New cap, rotor points = no start

Christien · Christien's Garage

Today I replaced the cap, rotor and points on my 72 T and now I have no start. I don't have (nor can I find) a dwell meter, so just set the gap at .014. At first, I set the gap with the dizzy still in the engine, and the car would struggle to start, then after maybe 5 or 6 seconds of cranking, would start, run for maybe 10 seconds then die suddenly, as if I turned the key off. So I pulled the dizzy out to reset the points gap on my workbench, got it set as absolutely perfectly as I could, reinstalled it, now it won't even fire, just cranks and cranks. Plugs are new as of last fall (maybe 5000 km on them), wires are new as of earlier this season (maybe 3000 km on them). Car was starting/running fine before I changed the cap, rotor and points. Zenith carbs, no MFI.

Any thoughts?

(oh yeah, did an oil change while I was at it - that couldn't affect it, could it?)

ianc · 10-09-2006, 01:44 PM

Well, whatever you did is undoubtedly the cause. Do you still have the black wire on the coil and the green wire from the condenser (you did change the condenser didn't you?) making good contact? Points plugged into the connector on the condenser?

ianc

Christien · Christien's Garage

Err, what's the condensor? Black wire (like a plug wire) is connected, from cap ti the coil, and the points are plugged into the connector inside the distributor. Regapped to .016 (what the local shop recommended), still no firing.

dweymer · dweymer's Garage

When the dizzy is removed, it has to be placed back in EXACTLY where it was. Even one tooth difference could affect it. I just went though my entire ignition system. The timing is off now on yours. I'll assume you did nothing to note the position of the dizzy/rotor prior to removing it. Turn the engine over by hand so the z1 mark on the crank pulley lines up with the mark on the fan shroud. Look at the rotor, it should be pointing to the lead for cylinder 1. If not pull it and re-install it. Now, this can go 2 ways, it will start, or not(obviously) but it could be TDC for cyl 1, or 4. so if it does not start pull the dizzy turn the engine over another 360 degrees to line the mark up again, install the dizzy with the rotor pointing to cyl 1 lead.

Hope this makes sense.

Christien · Christien's Garage

Oh, @#$%!!!! Thanks, Donnie, I'm sure that's it. I've read that before, and you're right, I didn't mark it. I completely forgot about it. This is the first time I've had the dizzy out.

Thanks!

Mr9146 · 10-09-2006, 10:31 PM

If that is the problem, the solution is to find number one on the motor (have to take the top left valve cover off) then drop the distributor in (also at #1).

It's easy.

dimps8 · dimps8's Garage

Is it the two piece point set? I bet $10.00 Australian you've shorted the point set to the dizzy body. Check the spot where the no.1 terminal goes through the body. The metal part of the points should be well insulated.

911pcars · 10-10-2006, 01:53 PM

This is assuming you installed and adjusted the points correctly (correct gap, etc.) and the distributor is ready to go.

Do you feel lucky today? (I didn't repeat the entire Clint Eastwood quote)

You have a 50-50 chance of reinstalling the distributor correctly the first chance and 100% the second time. Ready? Here goes.

Step 1
Rotate the engine manually until the TDC notch on the pulley lines up with the crankcase split. No. 1 cylinder is now at top dead center (TDC). What you don't know is whether it's at the end of the compression stroke (ready to fire) or at the end of the exhaust stroke (ready for intake). The former position is where you want it.

Reinstall the distributor so the rotor points to the notch on the dist. housing when it fully seats (no 1 spark plug wire is directly above). That'd be about 5 o'clock. You may have to compensate when you install it because the dist. gear has a helical shape, not straight cut, so the dist. shaft and rotor rotates slightly as it meshes. Once you have the above installed, reinstall the dist. cap and try to start the car. If you're good, it'll start, then proceed to Step 3. If not, it won't start and might even backfire. Stop. Go to step 2.

Step 2
Guess what? The piston wasn't at TDC end of compression. You installed it 180 dist. degrees off, 360 engine degrees off (TDC, end of exhaust). Rotate the engine again so the pulley mark is at TDC. Where is the rotor pointing to now? Wherever it's pointing, you'll need to R&R the dist. again so it points 180º in the opposite direction from where it now sits so the rotor points to the correct cylinder ready to fire.

One of the two methods above will work in the order described.

Step 3
Follow up with a timing light to fine tune the ignition timing.

Hope this helps,
Sherwood

dweymer · dweymer's Garage

I was lucky, got tdc compression for 1 on the first try!

Christien · Christien's Garage

Vroom! Thanks a ton guys!

I set it to tdc, lined up the dizzy, put 'er in and sure enough it was 180 off. chug chug boom. Pull it out, turn the engine 360, put it back in, started up immediately. It's so gratifying to hear her start when I've been having problems. I let her warm up, set the idle then did the timing, the off for a quick test drive, and she feels great!

Thanks Donnie and Sherwood for the help - much appreciated. Damon, you owe me $10! jk a