewalks. It is all geared towards cars. Walking makes you immediately suspicious as someone that broke down, can't afford a car or is out on foot because they are up to something. You may be safe if you are obviously exercising, but even that usually takes place inside on a treadmill.

G

I live in TX.

Everyone in my community walks.

A lot.

[aigel]

Originally Posted by stomachmonkey

I live in TX.

Everyone in my community walks.

A lot.

In your neighborhood or on the main road to the store to grab a cup of java? How far? Mid-morning wearing regular clothes? Are there sidewalks to get to the next strip mall? Maybe things have changed. Even in CA shopping mall entries lack sidewalks, leave alone bike lanes.

G

[Deschodt]

We automatically grant a lot of respect to people in uniform and assume a certain level of aptitude that is not necessarily there. Sometimes we forget that some of those hired for those jobs and relatively low pay are not exactly PHDs with degrees in psychology or all encompassing training... Same van be said of doctors, some of them were last in their class and barely graduated. You just never know...

I've met local cops that were a few fries short of a happy meal and had *very* little training or aptitude... some were the slow kids in the classroom, and now they got a gun and power. That's true of all professions, but the gun and power adds to the risk. Some are *great* at their jobs, and risk their lives for peanuts money, and should be thanked for it. Some are as$hats hiding behind a badge and should be janitors in a spam factory. Same as society in general, plus a gun..

That OP incident was not cool, could have been handled better, but not terrible - could have been a call placed that set this off the wrong way. I do understand your friend's joke though, cops here are scary vs cops in Europe, mostly because they are trigger happy, and that mostly because everyone here is effing armed and they are at risk! I lived in both places, totally different interactions / experiences.

[vash]

I’ve been stopped. They checked my ID which had my address on it. I was around the corner from my home. He handed it back and ushered me on with an plain apology to have taken my time.

I was happy he was doing his job. I didn’t ask what it was about. None of my business at that point.

[aigel]

Vash - how about the game wardens?

My Vietnamese hunting buddy is SCARED of the warden.

G

[slow&rusty]

Originally Posted by LEAKYSEALS951

Sorry to hear this Slow and Rusty.
I wouldn't be surprised is there was not some element of racial profiling involved.

On the bright side- and please let your friend know this- As a home grown American whitey I have been on the receiving end of some high strung cops. In several occasions, I have been harassed and even had them with their hands on their guns as if I was some lethal threat.

As a minor aside- (one incident- and not even one of the "high strung ones") I remember even being pulled over in my 911 (in high school)and asked how I got the money to afford such as car. I had pictures of how I restored it in my glove box and he went through all of them (rocker panel replacement pics- floor board replacement pics, etc... as if it was some important evidence.) A fellow classmate of mine (who happened to be black, and who's father was a surgeon and who also had a 911) also got pulled over for no reason. To my classmate- it will always be "because he was black." Well, I was white, had done nothing wrong, still got pulled over, and by the end of it, there were three cop cars there surrounding me for no real reason. That was just one occasion, and not one of the more scary occasions where the cops were visibly on edge.

That doesn't mean what happened to you today was right, but it does happen, and like you, in the hours afterwards I have thought "WTF?" trying to weigh my rights, versus putting myself in their shoes, etc... I try to understand the concept of "nice cops end up dead" and give the benefit of the doubt, but when that kind of stuff happens, it gets hard to stay objective.

On the other hand- I have several patients who are LEO's- and who actively play down their jobs in an effort to "not be hated" A neighbor up the street quit law enforcement about two years ago and went to work for a power company repairing downed power lines because it was "safer."


What you do have is your intelligence and positive demeanor. Based on what you have posted on this forum- you are a decent, positive, and passionate person. Give it some time to calm down, and then decide on where to go from there.

Go out and have some fun with your friend while they are still here. That sounds like a bunch of crap!

Thank you for your kind words, they are very much appreciated.

And thanks to all for chiming in and sharing their experiences and thoughts....good thread!! My fiancé and I read it in detail last night.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by slow&rusty

So this has been bugging me all day and not sure if I am being overly sensitive?

This morning at 8am my oldest friend from middle school (we've been friends for 35 years) visited me for the first time here in Houston, he was flying in from Germany.

He's never seen a Bayou so we walked a few blocks from my house and I was explaining to him how they manage storm water and how they crested their banks during Hurricane Harvey. I live in a nice quiet neighborhood that is very safe.

On our short walk back to my house I saw a police car following us very slowly and I didn't pay any attention to it until it pulled into a driveway in front of us blocking our path and the sidewalk followed by the officer jumping out.

The officer then approaches me and asks "if I was walking by the school and crossed the Bayou bridge"?

I responded that we walked to the Bayou's edge but never crossed the bridge or never came close to the school (about 1/2 mile away).

The officer then said that they received a report of two suspicious men walking by the school, I firmed up and said we never walked by the school, to which he responded "why would someone call and lie to the police department?". He then asked if I actually lived in the neighborhood, to which I said "yes for the past decade" and I pointed to my house which was about 100-ft away.

It was tense for a few minutes and then then the officer got into his car and drove off, but he actually called for back up and within seconds two other cop cars came cruising down the street.

It was surreal and bizarre. I was left thinking if the officer was just doing his job and following up on the supposed call or was this a clear case of harassment and profiling (seeing that my friend and I are both minorities), taking into consideration we are both almost 50 year old men that were well dressed and walking slowing and talking (enjoying the morning). The way the officer handled it was also unprofessional.

Ironically, after my neighborhood flooded I donated \ contributed much of my personal time to help the municipality as I am a Texas registered professional engineer with many years of storm water management and hydraulic modelling. My friend said he is never coming back to the US after this morning.

So what says you guys?

I've only read this post (so far...back later), but I watch my 'hood like a hawk, with no preconcieved biases. Something unusual, and different, then..."I'm" gonna just observe and watch. My parents, and others...call the cops....(my LEO tennant agrees)...most are glad to do what they do. I've seen my neighborhood being "cased" so many times...it ain't funny...YMMV.