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Front Shocks - Help!!!!
Guys,
I'm in the process of upgrading the front shocks on my '86 911. Have 101 projects. The struts are black and should be Boge. I purchased Bilsteins to replace. According 101 projects, I simply unscrew the top nut (done), push down on the shock and moved it under the fender (done), unscrew the cap that secures the insert (done) and pull the insert out of the strut (won't come out and oil is running everywhere). I bummed as it's not going well. What's wrong? What am I missing? Do I have something other than Boge? I'm really bummed right now... Help please... Thanks!!
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Regards, Jim '86 911 Carrera '88 528e Last edited by jet528e; 03-26-2004 at 04:56 PM.. |
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The Unsettler
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Sounds right. Same problem on both sides?
Scott
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Relax, I believe the oil is probably from your shock. I also believe that the strut is attached to the tower by three bolts. I'll check and repost
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Sorry I mis-understood.....You cannot remove the shock right? but you can move the strut?
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Yep the oil is from the old shock (insert or ?). My understanding was that the insert should just pull out of the strut housing but it doesn't. Don't know what I'm missing or what is wrong.
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Regards, Jim '86 911 Carrera '88 528e Last edited by jet528e; 03-26-2004 at 04:57 PM.. |
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Hi Scott,
I have not tried the other side yet. I'll go out now and see if it's the same issue. If it sounds right, how do I get the insert out. According to 101 projects, there is no pin or anything than needs to come out. Any ideas on how to proceed?
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Regards, Jim '86 911 Carrera '88 528e |
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JEt, I'll be at my Mechanics shop in the morning (Sat) for emissions and I'll investigate the issue with the front shocks.
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The Unsettler
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I had Boge in my 84. When I swapped in my Koni's I did exactly what you have done so far.
My inserts slid out relatively easy. Is there a dent or kink in the outer tube that could be keeping the insert wedged in? Definitely try the other side and see how it goes. The oil is a pain in the neck. Get a lot of rags to clean it out. Make sure you fish around and don't leave anything in the tube. Scott
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I had the same problem with mine the other night. The suction of the oil kept me from pulling the old strut out of it's housing. I used a screwdriver to pry off the seal/ring, which eliminated the suction and freed up the insert.
Good Luck!
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John Last edited by rzepko6194; 03-26-2004 at 05:56 PM.. |
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Thanks you guys,
I tried the other side and exactly the same. I'm calling it an evening and will try again tomorrow. Additional thoughts would be appreicated.
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Regards, Jim '86 911 Carrera '88 528e |
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Sounds like you are on the right track. I had no problems getting them out of my Boges on my 84. Can you grab them with a big pair of channel lock pliers? Are you sure they are not Bilstiens??
Let us know how you finally got them out. Cheers, good luck, Jeff
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Jeff,
They are black and I thought that meant they are Boge. I thought Bilsteins were green, did Bilstein have black as well? I had that same thought so I looked to see if there was a roll pin at the bottom of the strut but there wasn't one, at least that I could find. Any other thoughts? Thanks for the help.
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Regards, Jim '86 911 Carrera '88 528e |
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If they are Boge struts, you should see the word "Boge" stamped into the strut body under all the dirt and crud.
Did you try prying up on the seal surrounding the strut center shaft? It doesn't take much effort to lift it up enough to break the suction action of the oil.
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John Last edited by rzepko6194; 03-26-2004 at 06:25 PM.. |
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Everything is ok... Just pull them out... They will come out and I agree that the suction must be holding them in... I just replaced mine recently...
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If they are black and oil is going everywhere then you almost certainly have Boge. Original Boge struts don't use inserts, the shock parts come out exposed, so don't worry since I believe if my memory is right that 101 projects detailed an original Bilstein strut. I have seen both, they are quite different when they are coming apart. When they come out the oil is very messy even when you are expecting it. They should just pull out, as someone else mentioned the oil could be making it much harder. These will likely be like working a nautilus(sp) machine. Just a long steady pull and they should come unless they are bent or otherwise damaged which should be fairly obvious.
Clean all of the old oil out before you put the new inserts in, you don't need it with the Bilstein inserts.
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One other option for getting the insert out of the thing would be to put a boxed end wrench down over the shaft, and then put the top nut back on, then you can bang on the wrench to see if you can break the thing loose. Be careful of your fenderlip while you are doing all of this.
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Steve '08 Boxster RS60 Spyder #0099/1960 - never named a car before, but this is Charlotte. '88 targa ![]() |
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I have never known of insides of Boge struts being a lot of parts. They have always been inserts when ever I have been in there. I would take the top big nut that secured the shock stem and screw it back onto the stem. I would then use it for leverage to get the parts out.
The oil is used to transfer heat out of the strut body. Be sure to put the oil back into the strut after you slip the inserts into the tube. Enough oil to cover the inserts up to the bottom of the top securing nut. This is easier than you think. Just take it easy. Don't mess with those top three screws. They hold the shock mount to the top of the shock tower. They also secure your allignment! Good luck, David Duffield |
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Prior thread
Bilstein Insert into Boge Strut Thread with pics of the old Boge guts Front Boge "Insert" Guts Here's a quote from Chris Bennet from this thread: Bilstein Strut Insert Tool (Or: If you Want It Done Right, Do It Yourself) Quote:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/search.php?action=showresults&searchid=627251&sortby=lastpost&sortorder=descending
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Steve '08 Boxster RS60 Spyder #0099/1960 - never named a car before, but this is Charlotte. '88 targa ![]() Last edited by masraum; 03-26-2004 at 08:49 PM.. |
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Seems to be some contradictions here: I've removed and replaced these twice on an 89 and 87 911, both with Boge orginal struts. The original Boge use the shock housing as a portion of the shock assembly. Removing the upper portion will reveal all the "inners" of the shock in the housing. All this stuff need to come out to leave the bottom portion empty and clean. The Bilstein insert is a totally enclosed system and when you place it in the Boge housing, it is essentially a shock within a shock. I've never heard the need for any oil when placing these in. The insert is a very close fit and the amout of oil remaining would do very little. Replace and torque to specs. It doesn't hurt to put some blue loctite on the threads. One of mine actually came completely undone over a few years.
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I've BTDT....when I replaced my original Boge's a couple of years ago, the original inserts slid out of the struts with no problem at all (following the same procedure your are), and I replaced them with Bilsteins. Then, maybe six months later, I decided to replace all of the suspension components (bushings, ball joints, etc.) and 'one' of the new Bilstein inserts simply would not pull out of the Boge strut. There was no oil in the strut (suction, etc.), and nothing was bent, etc. that would apparently cause this. Since I was already going to take everything apart, I removed the strut from the car, and it took some serious blows with a BFH (against a nut on the top of the shock insert) to cause the insert to break free (after trying several other methods). I still don't know what caused this (as did no one else that I asked), but if I had not removed the strut from the car, I think it would have been virtually impossible to break it loose. Sorry I don't have any particular advice to offer, only to say that it happened to me, and it was VERY frustrating at the time...good luck!
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