G50 stuck in 2nd

[luigisdad]

1989 Carrera 3.2 with G50, 134k miles.
After my shift rod bushing disintegrated, I used the G50 Bushing Kit and G50 Coupler. After many many hours of bruised knuckles, I finally got it together. My guess is it took me 6 times to assemble and then disassemble before I got things back together again. Took it out for a test drive and shifting from 1st to 2nd, it would pop out. Could not downshift from 3rd to 2nd. It would not enter 2nd and would grind.

Limped to my destination and let it cool down. Started it up again. To my pleasant surprise, it would now shift from 1st to 2nd, but still would not downshift from 3rd to 2nd. Would not engage in 2nd and would grind.

Got it home, loosened the 3 bolts holding the shift linkage and adjusted shift linkage towards rear of car. Shifted a little smoother (while car was off). Took it for another test drive. Car shifted from 1st to 2nd but again, would not downshift from 3rd to 2nd.

Took things apart, and shifted into 2nd, loosened bolts and pushed shift linkage as far back as possible. Tightened bolts again. Also, greased shift linkage with lithium grease. Shifted much much smoother (while car was off). Took it for another test drive.

Shifted super smooth from 1st to 2nd. No problems downshifting from 3rd to 2nd. Drove for 3 miles. Came to a stop light. Light turns green, and I shift into 1st, at 3000 rpm, I shift into 2nd. Try to shift into 3rd but transmission is stuck in 2nd. Come to a stop light holding in clutch, and cannot shift it out of 2nd gear. Limp home feathering in clutch, take it up to 5000 rpm and still cannot shift. Get it back into garage, shut off motor and still cannot shift.

I loosen the shift linkage bolts and still cannot shift. Stuck in 2nd.

Please help. I have to at least get it out of 2nd to get this towed to a mechanic to take a look at the synchros or other potential problems.

Thanks in advance.

Roy

[luigisdad]

Did some research and came up with 2 possible solutions. Any input would be extremely appreciated.

1. Loosen shift coupler and disengage out of 2nd gear.

2. Loosen bolt holding shift linkage (located under the car inside the "bellow"). This is a huge pain in the butt to do since getting the bellow to fit is non-trivial.

thanks in advance.
Roy

[MConn]

Not sure this will help, but a fellow Pelican posted these G50 instructions a while back -





Item #3 checking the gap with a 5mm drill bit helped my shifting.

Mike

[KTL]

Sound like a matter of adjusting the shifter and linkage properly. You need to take it apart again and get it out of 2nd, then select 4th.

I have a clearer version of what MConn posted. He actually got those images from me, i'm sorry to say, because it's a rather poor quality photocopy and scan of microfiche that I printed from a microfiche reader machine and then scanned with a desktop scanner

Since then I got a nice scanned copy of the '84-'89 911 factory repair manual

Bearing unit B in the instructions below is basically referring to the shift coupler assembly at the transmission shift shaft

[luigisdad]

Quick Question
When you say "take it apart again", do you mean unbolt the shift coupler #31 in your diagram, or will I need to unbolt #29? #29 is such a pain in the butt because of the rubber bellow.

Thanks
Roy

[luigisdad]

Ok. So I un bolted the shift coupler and could move nothing. So I undid the linkage bolt (under the car in the bellow) and separated the shift coupler from the linkage rod. However, I still cannot get the linkage rod to separate from the forged coupler piece. I can turn it about 1/8 in each direction but that's it. I don't want to force it in case I break something.
What do you think is causing the forged piece to be stuck to the linkage rod? How do I separate the 2 pieces without breaking any thing?
Thank you
Roy

[KTL]

It's much easier to unbolt #29 instead of disconnecting the bolts at the rubber noise/vibration isolator. Removing that #29 bolt is how the transmission shaft is disconnected from the coupler and allows you to take the transmission out of the car.

The rubber bellow stays on the transmission. So what you can do is unfold the big end of the bellow in the tunnel and shove it rearward into the round opening into the engine bay. Challenge with that is you have to get under the car to push the bellow back into the trans tunnel when you're done.

Once bolt #29 is removed from the coupler, the coupler should slide right off the transmission shaft. If you use the shifter, select third gear and that will pull the shifter tube forward and pull it off the transmission shaft.

With the shifter tube disconnected from the transmission shaft, that should have released the "tension" on the shaft causing the transmission to stick in 2nd gear, which was caused by the misalignment of the shifter. Since you now can feel some rotational play in the shaft, that means the internal shift mechanism isn't jammed up. Since you're still in 2nd gear, you need to PUSH on the transmission shaft to get it out of 2nd gear and back into neutral. Moving the shaft by hand takes some effort so don't be concerned about needing to lean on it pretty hard to get it to move.

[Jgordon]

I've read horror stories about shift adjustment following a shifter bushing replacement. I did not encounter any.

My process:

1. Remove shifter mechanism (a pain in the ass bc I didn't want to disassemble my center storage / ac control unit, but I got it out without doing so)

1a. NOTE WHERE THE SHIFT COUPLING MOUNTS TO YOUR SHIFT ROD.

2. Remove and replace bushings.

3. Reinstall shifter mechanism using the tricks on the board (angling it in, pulling up on shaft, wiggling like a mofo)

3a. MAKE SURE YOU REMOUNT THE COUPLING TO THE ROD IN THE SAME PLACE. You may already be past this point, but there should be some patina on each to guide you, if not a factory paint dab. I forget.

4. Without tightening your bolts holding the shifter mechanism to the transmission tunnel, work the stick. Make sure you have positive engagement in all gears, forward and back. I had to do this a few times, but I got it where I was comfortable.

5. Tighten the bolts.

I did this maybe 2k miles ago, and I have had smooth shifting since.

Hope this helps.

[MConn]

Originally Posted by KTL

I have a clearer version of what MConn posted. He actually got those images from me...Since then I got a nice scanned copy of the '84-'89 911 factory repair manual ...

KTL - Thanks for letting me upgrade my library - I O U several drinks for all the good advise you provide on the forum.

Here is a picture of my shift coupler in 2nd gear, the round metal lip to the front of the rubber is ~4cm.



The distance in 3rd gear is ~7cm, and neutral is ~5.5cm.

Mike

[famoroso]

Man! I'm SORRY to hear about your issues. I just did JWest RennShift, new bushings and coupler a few weekends ago. Apart from having to slightly adjust the shifter housing slightly aft, it was pretty easy and the resulting shift feel is tight & smooth.

Couple Qs. You say you replaced the coupler, but the above pic shows the factory coupler with black rubber. Is that a "before" pic? Also, looks like you have a zip tie holding the coupler accordion boot on. FWIW mine used a rubberband (looked like on o-ring).

Good luck! And keep us posted.

[KTL]

Originally Posted by MConn

KTL - Thanks for letting me upgrade my library - I O U several drinks for all the good advise you provide on the forum.


Mike

Glad to help/share Mike. Do you need a copy of the '84-'89 factory repair manual? I don't see that I shared that will you on my google drive.

[luigisdad]

Thank you very much to Kevin, Mike and JGordon for all your help.
Frank, those weren't pictures of my car. That was Jgdordon's.
I installed the G50 Shift coupler from Jwest as well as the bushing kit from Jwest. James has been very helpful as well. I'm going to reattach the shift coupler and hope I'm able to separate the shift coupler from the shaft.
Quick question - am I supposed to Grease that connection where Bolt 29 connects?
Also, when you're measuring the distance in the specific gears, are you adjusting the shift housing to get those measurements? I don't see any other way to adjust.
Thanks in advance.
Roy

[KTL]

You can grease the bolt #29 to help it slip in. It's a smooth shank bolt because that machined shank is a nice fit to avoid adding any slop to the shifting assembly. It's typically called a shoulder bolt because the shank is a fairly precise machined fit into the receiving hole of the shift coupler.

Yes you are moving the shifter housing around in the tunnel to get the 5mm clearance in 4th gear. Everything else is tightened and the three bolts that hold the housing in the tunnel are the only way you can adjust things to get that 5mm clearance you want.

If it makes you feel any better, adjusting the 915 is much worse. That splined coupler and its pinch collar is VERY sensitive to adjustment. It's nice that the G50 has very few adjustments you can make. Basically all you can do is connect the coupler, shift tube and the pivot points at the shifter. The only way to adjust the selection of gears is by where you place the shifter housing in the tunnel.

[luigisdad]

I was wondering if someone knows what caused the shaft to get stuck in 2nd gear. I was thinking of applying grease to the shift linkage connection. While I don't want the transmission to get stuck again, I also don't want the transmission to pop out of any gear because there's too little friction. Any ideas on why it got stuck in 2nd gear?

[KTL]

I don't think any grease is needed in the rear at the shift linkage connection. Those connections are all bolted together and therefore grease won't "un-stuck" anything. In the front by the shifter, the only places grease is needed are:

-ball socket #15
-pivot pin #17
-guide bushing #24

in the shifter diagram posted above. Use a synthetic grease to prevent the grease from attacking plastic parts like guide bushing #24 and causing it to crumble in the future.

The G50 has an internal shift gate mechanism to accurately transfer the shifter movement to the shift forks inside the transmission. If the shifter isn't properly aligned, it cannot cleanly operate the shift gate mechanism within some rather tiny slots and that's how things can get jammed up.

Below is a picture of the internal shift guide system of the G50 and you can see part #18 is the slotted gate i'm referring to. Part #10 is called a transfer lever and moves up-down and/or side-to-side when the shifter is moved. If the shifter's position is not in proper alignment with the transfer lever, the transfer lever's guide pin will not properly follow the gate slots. So this is where I think you're getting jammed because the shifter isn't properly positioned to follow the shift gate's road map?

[luigisdad]

Hi
Finally took time off from work to get this done. Did everything according to what was written and got it unstuck. I adjusted 4th gear to 5CM and test drove it. Well, it's not staying in 2nd gear again.

Upon review of the posts above, I'm a little confused. Mike (MConn) wrote 2nd gear 4CM, 3rd gear 7cm and Neutral is 5.5cm. As per his picture, it definitely looks like CM. However, the Porsche Factory Repair Manual 34-157, clearly states that 4th gear is adjusted to 5MM.

So, is the CM reference correct, or is the MM reference correct? Clearly, at 5CM, it is popping out of 2nd gear.

Thank you very much.
Roy

[Lyle O]

Hold on, I think you are mixing up where the measurements should be taken from. The shop manual says to measure the gap from part #24 (slide ring) and #14 (shift rod head). This is up front at the gear selector, and should be 5mm in 4th gear (see the separate diagram for this on page 34-157). You set this gap by moving the shifter forward and back (via the 3 main shifter mounting bolts). Again, this is up at the gear selector (shift lever bracket), not in the back by the shift coupler assembly. Make sure you have this correct first.

[MConn]

Luigisdad,
Sorry if my post was confusing. I showed a picture of the coupler at the back seats to help you see what gear you are in. The 5MM measurement is at the shifterby the front seat, like Lyle O mentioned.

Mike

[luigisdad]

Mike
Thank you very much for your clarification. Yes, I was confused LOL.

Quick question. Are your measurements for 2nd gear, 3rd gear and Neutral for the coupler as shown in your picture?

[MConn]

The picture in post #9 is in 2nd gear - the tape measure is resting against the sheet metal lip that the rubber boot wraps around. The 4cm mark is about the front of the black rubber as shown. Then, I shifted into neutral and the measurement was about 5.5cm. When I shifted into 3rd gear the distance was 7cm. I adjusted my shifter using KTL's instructions before taking these measurements.


Since you were stuck in 2nd gear, I thought this may help with troubleshooting.

Mike