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-   -   Sequential gearbox for 911 with 3.6 engine ??? (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/1095036-sequential-gearbox-911-3-6-engine.html)

jmz 12-09-2021 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by winders (Post 11542193)
I get a full season out of my 915 and that is with ~430 HP 3.6L bolted to it. What are you doing to your box?

Me personally, Likely shifting faster than I should. It is a Wevo 915 conversion in my 914/6. ~300hp and gobs of torque. It isn't as precise as I'd like it to be and have had some issues with mostly third gear. I think the gearbox had a slightly bent shift rod in it that was causing some issues. That has been remedied. We will see how it goes from here.

winders 12-09-2021 12:18 PM

Yeah, when I get into the heat of battle in a race I sometimes shift faster than I should. The box can handle that as long as, once a year, I get it checked as refreshed as needed.

I am using a JWest Rennshift. I was having some issues with missing the 2nd to 3rd shift and broke a couple of rockers and bent some valves. I made the spring that pushed the shifter from the 1/2 plane to the 3/4 plane stronger and that seems to have solved the issue. I did buy a Wevo GateShift to try and I am still debating installing it....

Clay Perrine 12-09-2021 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Monson (Post 11541334)
Who is making an adapter plate and flywheel for that conversion?


I am.

I built the one in my 914. And I don't make a flywheel, I make an adapter for the transmission and pressure plate.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads...6911_thumb.jpg

I have not started the production run yet. Covid delayed it big time. But the first prototype is in my 914-6 conversion.

You can see the info here: 914World.com - The largest online 914 community!

Here is a picture of the underside of the car with the engine in it.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads...1567132725.jpg

Let me know if you have any questions.

Clay

Geneman 12-09-2021 03:37 PM

Clay. THAT IS SCHWEET.! Best of luck getting it into production.

Geneman 12-09-2021 03:44 PM

Scott. In trying to sort this out, I started with Wevo race shifter , then went to the JWest unit... it was not good for me at all(worse than Weave) .. could not find gears in heat of moment. Now trying this CAE unit : https://cae-racing.de/CAE-Ultra-Shifter_3576. which virtually none of my wrenches have experience with ( +big $$$). We will see. it was discouraging when it arrived and I was told they had no installation alignment instructions in English .. had to wait 4 months for them...
Do you have 1st gear synchronized in your 915 box so you can use it on track?

winders 12-09-2021 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geneman (Post 11542420)
Scott. In trying to sort this out, I started with Wevo race shifter , then went to the JWest unit... it was not good for me at all(worse than Weave) .. could not find gears in heat of moment. Now trying this CAE unit : https://cae-racing.de/CAE-Ultra-Shifter_3576. which virtually none of my wrenches have experience with ( +big $$$). We will see. it was discouraging when it arrived and I was told they had no installation alignment instructions in English .. had to wait 4 months for them...
Do you have 1st gear synchronized in your 915 box so you can use it on track?

Only the reverse gear in a 915 has no synchro.

I have what is often called in the racing world an "active" 915. It means that 1st gear is useable at racing speeds. My 915 has a mainshaft with a changeable 1st gear.

If you can't get the Rennshift to work well something is wrong with the 915 or something else in your setup.

If the Wevo nor Rennshift work for you, I don't see how the CAE will........

Matt Monson 12-10-2021 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clay Perrine (Post 11542244)
I am.

I built the one in my 914. And I don't make a flywheel, I make an adapter for the transmission and pressure plate.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads...6911_thumb.jpg

I have not started the production run yet. Covid delayed it big time. But the first prototype is in my 914-6 conversion.

You can see the info here: 914World.com - The largest online 914 community!

Here is a picture of the underside of the car with the engine in it.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads...1567132725.jpg

Let me know if you have any questions.

Clay

Interesting. Can’t say that I’ve seen that approach before.

Tom '74 911 12-10-2021 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geneman (Post 11542420)
Scott. In trying to sort this out, I started with Wevo race shifter , then went to the JWest unit... it was not good for me at all(worse than Weave) .. could not find gears in heat of moment. Now trying this CAE unit : https://cae-racing.de/CAE-Ultra-Shifter_3576. which virtually none of my wrenches have experience with ( +big $$$). We will see. it was discouraging when it arrived and I was told they had no installation alignment instructions in English .. had to wait 4 months for them...
Do you have 1st gear synchronized in your 915 box so you can use it on track?

Quote:

Originally Posted by winders (Post 11542480)
Only the reverse gear in a 915 has no synchro.

I have what is often called in the racing world an "active" 915. It means that 1st gear is useable at racing speeds. My 915 has a mainshaft with a changeable 1st gear.

If you can't get the Rennshift to work well something is wrong with the 915 or something else in your setup.

If the Wevo nor Rennshift work for you, I don't see how the CAE will........

One more data point... My race car (SPEC 911) came to me with a Wevo shifter. I had been using a Seine Systems gate shift kit in my '74 911 (street/track) that I really liked, but was excited to try the Wevo, mostly due to the seemingly universal love that it gets. I found that I do not like the Wevo... at all. I did a lot of adjusting, spring swapping and even rebuilt the whole thing w/a bunch of new parts from Wevo but I could just not get along with it. I didn't like the feel and found it hard at times, to find gears. I finally gave up on the Wevo and bought a Rennshift for my race car... LOVE IT. I can't tell you what the mechanical differences are between the two, but the Rennshift just agrees with me - enough so that I bought a second one for my '74 to replace the Seine Systems kit.

This is all just one person's experience... I'm happy that there are so many options for us to chose from!

Best,
Tom

Gabe. 12-10-2021 08:08 AM

Am I the only one interested in seeing a PDK swapped into an aircooled? That could be a much cheaper alternative to a sequential.

Matt Monson 12-10-2021 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabe. (Post 11542833)
Am I the only one interested in seeing a PDK swapped into an aircooled? That could be a much cheaper alternative to a sequential.

Just gearbox to gearbox, on something like a Cayman, the PDK gearbox weighs 67 lbs more (256 vs 189). For reference, a 914 gearbox is 119 lbs, so either gearbox is increasing your car's weight.

A sequential is lighter than an equivalent street car gearbox. And there's no electronics or ecu. If someone has a motec, they can integrate a sequential into it, but you can 100% run a sequential strictly mechanically, and many do.

As is often the case in motorsports, the lighter a thing is, the more it costs.

chrisbalich 12-10-2021 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Monson (Post 11542863)
Just gearbox to gearbox, on something like a Cayman, the PDK gearbox weighs 67 lbs more (256 vs 189). For reference, a 914 gearbox is 119 lbs, so either gearbox is increasing your car's weight.

A sequential is lighter than an equivalent street car gearbox. And there's no electronics or ecu. If someone has a motec, they can integrate a sequential into it, but you can 100% run a sequential strictly mechanically, and many do.

As is often the case in motorsports, the lighter a thing is, the more it costs.

Matt, I feel like you really need a street car to beta-test that fancy new sequential you're developing. Something that will be driven in the rain and to the grocery store as well as on more spirited adventures.

***I'm also working on convincing my Mrs that I really need a sequential...for science.

Matt Monson 12-10-2021 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisbalich (Post 11542953)
Matt, I feel like you really need a street car to beta-test that fancy new sequential you're developing. Something that will be driven in the rain and to the grocery store as well as on more spirited adventures.

***I'm also working on convincing my Mrs that I really need a sequential...for science.


That's exactly what we did with the Cayman in my signature. This is what's in the trunk...
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1639168699.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1639168699.jpg

If any of you have followed the Blasphemy build that Mike O'Neil is doing, that's my adapter kit he's using. It mates a G96 or G87 gearbox to a Subaru Ej engine. I would love to put this Cayman sequential into a 914 with a Subaru, but I'm not building any projects right now. Maybe next year once things are more normal.

chrisbalich 12-10-2021 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Monson (Post 11543057)
That's exactly what we did with the Cayman in my signature. This is what's in the trunk...
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1639168699.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1639168699.jpg

If any of you have followed the Blasphemy build that Mike O'Neil is doing, that's my adapter kit he's using. It mates a G96 or G87 gearbox to a Subaru Ej engine. I would love to put this Cayman sequential into a 914 with a Subaru, but I'm not building any projects right now. Maybe next year once things are more normal.

Right on!
(I was hinting that I would volunteer for those DD beta-testing duties. :D )

Matt Monson 12-10-2021 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisbalich (Post 11543110)
Right on!
(I was hinting that I would volunteer for those DD beta-testing duties. :D )

I know. I play dumb a lot.

Geneman 12-11-2021 11:57 AM

Yes Matt. .. of course..: beta test... " For Science!!" and remember. I am the card-carrying scientist ... Plus.. I will sequence your genome FOR FREE! send it my way....

seriously. I hope you get that developed

aus911 12-11-2021 12:28 PM

Hi Mario,
Albins in Australia make the sequential transmissions for the V8 supercar series here in Australia, they also make various other transaxles. They list a lot of gears etc for Porsche transmissions.
May be worth a look. albins.com.au

Cheers
Ray

Clay Perrine 12-12-2021 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Monson (Post 11542863)
Just gearbox to gearbox, on something like a Cayman, the PDK gearbox weighs 67 lbs more (256 vs 189). For reference, a 914 gearbox is 119 lbs, so either gearbox is increasing your car's weight.

A sequential is lighter than an equivalent street car gearbox. And there's no electronics or ecu. If someone has a motec, they can integrate a sequential into it, but you can 100% run a sequential strictly mechanically, and many do.

As is often the case in motorsports, the lighter a thing is, the more it costs.

I thought about a PDK for my car. Then I started researching it. It won't be any easier to install, you still have to have an adapter for the engine and flywheel, and you still have to install a single shift cable for it. But you also have to have some kind of electronic controller to send the CAN bus signals to the trans for the upshift/downshift functions, and a tach/vehicle speed sensor to tell it when to automatically upshift. Another thing is the PDK is about 7K or more to buy one, the G86-21 is about 4K.

So for cost reasons, and for simplicity, I went with the 6-speed.

Plus.. I like to row the gears when driving.

Clay

faapgar 12-12-2021 03:46 PM

better shifting
 
Love these posts.If you have a good trans guy you can change the brake bands for the synchros to travel only 1.5-2.0 teeth instead of 3.5 teeth for synchro hookup.I have been doing this for 35 years.Only for my customers though.Never had a web site or want for more money.Hint is use a brake band from a later car and trim an earlier brake band for shorter travel.I no longer have a shop so I will share.Sometimes I have frustration to read these posts.I shared this knowledge with Grady.He enjoyed.The only problem is you need a driver who knows how to drive.Ciao Fred

Geneman 12-12-2021 04:09 PM

Fred that is cooler than snot..... something I have never heard on these pages. maybe you wanna visit my shop....

chrisbalich 12-13-2021 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by faapgar (Post 11545013)
Love these posts.If you have a good trans guy you can change the brake bands for the synchros to travel only 1.5-2.0 teeth instead of 3.5 teeth for synchro hookup.I have been doing this for 35 years.Only for my customers though.Never had a web site or want for more money.Hint is use a brake band from a later car and trim an earlier brake band for shorter travel.I no longer have a shop so I will share.Sometimes I have frustration to read these posts.I shared this knowledge with Grady.He enjoyed.The only problem is you need a driver who knows how to drive.Ciao Fred

Fred,
That's all news to me about modifying the synchros to quicken the shifts.
PA isn't all that far from IN if you still have tools and can find some time...


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