I just bought a set of used BBS 15" (right now I have 17") for competition because I couldn't get my revs high enough on the straights. As it was told to me, the 915 trans was geared for 15" rims(sounds logical). I know there's a big brake issue with the 15" fuches, but what about the BBS 1-piece rims. Has anyone ever address the limits? Are they still the same limits as far as calipers or more importantly rotor size?

Here are pictures of both the brake set-up and the roller bearing spring plates...take from people who attended the GAF.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1095442981.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1095443010.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1095443038.jpg

That is sharp but still $4400? It's a lot of cash. But when you see a name like Wevo, you expect to get outstanding quality but also you expect to pay for it.

When I said:

" Hayden -

Post a pic of those springplates when you get back from playing.....er... testing "


WOW, here they are in the pic on the orange car.
Hardware WOOD.......! What a work of ART.

What would the benefit of the roller bearing spring plates be for a street car?

Dunno, but for my track 3.6 they are on my list.

I currently have all plastic bushings that bind and squeek like a herd of violated mice......

Any time stiction can be removed from the suspension it will be more compliant to road irregularities. The suspension can respond to and deal w/ irregular surfaces better. Even the older non sealed roller bearings worked ok for ocassional street use.

Hayden:
Your product is expensive, but judging from the images shown on this thread, quality and level of execution are top. Those spring plate/bearing assmblies are a works of art. The calipers are very well done. When possible, I'm definately buying.
Bravo WEVO!
J.P.

Those spring plates look phenomenal!!! Excuse me while I wipe up the drool! :D

I understand re stiction. But is this a theoretical benefit? Or large enough to be noticed? or signifcant?

RW brings up a good point. Most of these changes are not noticeable enough on the street to warrant a change --- but I am sure that there will plenty of testimonial otherwise.....

It really depends on your "mission"

Aside from the stiction, wouldn't the roller bearing pivot yield a more precise geometry during braking, cornering or accelerating? Unless your rubber bushings are brand new, there's no way they could be as precise as the WEVO units.
There would be a definate difference on the street.
IMHO, these babies are worth the price.

Hayden:
Is there a possibility of this technology for the front?
Regards,
J.P.

Well, let's let real-world trained butts be the judge rather than keyboard guesses. I'm getting a WEVO/Elephant setup some day - sooner than later - and I'll post my impressions.

A roller bearing kit for the front is already available, I believe that is one of the reasons that WEVO does not offer there own variation. As I have seen in the past, Hayden does not like to get into previously established markets.

That aside, the front roller bearing kit is huge improvment in handling and ride quality on both track and the street. I have riden in several 914's in both environments and the effect is directly noticable. The roller bearings eliminate the delayed response of the rubber or polyurethane bushings while the control arm is in motion over a bump. This in turn reduces that amount of work the shock and torsion bars are doing to overcome the interference of the bushings and allow them to immediately control the suspension.

Both a front and a rear roller bearing kit have been available for the 914 for some time and are sold by through
Mueller's Designwerks. The 914 and the pre-89 911's share identical from control arm designs and therefore the front roller bearing set-up is interchangable between the two. I have been anxiously waiting this kit from WEVO as I will be able to duplicate the improvments in handle on the 914's in my 911/912.

Porsche 911 (front only) (up to '89) and 914 (front and rear)(all years) Needle Bearing Suspension Components

Front Kit for 911's and 914's ($400.00 US):

Kit comes with precision centerless ground and hardened sleeves which are installed onto the shafts of the factory A-Arms. A housing made from seamless tubing is fitted with Torrington® Needle Bearings. To fully compliment the new Needle Bearings, hardened and ground washers and thrust bearings are also included to handle the thrust loads encountered while braking and cornering. Sealed from the elements with an O-ring and Silicone (not shown).

http://www.muellerdesignwerks.com/arm5.jpg

http://www.muellerdesignwerks.com/arm01.jpg

Thanks Britain:
Do you need a press to install the bearings? Does the front mounting sleeve slide over the needle bearing housing? How's the service life?
Any negative affects, such as cracking at the mounting points or cross member?
Regards,
J.P.

Not to take anything away from Hayden, he has developed an attractive product which he did show me at Autofest. I'm sure there are some customers interested in a $900+ spring plate bearing solution, just as PolyBronze appeals to a segment that wants a $295 spring plate bearing solution. And there is yet another group that will continue to buy polyurethane bushings no matter what.

Clearly different products can peacefully co-exist in the market.

However, Britain I am a bit confused by your comment above :confused: PolyBronze is a true bearing with similarly low friction, allowing the same ease of suspension motion, smooth ride, and roadholding characteristics as roller bearings.

Perhaps that was a typo and you meant to say "polyurethane bushing"? That would make sense.

Wise words from Mr. Moreland,....:)

Truer statements were never made,......:)


To Randy:

I can tell you 2 things:

1) I will never, ever install/sell another set of urethane bushings no matter how well we machine them to fit; they are nothing but long term troubles, IMHO. BTDT, FAR too many times.

2) Chuck's Poly-bronze bushings make a very noticable difference in ride quality over any urethane ones and IMHO, they are a bargain for what they do. Car control is improved due to a reduction in 'stiction' and controlled toe changes. Further, its a long-term solution.

I do like what Hayden has done and I'd suspect we'll use them in some full-on race cars for those with the experiences to appreciate them and appropriate budget.

Can't beat the Elephant solution for the money, tho.

My 2 cents,......

Steve - I am asking about the comparison of roller bearings to new rubber - not to urethane. As usual, I rebuilt something on my car just a few months before a better solution (or a book on how to do it) came out....

So, does that modify your answer?

- Randy

LOL,...not really.

The rubber bushings are vulcanized in place and have a lot of hysteresis. That makes a durable setup (given the limitations of German rubber, of course) but a lot of "jiggliness" in the ride.

I don't think that the roller bearing setup would be the best choice for street use and that multi-purpose usage is where I think the Poly-bronze solution truly shines.

The Wevo stuff will be great for race cars where they get regular service and maintenance.

Sorry about that Chuck...I corrected myself.

-Britain