What Forgettable Parts Needed For Rear Suspension Refresh?

jyl · jyl's Garage

Well, the front end of my suspension refresh is getting close to done. Moving in fits and starts. Today - painted the A-arms, installed the Elephant Racing bronze bearings, re-installed the A-arms - now I have to order the ball joint castle nuts since I had to drill and chisel the originals off during disassembly. But, overall, I'm pretty close to turning the car around and starting on the rear.

Question: are there any parts / fasteners that typically get destroyed when working on the rear suspension, that I should order now - like the ball joint castle nut that gave me trouble on the front? Or parts that should always be replaced? Or special tools that I will need? I've read my Bentley but it didn't warn me about the ball joint hassle so I'm trying to tap the wisdom of the board.

(On the rear, I am replacing shocks, installing monoballs in the trailing arm and installing bronze bearings in the spring plates, and replacing the right-side axle/CV joints. Still undecided whether to tackle alignment / balance myself or take it to a shop.)

The only fasteners I have so far thought to procure are the CV joint bolts and the only tool is the 12-point CV joint bolt socket. What have I forgotten?

Chuck Moreland · 07-08-2003, 11:17 PM

John,

You'll need the special thin wrench for adjusting ride height on the spring plates. You will need a propane torch.

This is also a good time to replace the rear wheel bearings.

73911guy · 07-09-2003, 05:07 AM

I always replace lock washers on this type of job. In my opinion, they are very small in regards to the function that they are intended to fulfill, and the ones from the rear suspension for my '73 didn't have much "tooth" left after 30 years. I'd rather spend an extra dollar now than try and figure out why the alignment changed or why the suspension came loose.

Jim

KTL · 07-09-2003, 05:40 AM

Put some antiseize paste on the ball joint threads when you put the new slotted nut on there. The slotted socket is good to have to torque the nut. I think the spec. is something like 180 lb-ft. Bentley will tell you the exact #.

I agree with Jim. The serrated lock washers used under the camber and toe adjuster bolts are cheap and should be replaced.

Might want to consider replacing the spring plate brackets (the metal plates that fasten the spring plates to the body). But being that you're in CA, you probably don't need to replace them due to rust. Mine were ultra rusty on the inside and were trashed. See the link to my car in my signature if you're curious. Also get some longer M8 screws to be used for pulling the spring plate assembly back into the torsion bar tube.

I hope you're planning to remove or drop the engine & trans. down when doing the rear suspension stuff? Reason I say this is because in order to install your new monoballs, you need to remove the trailing arms. On a G50 car you have to move the transmission out of the way to get at the inner pivot bolts for the trailing arm connection. The trans. gets in the way of loosening and removing the bolt.

304065 · 07-09-2003, 05:57 AM

I'm going to replace the rear bananas soon, I plan to replace:

Both axles, including cv joints, boots, schnorr washers, flat washers
CV joint bolts
CV Joint to stub axle seals
Wheel Bearings
Castle nut
Castle nut cotter pin
Castle nut washer
Banana inboard mounting bolt, nut and washer

Additional cost of this stuff is probably $100 all in, but why not replace it? As far as I know my CV joint bolts have been in continuous use since April, 1971: no telling the stress they have seen in that time.

jyl · jyl's Garage

Okay, so in the exploded diagram posted by john_cramer, I'll replace the washers #30, the #23-#24-#25 castle nut-washer-cotter, and the wheel bearings.

I hadn't expected to have to drop the transmission in order to reach trailing arm nut #6. Blast. Oh well, it can't be rocket science, can it?

surflvr911sc · surflvr911sc's Garage

Don't forget #19, CV joint gaskets. Four if you remove both complete axles. Three if you just replace the one axle and disconect one side of the other. On second thought, get four, they're cheap and you never know when you might screw one up.

Chuck Moreland · 07-09-2003, 08:19 AM

This would be a good time to have your spring plates, spring plate covers and related hardware re-plated!

Superman · 07-09-2003, 08:27 AM

John, your CV joints and wheel bearings must be MUCH less expensive than mine. I barely get one rear wheel bearing for $100.

304065 · 07-09-2003, 08:46 AM

Whoops Super I meant the bolts, washers, pins and stuff. The bearings are as expensive as you say. I built a spreadsheet on all the required parts and it came to about $1700 including a set of Chuck's monoballs.

Which brings me to another point: I really want the ease of adjustability of the SAW spring plates, but can't stand the idea of having to put the plastic bushings on a lathe, and Chuck's 2G bushings appear to exceed even Porsche's high standards for engineering excellence. So how much of a PITA is it to adjust the factory adjustable spring plates? This is a race car that will be corner balanced and aligned many many times, probably in the paddock, so I want to minimize hassle if I can. Thoughts?

BGCarrera32 · 07-09-2003, 09:09 AM

I dunno...how often do you plan to change t-bars in the back? I'd be inclined to use the factory spring plates, but doing a little welding and machining to make a threaded screw and block type setup to do away with the ride height eccentric bolt. That way, you could crank on a ratchet/bolt combo in back to change the ride height easier. I think that eccentric is a pain, but I've heard a few too many complaints about sway-a-way spring plates for my liking too...

KTL · 07-09-2003, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jyl
Okay, so in the exploded diagram posted by john_cramer, I'll replace the washers #30, the #23-#24-#25 castle nut-washer-cotter, and the wheel bearings.

I hadn't expected to have to drop the transmission in order to reach trailing arm nut #6. Blast. Oh well, it can't be rocket science, can it?

I think dropping the trans. depends on what direction the pivot bolts were installed. I believe mine are installed with the head of the bolt on the inboard side of the car. That's why I couldn't remove mine. Length of bolt is longer than the space between the bolt head and trans. case. Yours may be different.

Also jyl, your car doesn't have castle nuts and cotter pins holding the CV axle in place. It's a big 32mm lock nut that's torqued to 340 lb-ft............ Gonna need a cheater bar and a strong breaker bar (I needed 3/4 in. drive) or an impact gun to get it off. The washer is really beefy and shouldn't need replacing. The locknut is beefy too. I dunno if this needs replacing. I replaced mine but don't think I needed to do so. Make sure to use plenty of antiseize when you reinstall the axles. Mine were heavily coated with factory copper antiseize when I took them out.

Quote:

by surflvr911sc:
Don't forget #19, CV joint gaskets. Four if you remove both complete axles. Three if you just replace the one axle and disconect one side of the other. On second thought, get four, they're cheap and you never know when you might screw one up

Actually the later CV axles on an 89 (85.5 thru 89 to be more specific) don't use a gasket. The Carrera axle is #1 below. And the cotter pin shown is only for the turbo & turbolook axle #2. #12 looks like a castle nut but there's two listings for #12. One item is a castle nut and the other is a locknut.

John Cramer,

The factory spring plates are not that hard to adjust. The SAW ones are certainly much much easier though. The problem with the factory plates is you need the thin wrench (no big deal) and then the nuts securing the plate pivot and the adjusting eccentric need to be torqued to something like 170 lb-ft. It's tough to get your 1/2 in. breaker bar in there to crank down enough torque on those nuts when the car's on jackstands. An impact gun would be more effective here.

Just my limited experience with setting the ride height on my car. Others may know of a better method to cinch those nuts while the car is on stands.

Chuck Moreland · 07-09-2003, 10:54 AM

I find the factory adjustables pretty easy to work with. Yes, SAW is a little easier to adjust, but just not worth the other hassles. The factory adjustables are fine.

304065 · 07-10-2003, 01:06 PM

OK Chuck, I just bought a set of factory adjustable spring plates.

Where did you get your stuff cad plated? $$?

Thanks

John

Chuck Moreland · 01:25 PM

The company is Swift Metal Refinishing in Santa Clara, CA. But I suspect you would do better finding a local shop that does the same so you don't have to hassle with shipping. Lot's of places do this.

jyl · jyl's Garage

Hmm, not sure how I'll remove or reinstall the "big 32mm lock nut that's torqued to 340 lb-ft" with my existing tools.

In fact, browsing through the Craftsman online catalog, I don't even see a torque wrench that exceeds 300 lb-ft. I see one on Pelican Parts but it approaches a compressor and impact wrench in cost.

What tools do those in the know use for this - another way of asking what tool should I buy? Should I get a compressor and impact wrench? How many HP or gallon will I need? Or should I go and find a really big torque wrench?

Sorry to sound so ignorant - this is a hitherto unexplored area of torquing for me. The biggest wrenches I own are a 1/2" breaker bar and a cheapo 1/2" 150 lb-ft torque wrench. Don't mind an excuse to invest in some tools . . .

350HP930 · 07-10-2003, 07:33 PM

Home depot has a 500 ft-lb impact wrench for a reasonable amount of money.

Chuck Moreland · 07-10-2003, 07:39 PM

John

Which nut are you talking about?

KTL · 07-10-2003, 07:42 PM

Get a 3/4 in. breaker bar, extension and the socket. Then go to the hardware store and get a length of galvanized pipe to slip over the end of your new breaker bar. Now you can crank up all the torque in the world!

I think alot of fellas that have done this got theirs from Harbor Freight- cheap! I got mine at Sears/Craftsman. Sears didn't have the 32mm socket so I used a 1-1/4" socket instead. Worked just fine.

As far as retorquing the nut, just use your body weight and the right location on the bar away from the center of rotation. Example:

I weigh 170 lbs. Torque needed = 340 lb-ft. 340/170 = 2 ft away from center of rotation of tool is where I place my hands on the bar and lean with ALL my weight.

Good idea to use a block of wood or jackstand under the pivot of the breaker bar to support it . You don't want the socket to slip off when you're cranking on it. Keep the car on the ground, in gear, with the parking brake on when you do this job. Just insert the socket thru the center of the wheel with the centercap removed.

Stubborn Stub Axle Nut

jyl · jyl's Garage

Chuck, I mean the one KTL mentioned in one of the prior posts (right above the exploded parts diagram). I went and looked it up in my Bentley too. Edit: stub axle nut.

KTL, thanks, I read the thread you referenced, I see that I don't need to buy either an impact wrench or a 3/4" torque wrench, but just some Harbor Freight stuff. Cheap is good - I'm spending a bit on this project already.