Front mounted oil cooler...need line measurements

[rennch]

Hi...is there a defacto standard for oil cooler line measurements, or do I need to measure myself? The car is a 69 T with an aftermarket front cooler going into an RS front bumper.

Alternatively, if anyone has any used lines for sale with AN fittings, that would be swell.

Thanks!

mto

[911pcars]

It would be very convenient to have a standard pre-fabbed hose for your application. However, every install will be slightly different depending on the hard lines, the location of the oil cooler inlet/outlet bungs and the available routing path. Here are some suggestions.

Determine your planned hose routing paths, then install the front cooler. Make sure you have enough room to swing a fitting wrench. You might end up with one straight and one 45º AN fitting (or some combination thereof) needed to point back to the hard lines. If possible, avoid tight radius bends and 90º angle fittings due to the restriction and resultant pressure drop these create.

You can purchase a length of -12 or -16 AN hose from Summit Racing or other race outlet. A 6' length should work (with some to spare) if both inlet and outlets are on the passenger side. Install one of the fittings on one end of the hose, then temporarily install onto the cooler, then determine the path/length needed to connect to one of the hard lines. If it's a race car, consider running the lines through the trunk and fender well for crush protection. Leave enough slack to avoid straining the cooler and hose and to provide for adequate support (lock ties and/or cushioned Adel clamps), then cut the hose to length and install the appropriate hard line fitting and adapter. Repeat the same procedure for the other line. Follow the manufacturer's recommendations on assembling hose fittings and cleaning before final installation.

BTW, there's no rule that says one has to use shiny stainless braided hose. Some unbranded braided hose being sold is suspect. In fact, a high-quality, unsheathed hose is perfectly fine in this application. In addition, there are high-quality, unsheathed and lightweight hoses available.

AN fittings are pricey. Sometimes you can find some deals on new and used in eBay or on the web.

Sherwood
http://members.rennlist.org/911pcars

[rennch]

Sherwood,

Great post, thanks for the info. I'm curious though...I can't imagine that a 6' host would even make it to the back of the car...am I completely off in this? My cooler currently has two AN "male" fittings sticking out of it. I'll have to get it mounted up with the RS bumper to see how it's going to fit.

Good call on the summit racing situation...I'll have to see what I can come up with.

Thanks again.

[911pcars]

mto,
It sounds like your car has AN hose running under the rocker panel to the RF fender well. My response assumed there are factory hard lines installed.

Sherwood

[rennch]

Hi there...no I have nothing. I have to go from the oil tank to the front of the car. I tried to send you a PM because I think I found a good hose...I emailed you through your website. If you email me privately, I'll send you the link for the hose I found.

[911pcars]

Michael,
I responded to your question via email before I got here. If you want, you can repro here to maintain thread continuity.

Sherwood

[Grady Clay]

Michael,

You absolutely, positively must have a thermostat/pressure relief at the rear. Do not plumb directly from engine to cooler to sump tank You will probably blow up the cooler, run your 3.0 out of oil and end up like your 2.4. This is not a place to miss the fine points. If you don’t do it right, you are better off leaving it alone. For DEs or canyon runs, use the “Rubbermaid Solution.”

Best,
Grady

[Elombard]

I would love to see some different hose options that you guys have found. I have finally got all the parts together to do this as well (except the hose).

[rennch]

Hey Grady...can you clarify what you mean here? I don't really understand. Are you saying it's a BAD idea to run a front-mounted cooler???

[Elombard]

Hes talking about a Thermostat.

Before I found a deal on one I had toyed with idea of using a valve to recirc the oil when it was cold. Then after the car warms up stop, get out and open the valve so the oil flows though the cooler. I figured I would never even open the valve most of the time for street driving.

[88 Club Sport]

I used socketless hose and fitings from http://www.racerpartswholesale.com/aero5.htm

I aready had hard lines to the fender and then used the socketless hose to the cooler. I do not see why you could not use it for the entire application. The nice thing about it is you cut it to the size you need and add the fittings. It's held up for two DE seasons with not a sign of leakage.

[rennch]

Right...I was thinking of using aeroquip lines too. I'm attempting to source a set now. Anyone know where I might find a set of hard lines?

[911pcars]

Your options for a set of hard lines and thermostat include:

- Factory new and used
- Elephant Racing new and used (recent product so used would be rare)

Either one of the above is recommended over flex lines.

In addition, you'll need the oil lines from crankcase and oil tank to the thermostat. The hard lines begin at the thermostat and go forward.

Sherwood

[Elombard]

The BAT web site has a good manual on doing remote 911 oil coolers. They have an aftermarket T stat as well. I think they are at bat.com. Also lots of info. at Chucks website. Best way to go but expensive.

[Chuck Moreland]

Originally posted by emptyo
Hey Grady...can you clarify what you mean here? I don't really understand. Are you saying it's a BAD idea to run a front-mounted cooler???

The point was that you must use a thermostat with pressure bypass. For an example of what happens when you don't, check the recent thread on Mike Gagen's (aka Ted) awesome buildout. Cooler blew up due to high pressure when pumping cold, viscous oil on startup.

Mike has since added a tstat.

[rennch]

well...no biggie, I'll run a thermostat then. Just point me in the right direction.

[rnln]

88 Club Sport ,
how does that socketless hose and fitting works?
Just push in and.. that's it? Or there will be claims on the out side of the hose? I doubt it that hose can stay on the socket if there is no claim.
Thanks.

[greglepore]

There are some great deals on ebay at the moment on used Nascar hoses and fittings-the downside to doing it this way is that these shops generally use swaged fittings so if you need to change them you need to discard the fitting. 12 and 16 an stuff isn't cheap new.

I second the recomendation regarding the stainless stuff. If you've not worked with it before, its a pain to cut and put the fittings on. So long as the hose is relatively protected locations, the rubber stuff works great.

I sourced used 16an lightweight hose with a Nomex jacket from ebay for my project at about half of the cost of going new.

You'll also need metric to an adapters at the tank and engine-these aren't cheap either. Smart Racing and BAT have them, or you can have a local shop adapt a fitting to the existing line to match what you're using.

[88 Club Sport]

Believe it or not, the socketless hose/fittings are just press in.......a little tough to get in but no clamps are required and as I mentioned, no leaks after 2 years of DE use.

I got the idea from "cotown".....he did a similar set-up on his turbo. See here:

RSR bumper and Center cooler done! Many pictures inside

"88 Club Sport ,
how does that socketless hose and fitting works?
Just push in and.. that's it? Or there will be claims on the out side of the hose? I doubt it that hose can stay on the socket if there is no claim.
Thanks."

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by greglepore
There are some great deals on ebay at the moment on used Nascar hoses and fittings-the downside to doing it this way is that these shops generally use swaged fittings so if you need to change them you need to discard the fitting. 12 and 16 an stuff isn't cheap new.

Do you like your engine? Do not use used oil lines or coolers unless they have been flushed out, cleaned and certified. If you are going to try to save money by buying used on Ebay, then take the stuff to an aircraft shop afterwards and get it cleaned.

Many times the used stuff is being sold because an engine shelled itself. If they do not want to use the stuff why should you?

Just my 2c worth but I have known some CRASHCAR racers and know how they work.

JoeA