Engine removal..

[targabill]

I'm am going to remove my engine, 82 SC Targa CIS, to replace flywheel oil seal. Can you remove just the engine? Just the trans, or is it easier to remove both together?

THANKS
Bill

[PCA7GGR]

Yes you can remove the engine without removing the trans. BUT aligning the transmission shaft back into the engine is close to impossible.

Save yourself time and grief, remove the engine/transmission as a unit. The additional time and effort is minimal.

[al lkosmal]

remove both together.......easy to do!

[stubble88]

Hardest part for me is tilting the motor down so you can clear the trans shift rod. You don’t want it resting on the tunnel.

[ErrorMargin]

Engine and transmission together is much easier.

With the engine and transmission out, it is the perfect time to do other maintenance like replacing fuel lines, triangle of death, cleaning, etc

This thread has some info you might find helpful;

https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/1153485-pulled-engine-my-84-targa-now-fun-begins.html

[john walker's workshop]

Most shops just remove the engine. No sense doing more work than needed. A jack with adjustable tilt is the ticket.

[proporsche]

there is absolutely no reason to remove it with transmission. Once you have the clutch in place and aligned...it is actually easy to merge them together....i will send you some pictures in couple of days if you are not going on this job yet.
The only trick is to align the clutch fork-also easy
I use regular floor jak with flat rubber pad , it goes exactly under the strainer plate .This way you have perfectly centered the engine and you can move it left and right and sideways......
I have done it like this for many years......
1st you align the starter stud..after you can swing engine left or right to align the other studs.

Make sure before removing the engine you have the back up wires disconnected from the transmission switch,plus heater hoses from heat exchangers among other stuff on the bottom ,clutch arm including the bracket so you can get easier to the 15mm nut behind it (holds trans.to the engine)
Also disconnect the shifter coupler in the tunel 3mm allen socket for that.

[Rodsrsr]

If you're doing this at home with a floor jack, just pull the motor & gearbox as a unit. Its the standard method for doing this job. I really don't see any advantage in doing it separately. Its only 2 extra bolts and some linkage to drop the gearbox. Porsche designed it this way for a reason. Plus it allows you to clean everything properly and take care of any additional "while you're in there" items with a nice empty engine bay.

[proporsche]

Originally Posted by Rodsrsr

If you're doing this at home with a floor jack, just pull the motor & gearbox as a unit. Its the standard method for doing this job. I really don't see any advantage in doing it separately. Its only 2 extra bolts and some linkage to drop the gearbox. Porsche designed it that way for a reason.

actually there is a picture as the Porsche boys were removing just the engine from 911 without the transmission...
In this case when doing it at home it is more easier just the engine, than if you have a shop with a lift....the reason i`m saying this, been doing it like this since the 1980`s

Ivan

[Rodsrsr]

So it sounds like if you're a professional or have several years of experience, removing separately is doable and may save a small amount of time, but if its your first engine drop, its much more straightforward to remove as a combined unit. Plus as others have pointed out you'll be able to address any additional issues with an empty engine bay. As a reference point, I've removed the engine/gearbox from my 3.2 at least a dozen times and it typically takes 2-3 hours max if I've working at a very modest pace. One hour and a half was my quickest time.

Shops are interested in just knocking out the job, which in this case sounds like a rear main seal so I understand the need for time saving hacks, but if you're the one doing the job, the few extra minutes time saved will be a trade off to a more complete repair/cleaning job.

Lots of info on the rear main seal install once you finally get it apart, so be sure to research this. You don't want to have to drop the motor again!

Good luck and let us know how it turns out!

[boyt911sc]

This subject came up some years ago and John W. was a proponent of removing a 911 motor and leaving the transmission in place. I had dropped the motor and transmission several times doing it alone and it was easy. My curiosity drove me to try removing the motor alone. Yes. It is doable removing the motor alone. But getting the motor back by yourself is a nightmare. Maybe there was a trick to achieve this job without getting frustrated.

It took me several years to collect the feedbacks from 75 individuals about this subject from different places in the world during my travel. Most of these people I asked were good practicing DIYers and a third were professional mechanics from Porsche dealerships, independent shops that work with German cars, etc. The question was:

“I have a ‘78 SC 911 that needs a new clutch and replace the rear main seal. Which procedure do you prefer doing this job? Remove engine/transmission or just the engine?”

Out of the 75 people included in the survey, only 3 claimed to prefer removing the engine alone and 72 chose to remove both engine/transmission together. All three (3) came from this forum. There were about 20 people in my list that were not connected to this forum but professional Porsche mechanics/shop owners.

One of the most memorable comment I received was:

“For bragging rights people will claim removing the engine alone without the transmission is the way to do it.” If this is true, mechanics are paid per job order and will do it. But they prefer to remove both engine and transmission because they knew it was more difficult to put back the motor alone than installing the engine and transmission together.”

If you think removing and installing the engine alone is a better option, then do it. Wish you the best.

Tony

[proporsche]

Tony ..back in the 1980`s i did it both ways....one day our master mechanic showed me the trick how to go about to remove-install the engine by itself...i do not need to brag about it..I will gladly do a video how it is done..I can even make a write-up how to do it...in 1987 me and my friend were doing a clutch jobs - with the use of hoists in our shop 2 cars 1983 .It was a game who does it 1st. Minus oil drain, after oil in and drive off..we booth did it less then 50 minutes-- i beat him by 5 minutes;-)
Engine out and in ,replacing clutch and out of the door...included flywheel seal.No engine top reseal...
Ivan

to OP targabill: if you are going to do it at home and no lift,i suggest to remove the rear bumper so you can remove either both or just the engine easier...that is 8 nuts and washers

[PeteKz]

Ivan, please post a video if you can get one. TIA.

[rwest]

I second the video request!

The CV shafts can be a real messy item with a lot of bolts to remove.

I would be real curious to see just the engine come out.

[mike sampsel]

I've only done them both, three times now. If you are due for CV joints and or boots, both makes a lot of sense. If I had a hoist and the nice jack where I can dial in the proper angle on the engine (to mate to the trans then maybe). I've had trouble getting the engine and trans to align when both are on the ground ... so ...

Definitely less work to do just the engine, but not so if you cannot get the engine back in alone.

You can get the car up high enough to leave the bumper on. I do not recall the height you need to clear the bumper (sorry).

Both requires the CV joints off the trans, the sway bar and the trans mount bolts and the trans shaft too. (so there is the extra work and you need to balance the trans with another jack maybe. Unless you get the right balance.

[mike sampsel]

Here is how high I get mine



Did not remove bumper, but maybe the pope boot. Not sure about install. You can remove the front wheels to give you more room too instead of bumper
.

[pmax]

Engine removal without the tranny is an aspiration for most of us and definitely all of us weekend mechanics, it surely would be very nice not mucking with the darn CVs though.

[yelcab1]

I do not aspire to remove engine by itself. I am very good at what I do and I choose to do it with the gearbox. There is no bragging right, no incentive, no reasons for me to remove the engine by itself. If you can do it that way, good for you. I do it my way, every time. THis is not a contest. It is what I choose to do.

[kevbo]

vote both. Can get both out in a couple of hours now. It's only takes about 20 minutes to prep the transmission for removal.

[Billthebuilder]

I vote together