3.2 Swap in 1976- what to do with the original 2.7?

[cvlcporsche]

I have a REALLY nice 1976 911 coupe that I have been contemplating doing a 3.2 swap with. I just bought an 84 3.2 Carrera that is mechanically stellar but aesthetically VERY challenged that I bought very reasonably. I figured I could harvest the drivetrain and everything else I need and sell off the other parts. So here are my questions:

1. Should I sell the numbers matching 2.7 that is currently in the car? It has about 40k miles on a $6k reseal, refresh, etc and has very good compression and leak down. It has Carrera tensioners and the pop off valve and would be 100% complete. I figured I would sell it as a buyer could even drive the car and see its a solid plug and play setup for someone. If I did that what do you think it's worth.

On the flip side I am also a longhood guy and longterm will I regret not having thr correct #'s matching motor? I just figured I would offset some of the swap expense by selling it.

What do you think?

2. The original 915 in my car shifts well but the 915 in the 84 was rebuilt 2k ago. Similar question, should I swap both or is there any advantage to keeping the original 76 915? What's it worth if I sell it?

Looking forward to your thoughts!

[Joe Bob]

If you can afford to keep it do so.....if you need the money for the project sell it. Keeping it because it may be worth more as an original engine sometime down the road is a personal question.

Me.....sell it. You....ask your self if a 76 going to be worth the big bucks down the road or do you have the storage space for it....

As for the trans....keep it. easy to store/keep and you'll never get what it is worth.

[allaircooled]

There is a mid year on the for sale section with an asking price close to $43k. In no way am I saying yours or mine would ever be worth that much, but it seems like prices have been increasing. At least thats what I have noticed. So maybe having the correct engine would make it worth more?? Just a thought.

[tdskip]

The other side of the coin is that once you experience a 3.2 in an earlier lighter car I doubt the 2.7 is going back in. (Says the guy with a '74 with a 3.2 in her)

[Dodge Man]

A mid 70s is not going to bring the $$ like an early 70s but the mid 70s have been moving up in price. IMHO having the numbers parts makes it more desirable down the road for resale. I miss my valuable numbers parts today but they were not worth very much 25 years ago. M2CW if you have the space, fill the cylinders with ATF and put the parts on the shelf. You may want to go retro in the future or find a Carrera CAB roller.

[Josh D]

...On the other hand, If I was a buyer, a clean 3.2 swap would be a bonus I'd be willing to pay more for on a middie. It really depends on the overall condition of the car (low mileage, super clean original) or the buyer.

[cvlcporsche]

Thanks for all the feedback. If my car was a super low mileage, all original paint, fully documented car I wouldn't consider the swap. However here is what I have:

1976 Euro 911
No roof, no air, crank windows! As light as they come!
255km (158k miles) chassis miles

Body is PERFECT
Paint just done to a VERY high standard, totally disassembled, all new trim, gaskets, etc. Original color.
Interior is pristine, perfect dash, headliner, carpet and seats all just done.
Mechanically the car is currently excellent as well, I just want more grunt as all my other 911's have big power...

I don't think the car I have will ever be a huge dollar car since it has high chassis miles and has been restored as opposed to being a survivor. However I also own two long hoods and I cant believe what the values have done so I think about the value of matching numbers. However my dilemma is that I love the aesthetics of this car, but I am so used to more power that its a little boring to drive.

Some of my decision hinges on motor and trans values. If the motor is worth $4k, its a no brainer, I would sell it. If its worth $2k no way. So what do people think the motor and the trans is worth?

Again the motor has unknown total miles but did get a $6k reseal, refresh 40km (24k miles) ago and has all the correct updates (carrera tensioners, pop off valve, turbo valve covers, etc.) no oil leaks, etc. The transmission I have no record of a rebuild however in my opinion it shifts too well for never having been done.

[1982911SCTarga]

One thing I've often pondered: Out of all the classic 911s ('65-'89), which particular models would be least likely to be numbers-matching? Wouldn't it be the mid-years? And, if so, wouldn't a numbers-matching mid-year car command a somewhat significant premium at some point (supply and demand)?

If you can swing it, why not keep both drivetrains?

Brian

[tdskip]

Seems like your decision here is pretty clear - go have fun with it based on your statements above.

[NeedSpace]

Back in the 80s, a Mercedes 190SL was considered pretty much junk. I started looking to buy one in the 90s. I saved up to pay a reasonable amount on the car in the late 90s. Now, it is worth 3 to 4 times what I paid for it. Unfortunately much better than most of my other investments since then. The middie will be a collector some day, and numbers matching is the way to go. As stated before, there are few middies that haven't been hacked. Store it you'll be happy you did.

[ToddM]

I don't know guys, are we building our cars for resale or for enjoyment? I suppose only us as individuals can answer that.

[snbush67]

This guy might enjoy a good motor:

1972 valves - Non-intrusive?

[Lapkritis]

Keep the numbers matching if you go 3.2. It's only a good idea to split up a match if you want to increase the value for other owners that remain matching.

Have you considered some acceptable level of modification for your 2.7? These engines can be awoken with proper treatments... hot cams, carbs, headers are reversible and do pay off.

[cvlcporsche]

Originally Posted by Lapkritis

Keep the numbers matching if you go 3.2. It's only a good idea to split up a match if you want to increase the value for other owners that remain matching.

Have you considered some acceptable level of modification for your 2.7? These engines can be awoken with proper treatments... hot cams, carbs, headers are reversible and do pay off.

I have thought about it but here is the dilemma: I bought this car because I loved the color, the no sunroof, no air, crank windows and the fact it has stunning body, paint and interior. I own several other air-cooled cars so I have zero need for this one (when does need and air cooled Porsche ever come together...) but I am just smitten with everything other than power. I felt like the stars lined up since I also just bought a mechanically excellent 3.2 for a very reasonable amount so I started figuring I could do the conversion for almost free simply by selling spare parts off. So I know I would love the combo (I have had another 3.2 liter mid year car years ago) but I am worried about upsetting the Porsche gods by deflowering this car... The low budget swap keeps the wife happy as she was mildly irritated that another car appeared in the garage.... I can afford to keep the original drivetrain but then the swap becomes a $5k proposition as opposed to almost free.

[darkbeer]

I rebuilt a broken head studs x 2, 1987 3.2 motor and put it in my '75 Targa. I traded the orig (tired) 2.7 and a spare 2.7, plus some deep sixes and an old 912 roller for the 3.2 so it's pretty hard to determine what $ value is involved.
In hindsight, I wish I had tossed the orig 2.7 in a corner and pickled it for future use. I have to say, a 3.2 in an "early" (read light) 911 is heaven, even with 8:31 r&p 915...with a 7:31, it would be damned near scary !!!!! Remember to install the front oil cooler setup from a 78-89 car...it's a must.

I also have a 74 coupe with 2.7 and 7:31 915, and will most likely keep it that way.

try to keep the orig motor, at least the block.....

[midnight911]

get a bus or a vanagon and put it in there.

[Dodge Man]

I would recommend checking the case casting numbers because a 76 Euro should have the aluminum case 3.0 & aluminum trans unless changed. IMHO If it is a C3 case & trans then it is definitely a keeper engine & trans.

[fpayqafa]

You may want to go retro in the future or find a Carrera CAB roller.

[cvlcporsche]

Originally Posted by Dodge Man

I would recommend checking the case casting numbers because a 76 Euro should have the aluminum case 3.0 & aluminum trans unless changed. IMHO If it is a C3 case & trans then it is definitely a keeper engine & trans.

I wish it was a 3.0 car but it actually started life as a base 1976 911 (in the US all were labeled 911S but in Europe the base car was just 911 with a 2.7) and the case is the correct euro 2.7 mag case.

[tdskip]

Originally Posted by darkbeer

Remember to install the front oil cooler setup from a 78-89 car...it's a must..

Good advice.