3.2 Engine exploded!!

[universeman]

I agree with theiceman. But the OP is not looking to blame or litigate, he's looking for rebuilding advice. It's the other posters who are getting their hackles up. Some of those are not in the USA, I'd add

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by 1979-930

^^^ No way I would chip in on this as an owner.

"Exiting the freeway the clutch broke." The clutch is replaced and 30 yards later the rod comes out the block.

In my best Spock voice; Driver error is the only logical explanation Captain.

Originally Posted by theiceman

i dont understand why in this world there always has to be someone else to blame. ( yeah I get it, America is the land of litigation" )
Engine is built way beyond Porsches original spec, intentionally driven in a less than optimum condition, and when it explodes " lets start suing people"

Engine mods is a high stakes game, if you are in the game it comes with risk.
I would have thought completely different if it had been a completely stock motor that grenaded after an engine rebuild by a professional Porsche certified mechanic to stock.

sorry , just my opinion , I'm sure others wont agree.

There’s liability in the business of building engines and repairing cars there’s also a downside to getting paid $20,000 to rebuild a motor. It can be a high-stakes game for the shop as well If they did something wrong. It’s not all peaches and cream you want to get paid the big bucks to build motors there may also be circumstances like this where you get to chip in and help out. I’m certainly not recommending suing I’m recommending having a discussion with the shop and see what they may be willing to do to help. I may be naïve in thinking this but I feel that upon tear down the cause can be narrowed down.

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by universeman

I agree with theiceman. But the OP is not looking to blame or litigate, he's looking for rebuilding advice. It's the other posters who are getting their hackles up. Some of those are not in the USA, I'd add

I would say he’s getting his ducks in a row and that may include involving the shop but he doesn’t want to be out of line and accuse somebody if the consensus is that it’s not their fault

[gomezoneill]

Anyone notice the centrifugal oil flinging on the PP?

[lvporschepilot]

Originally Posted by universeman

But the OP is not looking to blame or litigate, he's looking for rebuilding advice. It's the other posters who are getting their hackles up. Some of those are not in the USA, I'd add

Exactly. No sense whatsoever chasing that rabbit.

I'm just looking forward to seeing the carnage on disassembly. The light pinging caused the rod nut to back out = failure. other rod nuts will be found to be loose as well. That's my pre-disassembly guess.

[smokintr6]

Originally Posted by nathanbs

There’s liability in the business of building engines and repairing cars there’s also a downside to getting paid $20,000 to rebuild a motor. It can be a high-stakes game for the shop as well If they did something wrong. It’s not all peaches and cream you want to get paid the big bucks to build motors there may also be circumstances like this where you get to chip in and help out

Race engines are going to be no warranties expressed or implied, and it would be nearly impossible to prove negligence in court. In this case its clearly better to move on. It's good to want to understand the failure to prevent an encore performance, but the car owner should be holding the bag here, unfortunately.

[tirwin]

There is a Pelican that has been posting about bringing a new case to market. User name Catorce (or something similar). I haven’t seen an update recently but maybe you could start with one of his new cases and salvage enough from the old motor to keep rebuild costs to a minimum. That’s probably cheaper than a whole new engine.

I would definitely vote for having a 3rd party engine build to do a tear-down to find the smoking gun. Doesn’t make sense to re-create this engine if you don’t know the cause of failure.

[86 ssinit]

My 2 cents on Blame. There’s three party’s involved. No one will except blame because others were involved. That’s it. Do you want to pay to take it to court? Use the money for new engine. Or sell car as roller. I would take apart the engine yourself. Yes the bolt broke but was it manufactured for a twin plug engine? If so than that’s the best place to start. If not move on and see what can be salvaged.

[86 ssinit]

Oh and the guy making cases was making 3.6 cases.

[tirwin]

Originally Posted by 86 ssinit

Oh and the guy making cases was making 3.6 cases.

Not as I understood it. It could be used for several different displacements.

[tirwin]

Good grief, the OP hasn’t asked who to blame. He’s asking opinions on root cause and how he could/should move forward from here. Fair ask. Others are reading too much into it.

[onevoice]

Originally Posted by Allan Kelsey

The rod bolt definitely broke and I will post a pic of it, as soon as I can get into daylight.


If the rod bolt was too loose, then I think we would have heard a horrible clatter, before the explosion and Im told there was no such indication. Which leads me to suspect the rod bolt failed from a material breach or a torque problem at assembly. I have not opened the motor to have a look inside yet.

My hope through appealing to you guys, is not so much to pass blame but rather to hopefully get some informed advice from anyone who may have gone through something similar (my sincere sympathies) and go about the correction process as sensibly and frugally as possible. If there is a reasonable ownership that should be taken here, I would like that to be honored by the responsible party, but until I get more diagnosis, (and perhaps even with it) I think it's is going to be difficult to pin this issue on one person or event.

Assuming the heads and the top of the motor are all fine, what parts do you suspect I will need to replace? Or what alternate engine configurations are worth considering at this point? Is the case salvageable with a good aluminum welder?

I have had this happen to a race motor, it sucks. Rod bolts break because they are over stressed, either from installation error(low probability), or material issue(if real ARP-very low to zero probability), or over revs(most likely).

Given 18 months from build to failure, you can pretty much eliminate the engine builder. Even if he made a mistake, it's too late to prove it with any certainty. If you are reasonably certain you haven't done anything (the flywheel could point to you), the most likely culprit is the current shop. Over revved it on the first test drive and took it out to make sure it was ok, again, no way to prove anything so a dead end.

As to what is damaged, it could be a lot. If the intermediate shaft got destroyed, all the valves could be bent, and possible the heads also. When I did something similar, I had nothing left but an intake manifold and carb. Even cracked the trans case. No way to tell till you look inside.

On the other hand, an optimist would say maybe everything can be saved. But you would have to have multiple lottery winner good luck. Most likely the entire crankcase and everything inside is junk, as is at least one cylinder/piston/head. If your heads are good, an engine builder would be your best bet in finding what you need.

Best to start looking for a complete engine

[irl]

The shop where it broke may have some options to help. Sometimes when it happens under their watch they are willing to help out in some way. Ya never know but reaching out to see if the have any motor options or relationships at their disposal would be a suggestion. I bet they would be willing to help in some way.

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by smokintr6

Race engines are going to be no warranties expressed or implied, and it would be nearly impossible to prove negligence in court. In this case its clearly better to move on. It's good to want to understand the failure to prevent an encore performance, but the car owner should be holding the bag here, unfortunately.

The one thing that a lot of car customizers, hot rodders neglect to think about is how a judge will see circumstances like this. When a judge hears something like a $30,000 engine build or a $50,000 paint and body restoration the shop better be prepared for some consequences if their product or service fails. After all an oil change is $24.99 and a paint job is $299 on all the TV commercials

[3rd_gear_Ted]

You get a judgement.
It don't end there.
Get out the hazmat suit.

[Coastr]

Originally Posted by tirwin

Not as I understood it. It could be used for several different displacements.

No it’s 3.6 case. The thread talks about the possibility of other cases. Don’t think it is ready yet. I think it’s hard to cast and machine a case

[pmax]

Originally Posted by gomezoneill

Anyone notice the centrifugal oil flinging on the PP?

That's interesting.



Also, are those cracks between 12 and 3 o'clock on the PP ?

[yelcab1]

Originally Posted by pmax

That's interesting.



Also, are those cracks between 12 and 3 o'clock on the PP ?

Yes, and at 3 oclock

[boosted79]

Check clutch pedal travel.

[azhodge]

does that year have an over rev limiter. many ass holes have thought they could handle a porsches acceleration....ask me how I know..