DE tire recommendation?

[Lucky]

I have some track wheels on the way, now I need to decide what to put on 'em. Tires, like many things track related, are a bit of a mystery to me so I will certainly benefit from the collective experience of this board.

I'm not after ultimate grip, but I would like some decent stick, good useful life (on the track), and the option (in a pinch) of driving to/from the track (at least Summit Point, which is about 70 miles away) on them.

Sizes I'd like to run: 225/50 (on 7x16 rim) and 245/45 (on 8x16).

As a starting point, I'm currently considering one of these: Yoko 32R, Toyo RA1, or Kumho VR V700.

What do y'all suggest?

[91C2wrencher]

well, my $0.02 worth, I had a set of the yokos and ran them for years on autox they were great. last year changed over to toyo RA1 and am dissappointed. the yokos are very niosy but are a great weekend warrior tire for driving back n forth to events. the toyo's are very quiet by comparison but didn't seem to have grip, nice ride though. the yoko's were happy with a mild camber of just under 2 deg. where the toyo website suggests a rather aggresive camber of 2-5 deg up front, so i'll try that this year, but that makes for a twitchy car on the highway. for the track/ax i'd go with yoko's.

[IROC]

Another vote for the Yoko A032s. I've used them for about 6 years now and think they are the best street/track compromise tire out there.

Mike

[spinner]

I finally dumped the 032Rs before the noise made me deaf. They're a good compromise between track and street but the noise finally did me in after six years of use. You don't notice the noise at the track but in-between DEs, you do hear the pack of wolves howling! I have Kumho Victoracers right now and my ears are very grateful. I hear good things about the Toyo RA-1s - I understand they wear very well plus more shtick than the 032Rs. The Kumho V700 might be a problem unless shaved and properly heat-cycled (from what I hear).

[Tim Stevens]

Lucky,

Kumho VR V700 is what I have and I love them. I have not noticed much noise at all coming from them in transit to and from the track. I have done many upgrades to my car
and believe the move to the Victor Racers was the best improvement so far. Good luck – Tim

[JonT]

kuhmo's also got a new tire that is similar to VRV700 that is lighter and can be swapped sides for longer wear

http://www.kumhotireusa.com/Products/PtnDetails.asp?CatID=8&mainCatID=1

[KTL]

In the Victoracer specs, you'll find that even though the tires say "THIS SIDE OUT" or "THIS SIDE IN," the tires can be run on either side in either direction

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/kumho/ku_victoracer_care.htm

cstreit swears by the Victoracers. But for DE they might be overkill? Depends on your car. Chris's car is a dedicated race car. Not street legal by any means!

[Noel]

The most important question, since you made a point of not knowing much about track related stuff, is how much track experience do you have? You will learn to drive your car much better and learn much more by driving on street tires for at least the first six or seven weekends. Sticky tires tend to mask sloppy driving. Also, a set of Yok AVS ES100s are significantly cheaper than most R tires.

Just my $.02.

Noel

[rattlsnak]

Yokos 032 are by far the worst tire I have ever been on for D/E. I have never been on them for AX though. Over the years I have ridden in alot of students cars, and every single time the car has felt "loose", sure enough they had 032s. MPSC are the best if you can get them hot enough, as in a heavier car, or really slinging yourself around, most people around here run the Kumhos or Hoosiers. Those two are probably the best tire for the value.

[IROC]

Originally posted by rattlsnak
Yokos 032 are by far the worst tire I have ever been on for D/E. I have never been on them for AX though. Over the years I have ridden in alot of students cars, and every single time the car has felt "loose", sure enough they had 032s. MPSC are the best if you can get them hot enough, as in a heavier car, or really slinging yourself around, most people around here run the Kumhos or Hoosiers. Those two are probably the best tire for the value.

The original poster needed a tire for both street and track, though. Hoosiers on the street would be silly and I wouldn't want to be on Kumhos in a heavy rainstorm.

As for the Yokos being so horrible on the track - I think it would be hard for you to judge the quality of these tires from the passenger seat of a student's car. Way too many variables. As a point in the other direction, I was following a guy who was in an RS America (and we're both instructors, so he was no amateur) and he was "all over the track". Sliding around everywhere where my car (with the Yokos) was firmly planted. I went up to him afterwards to see what kind of tires he was running. Kumhos. Does this prove anything? Not really, other than anecdotal evidence can go both ways.

If you need a tire that can stand up to the rigors of track use and also work reasonably well in the rain (street use), then the A032s are a good choice.

Mike

[hobieboy]

I agree with Noel - its best to start learning with street tires.

They will give you plenty more warnings & if you make a mistake, they will also mask less of that.

As for experience with the tires - I have used both Kuhmos V700 & Toyo RA-1s - in pouring rain, neither will be good even on public road once you have a few DE days on them (i.e. when they are less than new). If you have dedicated rims, then it might be best to carry them to the track with your street tires on the car. Then you can also use your street tires as rain tires too Between the 2 in dry, I definitely prefer the Kuhmos.

[Jack Olsen]

One way to look at this question, aside from your experience level, is: what's your tire budget like?

The best track tires are Hoosiers. Their lifespan is extremely short, though. Depending on the track, it's possible to go through a $900 set of Hoosiers in 3-4 days of use.

Below that are the Kumhos and Toyos, which last a little bit longer, but still aren't going be that great after 7 or 8 days of heat cycling. Toyos last longer than Kumhos, but the Kumhos are cheaper.

Yoko A032R's have been described as 'not a great street tire, and not a great track tire,' and it's true. They're loud, and not as grippy as softer r-compound tires. But their advantage is that they last a long time, can be driven to the track, and will give you better grip than most street tires, as well as better feedback (meaning more gradual release, and a little more noise) than the Toyos, Kumhos and the Hoosiers.

The jury is still out on the Michelin Pilot Sport Cups, which -- for some guys -- give A032R life with Victoracer grip. They need to get up to temperature to be effective, and some 911's are too light to do this. Some people have said their performance falls off long before their lifespan is over.

I think A032R's would be a good first r-compound tire for you, since they'll probably last you all season, depending on how many events you run, and can be driven to and from the track without compromising their lifespan too much.

Keep in mind, I'm no expert. And a lot of people really hate A032Rs. In some cases, this might be because guys are running hot pressures that are much too high. For a lightweight 911, the target pressure should be something like 25/29, hot. If you try to run these tires up around 40 psi, they'll be terrible. Above 30, they get greasy.

[rattlsnak]

>>As for the Yokos being so horrible on the track - I think it would be hard for you to judge the quality of these tires from the passenger seat of a student's car. <<

Dont forget Mike, Ive ridden in YOUR car too!!

Trust me, you can feel a students car sliding around a corner at 20 MPH less than a normal speed. My point is this, at your next DE, look at all the tires in group 5 and see how many Yokos you see. Maybe 3 out of 30. You will see them in lower groups though.
Most people who have them have never run anything else, so they think they are great and the people who have tried something different, dont go back.
I understand this thread is very subjective to different people's "feel", I was just stating my opinion, and exp from over the years. If they work good for you, thats great.
I took his post as meaning track tires that he can drive to the track, not street tires that he put on the track. Heck I run full Slicks and drive 50 miles to the track!

[ZCAT3]

I just used Kumho Victoracers for the first time yesterday - I have also driven on Yokos and Hoosiers. Basically what is said abouive pretty much covers it.

The Hoosiers have better grip, but wear very fast. The Kumhos slide a bit more, are decent on the street, and stick pretty quickly. Yokos take a long time to heat up and reach good traction - but felt similar to Kumhos IMO after they were warm (but it took several sessions for this to happen).

If you have only done a few track days I would just stick with decent street tires and worry about being smooth as opposed to fast. Then once you have achieved a good smooth line, switching to R compound will allow you to basically run at the same comfort level with a fair amount of additional speed.

P.S. I am a novice DE / track driver - maybe 10 days / 20-25 hours of
track time total. It has only been during my last 3 track days where I have used R compound tires so take my advice for what it is worth.


Bill

[Amac]

The R compound tires go away
fast, I go through 3 or 4 sets of
Hoosiers per year.
If your buying track wheels you may
as well put something sticky on them.
A good tire to start DE's with is BFG G-force,
their sticky for a street tire and wear pretty
well. That way you can drive to the track if
you need to.
I have driven 50 miles to the track with race
slicks, the last time I nearly killed myself in
the rain on the way home.

[beamonk]

The Yoko's are great in the rain and are really good for a beginner tire. At Road Atlanta last summer in the rain, everyone with Kuhmo's were all over the place, I had a ball with the Yoko's. Have a good tread live too.