Installed new shift bushings and need to adjust to hit 5 gear

JSZ · 04-14-2021, 05:36 PM

Hello, changed my shift coupling bushings and having a little trouble getting into 5 th. Any quick adjustments tip one could share?
It a 1982 911 with the original 915.

Thanks, Jeff

cabmandone · cabmandone's Garage

IIRC if you're going through 1-4 pretty smoothly a slight fore/aft adjustment might be needed if you're not hitting 5.

One thing though, did you check to make sure your tunnel bushing was in good shape? Sometimes just doing the shift coupler bushings isn't enough to get it shifting correctly.

JSZ · 04-15-2021, 06:42 AM

Hello Nick, thank you. I did change all the bushings relative to the shift mechanism, gear shift and throttle bushings when I was in there last fall. I seem not to be able to find my notes with Covid fog...
Should be fairly easy, will give it a go.
Thank you, Jeff

thetorch · 04-15-2021, 07:07 AM

sounds like a small adjustment to the shift coupling could fix it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3nPONBAaZM

MichaelSJackson · 04-16-2021, 08:51 AM

It seems people often have a little trouble with one of the four corners (1st, 2nd, 5th or reverse). This can be from the fact that these are at the extremes of the range of motion. Most often I hear complaints about reverse. I start my adjustment in reverse and the go for the opposite corner (1st). If you can reach the opposite corners, then everything else should be fine.

Pelican provides a tech article on 915 shift improvements...

https://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/101_Projects_Porsche_911/37-Shifting_Improvements/37-Shifting_Improvements.htm

... with a paragraph on adjusting the coupler "The procedure for adjusting the shifter is simple...".

I've learned a slightly different technique.

Reattach the shift coupler to the transmission, but keep the clamped end of the shifter rod very loose. By hand, grab the transmission rod and move it forward and twist clockwise (facing forward) to put the trans in reverse. Now use your shifter to put it into reverse as well. (You'll have to push to get it past the click stop that protects reverse.) I use reverse as the starting position because the click stop makes it the hardest position to adjust for. Just start there and the problem doesn't exist. Also, most other techniques start in neutral and there is so much more slop compared to starting in reverse where the slop is minimal and most of the fine tuning has already occurred.

Now that the shifter is in reverse if you move it around you'll notice it describes a small rectangle of slop. When you tighten the coupler, it should not rest on any side of this rectangle. (NOTE: Actually, each gear position will describe it's own small rectangle of slop and you don't want the shifter to rest against any of those sides either.) Therefore, with the shifter in the middle of the rectangle for reverse, tighten the coupler.

Now to test the adjustment, shift to the farthest position which is in first gear. Did that happen easily? Does it feel as if it is pinned against any of the walls/edges of the rectangle for first? If it feels fine, your done. All of the other positions will be fine, because the travel from reverse to any of the others is less.

If it doesn't feel fine, you'll need to fine tune. This means going back into reverse and loosening the coupler. Then adjust the shifter to a slightly different position in the reverse rectangle, remembering not to be against any of the edges of reverse's rectangle.

If the shifter couldn't move left enough to get into first's rectangle, then position the shifter a bit more to the right in reverse's rectangle.
If the shifter seemed to get pinned against the left side of first's rectangle, then adjust a bit more to the left in reverse's rectangle.
If the shifter couldn't move forward enough to get into first, then adjust the shifter a bit further back in reverse's rectangle.
Finally, if the shifter seems to be pinned against the front wall/edge of first's rectangle, adjust the shifter a bit more forward in reverse's rectangle.
The description of these four possible adjustments seem backward, because all the motions get reversed through the ball joint of the shift lever. (Hope I got them all right.)

Now that you've adjusted the position in reverse's rectangle, tighten the coupler and test by trying to shift into first again. Repeat until happy.

MichaelSJackson · 04-17-2021, 11:40 AM

Jeff,

Since you can get into 5th, but it is a bit tight, the simplest/quickest solution is to solve for 5th and its opposite 2nd.

Put it in 5th. If you try and "stir" the shifter to feel the rectangle of slop, it will probably feel pinned to one side/wall?

Loosen the coupler, while in 5th, and then try to place the shifter in the middle of the slop rectangle. Tighten the coupler and test the shift to 2nd.

Same as my description above, but your problem was 5th; not reverse.

cabmandone · cabmandone's Garage

Typically when there's an issue going into 5 there's an issue with bumping R too. If 1-4 are good, I think I'd still try a fore/aft adjustment.

3 pedals · 3 pedals's Garage

MichaelSJackson you have clarified what adjusting the shifter is correctly. If you can get the furthest gears to line up then all the rest should fall in line. Gotta be in the 'happy triangle' I'm replacing the ball cup and shift rod bushings in my 79 SC for my Sunday therapy. Thanks Kip

MichaelSJackson · 04-18-2021, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando

Typically when there's an issue going into 5 there's an issue with bumping R too. If 1-4 are good, I think I'd still try a fore/aft adjustment.

Nick,

Since he has a problem with 5th but not reverse, I'd guess you are right that that it requires a fore/aft adjustment. If he tests and adjusts for the opposite corner, he will be doing a fore/aft adjustment at the same time as his horizontal plane adjustment.

cabmandone · cabmandone's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelSJackson

Nick,

Since he has a problem with 5th but not reverse, I'd guess you are right that that it requires a fore/aft adjustment. If he tests and adjusts for the opposite corner, he will be doing a fore/aft adjustment at the same time as his horizontal plane adjustment.

My method is less scientific than yours. I just grab some wrenches and go for a drive till I have it right.

JSZ · 04-19-2021, 06:19 AM

Thank you guys, I appreciate the help. I am going to try to get to this , this week.
Great information and thank you.

Jeff

MichaelSJackson · 04-19-2021, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando

My method is less scientific than yours. I just grab some wrenches and go for a drive till I have it right.

Nick,

Two paths to the same place. Let's hope he gets it tuned.

MJ

cabmandone · cabmandone's Garage

He'll get it. Main thing to remember is that it doesn't take much movement to make a big difference.

ramonesfreak · ramonesfreak's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando

My method is less scientific than yours. I just grab some wrenches and go for a drive till I have it right.

This is my method too. Usually takes about 5 tries

Otter74 · 04-23-2021, 09:09 AM

Piggybacking a question onto this - I haven't visualized it in my head yet well enough to figure it out. I started finding recently (meaning last summer) that sometimes when I went for 2nd, I'd get 4th instead. Go back to neutral and then push it a *bit* more to the left for 2nd and I'd get 2nd. But do it with less force and I'd get 4th. I think this may have been something that only came up after I put the GateShift and short shifter in it and then some time passed. Shifter is a factory SS with Seine add-on, everything in the tunnel has been replaced.

cabmandone · cabmandone's Garage

Otter, I'm not following you. With the Seine gate shift ( I have one in my car) you have to keep pressure over because 1/2 is now gated with the additional spring and tab put on the left side of the shift lever. What you're experiencing seems like user error to me.

MichaelSJackson · 04-23-2021, 10:19 AM

I just found that doing the adjustment in neutral allows a wide range of positions to select from. (Leading some to use tape, with a marker, to keep track of previous/current positions.) However, if you put the transmission in a gear and the shifter in the matching position, 90% of the tuning was already done and the secondary tuning is just a "nudge" from the initial selected position.

Your mileage may vary.

Otter74 · 04-23-2021, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando

Otter, I'm not following you. With the Seine gate shift ( I have one in my car) you have to keep pressure over because 1/2 is now gated with the additional spring and tab put on the left side of the shift lever. What you're experiencing seems like user error to me.

I'll try to explain better. With the shifter in the neutral (3/4) plane, if I go straight back of course I will get 4th. If I push it to the left against the Seine and then back, I will usually get 2nd as expected. However, sometimes when I push it left then back, I will still get 4th rather than 2nd. If I re-do the shift and push a bit harder, I feel it go into 2nd as it should. In other words, on those occasions, despite moving the lever over to the 1-2 plane, I'm still catching the far side of the 3-4 slot.

cabmandone · cabmandone's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by Otter74

I'll try to explain better. With the shifter in the neutral (3/4) plane, if I go straight back of course I will get 4th. If I push it to the left against the Seine and then back, I will usually get 2nd as expected. However, sometimes when I push it left then back, I will still get 4th rather than 2nd. If I re-do the shift and push a bit harder, I feel it go into 2nd as it should. In other words, on those occasions, despite moving the lever over to the 1-2 plane, I'm still catching the far side of the 3-4 slot.

If you're pushing to the left and down with the Seine system installed and still hitting 4, you need to adjust the coupler or you've got something wrong like tunnel bushing or coupler bushings or a coupler that is on the jagged edge of being adjusted improperly. The 1/2 and 3/4 planes shouldn't even be close. It should take pressure to go into 1/2 and a simple pull or push to go out of 1/2 into the 3/4 plane.

The whole purpose of the gate shift is to avoid the "money shift". If you pull out of one you need to keep pressure to the left pulling into 2. If you don't keep pressure, it will pop into the 3/4 plane because the shifter centers in the 3/4 plane.

Did you install the Seine gate shift kit or did someone install it for you? There's a tab on the left side of the shift rod that ( I personally welded mine) should be strapped or welded onto the shift lever. It shouldn't even be a thought as to what gear you're hitting with this kit.

Otter74 · 04-23-2021, 01:49 PM

I should have added that this sometimes-misshift occurs only when I am coming out of 3rd and trying to catch 2nd, not coming from 1st. If nothing else, if it is harder than it should be to get 2nd, I'm definitely not going to get a money shift

All of the bushings between shift lever and transmission are quite new. It does suggest that I have a coupler that is almost-but-not-quite adjusted correctly, so re-adjusting it is the first thing I will do. but it is puzzling to me that this just appeared, say, last year, when the bushings and adjustment have been in place for several and after the Seine went in. I bought the Seine kit and SS lever from another Pelican and installed it myself in my existing shift tower. The tab for the seine was already welded to the lever when I got it.