How to best lube cylinders after a 6 year nap

[chrismorse]

Getting closer to getting the 74 CIS engine up and running and am concerned about getting the rings lubed before hitting the key.
Brief history: suspension steering and brakes getting done, installing Len's new late model fuel lines to fit galvanized 84 tank, new Bosch pump fuel filter, flushed accumulator
I will be pulling the injectors, (hopefully including the cold start too) and try flushing the FD, lines and injectors. Got BK44 to fortify a couple of gallons of alcohol free gas, (a pox on the miscreants that foisted that crap on us).

So I have read a few resurrection threads and haven't found a good way to fog, (not flood), the cylinders.

Any suggestions greatly appreciated.
chris

[andoni510]

I always rotate the engine by hand counter clockwise at least 2-3 full revolutions so oil in the combustion chamber is not push thru exhaust valves to help minimize smoke thru exhaust during start up.

[patkeefe]

Squirt oil into the cylinders. This is crude, and has been effective for 100 years.

[OSC911]

Originally Posted by andoni510

I always rotate the engine by hand counter clockwise at least 2-3 full revolutions so oil in the combustion chamber is not push thru exhaust valves to help minimize smoke thru exhaust during start up.

Just a squirt of ATF or light engine oil is enough and wind over. The only thing I never do is wind an engine over counter clockwise whether it be either chain or belt driven. Too much chance of jumping a tooth on the cam/cams. Probably won't happen 99.9% of the time but it can and has happened.

[porsche930dude]

Id mix up 2 stroke oil in the gas thatll keep it lubed up. Marvel mystery oil or ATF works too

[chrismorse]

Thanks guys, probably overthinking the problem.

[LM3929]

I used a fogging oil used to lube cylinders before storeing an engine, covers the cylinders better

Lorne M.

[chrismorse]

Hi Lorne,
I recall seeing the "fogging" mentioned only once before. Where might one acquire fog??
I've got another old car that has been sitting for years as well - need to take better care of the cars.

Regarding your boxes of left over parts, I am reminded of the GM engineer that invented the electric starter commenting that "Parts left out cost nothing and create no service problems". No worries

chris

[LM3929]

Hi Chris
I picked up the Fogging oil in an aerosol can form from our local Flaps. My engine was out of the car for about 15 plus years and showed absolutely no sign of rust when I checked the cylinders and all I did was re-fog it about every 6 months and turned the engine over by hand several times while fogging it. I will check at the store and get the name and manufactuers name for you.

oiling horizontally opposed cylinders is not as easy as vertical cylinders as you can imagine the oil just layes at the bottom of the cylinders while fogging gets completely around them.

Lorne M.

[chrismorse]

Thanks Lorne,
I know this may be a bit of overkill, but, if a litttle extra cost during storage and rehabilitation can postpone or delay another top end overhaul, I'm all for it.

Dad's last top end job was $11-12K and that was 10+ years ago.
chris

[patkeefe]

I guess, in theory, the rings, especially the top ring, is mostly dry of oil during normal operation. The lowest ring in the cylinder, the oil scraper ring (oil control ring), is there to basically scrape the excess oil from the cylinder walls. So, providing the oil ring is doing its job, there will be little oil hitting the middle compression ring, and the top ring is essentially dry. During operation, oil travels from the crankcase to the combustion chamber, if it makes it to the combustion chamber (mostly, it does not). If you fog (essentially spray a cloud of oil into the chamber via the spark plug hole), you are going opposite of the direction of normal operation. So, you are putting oil where it usually isn't. Also, your cylinders are either Nikasil or Alusil, two materials that don't rust.

Some people swear by this fogging. Some people think it is at best overkill, and at worst, useless. Choice is yours. I can say most wear in an engine is during start-up, which is why Accusump is so popular. So, really the best thing to do is pressurize your oil system prior to turning the key.

[chrismorse]

Originally Posted by patkeefe

I guess, in theory, the rings, especially the top ring, is mostly dry of oil during normal operation. The lowest ring in the cylinder, the oil scraper ring (oil control ring), is there to basically scrape the excess oil from the cylinder walls. So, providing the oil ring is doing its job, there will be little oil hitting the middle compression ring, and the top ring is essentially dry. During operation, oil travels from the crankcase to the combustion chamber, if it makes it to the combustion chamber (mostly, it does not). If you fog (essentially spray a cloud of oil into the chamber via the spark plug hole), you are going opposite of the direction of normal operation. So, you are putting oil where it usually isn't. Also, your cylinders are either Nikasil or Alusil, two materials that don't rust.

Some people swear by this fogging. Some people think it is at best overkill, and at worst, useless. Choice is yours. I can say most wear in an engine is during start-up, which is why Accusump is so popular. So, really the best thing to do is pressurize your oil system prior to turning the key.

Hi Patrick
Almost all of my engine experience is with iron blocks, where parked iron rusts and delayed start up hammers rings. I’d forgotten that we are dealing with, non rusting bores.
Does it seem reasonable that with an oil change prior to cranking a plug less engine, with, Squirt of oil and the fuel pump disabled - I should be ok?? After pressure is established, new plugs, check valve adjustment, check head stud torque???”

Not to drift too far off the OP’s inquiry, is an accusump of significant help, given the nature of the dry sumps ability to have oil at the pump, prior to start up??

Thanks,
chris

[patkeefe]

I'd give it a squirt of oil and start it, and do all of the things you listed, which are quite reasonable. It is always a good idea to pull the valve covers off to see what is going on in there. I might actually pull the valve covers off and spin it by hand just to make sure the valve train is doing what it should.

Do you know why it was sitting for so long in the first place? What I mean is was it OK and then never ran again because of a non-mechanical reason, or was there something wrong and it became abandoned? Or, do you have no history of it?

[AirJose]

Wow,
Great advice from all! Needs some thin oil in the spark plug holes before turning the engine. Leave it overnight... then turn the engine 2-3 times by hand disconnecting the coil. Mystery oil comes to mind. Put some also with the normal oil. A really old but good trick...
Jose

[T77911S]

marvel mystery oil use to be good for that.

spin it over with plugs out to make sure it is all out but it will still smoke like a wild fire.

[911pcars]

While Alusil and Nikasil are non ferrous materials, piston rings are not. They are cast iron or steel, and they will corrode minus lube protection. In fact, they will often freeze in place and prevent outward movement to expand against the cylinder walls.

I suggest squirting a light bodied lube (ATF, Marvel Mystery Oil or equiv.) into each cylinder (attempt to apply between 10 and 2 o-clock so the lube distributes around the entire periphery of the piston, then manually rotate the engine in its normal direction of rotation to spread lube into the ring lands. I'd follow up by removing the valve covers and squirt lube oil where each rocker arm contacts its cam lobe. Without lube, this high load friction area can score the contact surfaces, especially on a a cold start. Wiggle each rocker arm with its valve closed to confirm there's adequate rocker-to-closed-valve clearance. A more accurate valve adjustment can be performed later.

If manual rotation feels even, leave the spark plugs out, then crank the engine with the starter and ignition OFF. Disable the fuel pump if fuel delivery is injected. Follow up with a compression test to verify adequate cylinder sealing.

With the ignition OFF, crank engine until oil pressure builds to fill and feed lube passages (main and rod bearings, cam spray bars, timing chains, chain tensioners, valve guides, etc.).

Only after confirming oil is fully available and pressurized, attempt to start the engine. The engine will smoke a little while burning off excess lube. Check oil pressure and for oil leaks.

After 6 years of storage, the fuel system is probably compromised with bad gas. This is another area to address.

Hope this helps,
Sherwood