Importing/Exporting a Carrera GT

[B D]

Here's an excerpt from a report I posted today.

On a related note, a recent article from Reuters even suggested that Germans are now able to import a new Porsche Carrera GT from the U.S. for less money than buying the car domestically. In fact, it claims, even after paying import taxes twice, a German would still save enough to have a Porsche Cayenne SUV thrown in for the same price as buying a Carrera GT domestically.

Sounds like it's a good time to export a car to Europe.

Anyone ever export a car, I would like to send a early 911/912/914 over and drive it around for a month and then sell it to who I don't know.

[svandamme]

eeem us europeans aren't dumb ya know, we lurk about in the forums here and we know the prices on the US market too... and we'll pay those prices on a us registred car so don't get any bright ideas like pocketing that 25% discount that the Euro provides

seriously , exporting, shouldn't be to much of a problem depends on what country you're planning to export to, but the rules are similar ...
you'll have the customs to pay
then you'll have to get it approved for roadworthyness
no rust , all bells and whisles should be working in good order, if it's over 20 or 25 years old , it might be easier , depending on the country.
but normally it's the buyer who takes care of that not the seller.

[targa911man]

Damn. Now the Germans are going to buy up all of ours and I won't be able to get one!

[JonSeigel]

Originally posted by svandamme


seriously , exporting, shouldn't be to much of a problem depends on what country you're planning to export to, but the rules are similar ...
you'll have the customs to pay
then you'll have to get it approved for roadworthyness
no rust , all bells and whisles should be working in good order, if it's over 20 or 25 years old , it might be easier , depending on the country.[/B]

I thought the point of the EU is that there wouldn't be different rules for each country.

[svandamme]

well , the EU is a work in progress, part of it works, part of it doesn't

the car part is still country by country

[Matt Holcomb]

Cashing in on ignorance aside, how would you make money exporting a car to Europe from the U.S.?


Matt Holcomb
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[B D]

How would you make money exporting a car to Europe from the U.S.?

Germans are now able to import a new Porsche Carrera GT from the U.S. for less money than buying the car domestically...a German would still save enough to have a Porsche Cayenne SUV thrown in for the same price as buying a Carrera GT domestically

Basically, by selling a car (yes price does matter). Obviously it would be in there intrest to buy a US car, even pay to import it and still save some cash.

If I did it myself with a early 911?912/914 I would not mind taking a hit of up to $2K if I got to drive it for a month or so around Europe. A trip to Pomona, a month of repairs, and let her ride over the big pond on a ship.

[Joeaksa]

I have helped import several Porsche's to Europe, and mainly Germany. The older cars almost do not exist there due to the salt on the roads in winter and their harsh TUV inspections.

Found a mint 356 in Arizona a few years back and brought it back for a good friend of mine. He drives it everyday when the weather is good and simply could not have found one like it in Germany, no matter what the cost.

Joe A

[ben@benlovejoy.]

If anyone is exporting a GT to Europe and wants a volunteer to drive around Europe in it with a 'For sale' notice in the window, I'm your man.

Ben

[jluetjen]

you'll have the customs to pay

Why? At least in the case of Germany, the car was manufactured there so I doubt that you'll need to pay customs. Generally customs is only paid on goods which have been manufactured outside of the country. I'd consult your local Consolate though before committing.

[rkh3]

I sold a '70 Challenger to someone in Germany recently. It cost him around $6,000 (shipping, taxes, etc) to get it there.

[Joeaksa]

John,

To not pay customs you would need to prove that the vehicle was at one time taxed and registered in Germany. Even if the car was made in Germany, it was then and imported to another country without paying any taxes or licenses in Germany, so the gents in the customs office would want to see you before the car was allowed out of their control.

Joe

[bfegan]

Interesting subject. What are the administrative hurdles (and costs) associated with taking your own car to europe for a month or so and bringing the same car back with you?

[ben@benlovejoy.]

Depends on whether there is a record of the car ever leaving Germany. If not, it's no different to re-registering a car that has been in a barn for 20 years.

Ben

[bfegan]

My car is an 88 Carrera which was purchased new from a dealer. I'm certain there must be a record of its' being imported. Thanks!.

[svandamme]

export products are never taxed in the country of origin

when you import a 911 made in germany but sold in the us
you will need to pay taxes on the current value of the car.

the only exceptions are if the car is owned by somebody who is effectively imigrating, if you can prove that you owned the car for 6 months prior to immigrating, you will not have to pay.

To not pay customs you would need to prove that the vehicle was at one time taxed and registered in Germany. Even if the car was made in Germany, it was then and imported to another country without paying any taxes or licenses in Germany, so the gents in the customs office would want to see you before the car was allowed out of their control.

that's not correct, even if it was registred in germany and was exported , then the old registration is discontinued, which gives the car the same status as a car who was sold by a US dealer, and then is imported in europe the barn situation isn't the same, as the old registration wouldn't have been discontinued , it would just not have been insured , or road legal in terms of road taxes and/or technical certification. if you export a registred car, the registration will probably be closed and marked with exported...


theoretically, as far as using the car for month , don't see a problem there, as long as your car is insured and technically sound and all the papers are allright, there shouldn't be a problem.

but considering nobody will just drive his car on a boat , ship it , drive it around and ship it back, the police might look funny when seeing a californean number plate. and they might check you out a bit more often, dunno .. i've never seen a US number plate in Europe, atlantic ocean is quite big i guess..

[twin plugged targa]

Svandamme is correct.
If you have owned the vehicle for over 6 months and have lived outside the country you are importing to, then you do not have to pay duty.
However if the car you are importing is less than 10 yrs old then it has to pass what is called a SVA test (in the UK) other EU countries have similar tests.
They have stringent tests to ensure it meerts Euro standards.
This may be easier for an European designed/built car.
For it to be registered (in the UK) if old, it must pass a vehicle test - which is way more intensive than any US vehicle test!.

The older cars are in demand in the UK due to salt on the roads and the general wet climate. Also because owners seem to find it cool to update to a newer car style hence you see a lot of long hood cars being converted to SC/carreras and alot of SC/Carreras being converted to 964 's Go figure!

If you are concidering exporting/importing a porsche to Europe, concider the insurance issue. If the car is modifyed you may not get coverage or it will be expensive.
As for prices on used Porsches, I have been monitoring them fairly closely and believe that early cars are slightly more expensive in the UK whereas LHD 993's are much cheaper in the UK.
The added value of a US car apart from the lack of corrosion is the fact that there are generally straighter longer roads and slower speed limits. Cars mileages in the US are actually comparable to a Euro mileage which are 30% less or perhaps even less
Hope this helps anyone
Ben

[svandamme]

for the record, the vehicle test, has nothing to do with the customs.

you can import the car without it, but you would have to pay customs on the value, the customs office could have the car appraised and calculate the price on that ... so importing a concours state 72 911, and claim it's only worth 2 grand would not work, they would pick up on that and make up their own assessment...

the prices on pre '80 911's i'de agree , they are way more expensive here, but i'm not sure if rust is the main reason.. some areas in the US have just as wet climate as Europe.


70% of all 911's were going to the US market , so there were less of em in the fist place, i think that's the main reason

i payed 16K euros for a 73 Targa, there's rust that i'm working on now, not much, the paint job was bad, there were lot's of little things that need taking care off, if it were in 90% condition, i'de easely sell it for 24K

from what i see on the forums, a car like this would be worth considerably less if it came on the market in the US, anybody can confirm this ??

[ben@benlovejoy.]

I'm certain there must be a record of its' being imported. Thanks!.

Record of IMPORT, sure, but that doesn't matter. What matters is whether there is a record of EXPORT.

that's not correct, even if it was registred in germany and was exported , then the old registration is discontinued, which gives the car the same status as a car who was sold by a US dealer, and then is imported in europe the barn situation isn't the same, as the old registration wouldn't have been discontinued

In Germany, registrations are local. If I sell you my car, you will re-register it wherever you live. What is to stop you doing exactly the same thing with a car that you've bought overseas?

Ben

[bfegan]

I would think that a Porsche exported to the US and sold here would have first been in some fashion "registered" in Germany and some tax paid to the German government by Porsche prior to its' having been exported.

Having said that, and assuming it is correct, my thought was to possibly ship it back for a temporary "vacation" so that it (and its' owner) could visit its birthplace and then in a reasonable period of time return to the US. I lived in Germany and The Netherlands for 10 years some time ago and occasionally saw cars with US plates driving around. I also see cars with European plates driving around here. So people are doing it.

My original question was oriented upon identifying the bureaucratic hassles involved, and there certainly appear to be some.

Thanks for the help.

Ben