Whale/Duck efficacy?

[sbmackie]

Hello,
Considering a tail when I repaint my SC this fall. Prefer the look of the duck, but don't mind the "early" whale's.

Opinions/facts on downforce and cooling with each? I drive autocross, DE, and occasional track days. At this point, speeds don't pass over about 90 (small track here in Albuquerque).

I will add a chin spoiler at the same time, so don't beat me up about that.

Thanks

Scott

[kenikh]

Go with what looks better: the duck. Any advantage the whale provides, you won't realize at the speeds you are talking about.

[SandyI]

From what I've seen at POC events at Willow Springs and Streets of Willow, go with the whale tale. There's a reason that Porsche did away with the duck tail after 2 years but variations on the whale tale live on up to this day.

And what the heck does "efficacy" mean?

[sbmackie]

From Mr. Webster: efficacy: power to produce effects or intended results; effectiveness.

My intended effects are looks, downforce at speeds MAYBE up to 100 MPH, and cooling, in no particular order. Would also like to minimize the weight addition. Car is 70 percenct autocross, DE, and track (in that order, 3 or 4 track weekends a year, coupla DE's, 14 or so autocrosses) and taking the main squeeze out on dates.

sbm

[island911]

Hey Kenik, What looks best is no tail. The duck looks like the tail gate of a p/u truck. and... Any advantage the duck provides, you won't realize at the speeds you are talking about.

No, seriously, the early turbo tails are the most performance for the cost of the tailed look.

[sbmackie]

What years?

[island911]

1976 /77

also known as a weissachs (sp?) tail or early Carrera tail.

[sbmackie]

And, let me guess, they are the most expensive because the are rare and light. Of course, that would be my luck.

Are there aftermarket clones that are worth a damn of either duck or early Carrera's? I know about the guy in Orlando.

Scott

[island911]

Actually, they have been knocked off and cost less than many of the others. (and fairly light)





see also Show me the original spoilers/wings for an SC

[island911]

This is the usual graphic for these threads...



Note the 3.3 turbo tails kill more lift than the early turbo tail . But the 3.3 tails look wrong (too much) on anything but a 930 body.

[onlycafe]

scott,
love your cars stance. that and the red interior make it really pop. great looking car.
if i were to choose between a duck and a tail, it would certainly be for the duck. i have a '79 targa with a tail. when i got it eight years ago i didn't like the tail very much. i learned how effective it is though. some years ago i was returning to new york from boston on the I-90 . it was raining cats and dogs, i had been cruising effortlessly at speeds well above what my father would have approved of, and the car was running like it was on rails.
after a gas stop i re-entered the interstate , sipping a cup of coffee and was doing fiftyish or so and foung myself hydroplaning and just plain sloppy tracking as i rode along. did not like it much , couldn't quite understand why only ten minutes earlier , and with an almost empty tank was i able to really cruise along with no problem, now, not. i tentatively gave some more pedal and as i crossed seventy or so was amazed to feel the car actually plant itself, i have been a firm believer since.
i also discovered another benefit of the tail...makes a perfect shelf for two large pizza boxes.
anyway, i would like to see a duck on your car.

p.s.
thanks for the great set of sevens and kumhos. i am enjoying them very much.

[dd74]

Had a duck, now have an (early) whale. Both are after market pieces. Though I've weighed neither, the whale feels much lighter than the duck.

As for the effect of either tail, you should not just consider speed, but also take into account crosswinds. My car feels much more stable in windy conditions as well as at speed with the early whale tail.

Also consider the fact that if you leave the A/X circuit and go to a race track, you very well may exceed 100 mph for sustained periods of time. The duck will be fine, the whale will be better.

[gptom]

Porsche always recomennded that a front spoiler was also needed when adding the rear spoiler. To balance F/R lift.
IIRC, the whaletail produces less drag than the duck tail for a given amount of lift
Tom

[Jack Olsen]

A side point: the ducktail was discontinued because of peculiar German pedestrian safety laws, not because it wasn't an effective design.

[Porsche_monkey]

I just wanted to compliment your vocabulary.

And while I have a whale tail, I really prefer the simpler look of a car without one. But mine will be staying because it has damaged the paint.

[Hoffmanmotors]

Originally posted by Jack Olsen
A side point: the ducktail was continued because of peculiar German pedestrian safety laws, not because it wasn't an effective design.

I remember reading something about that, they were afraid of the duck tail seriously injuring pedestrian's or cutting there heads off...LOL.

[FenderGuy]

Originally posted by Hoffmanmotors
I remember reading something about that, they were afraid of the duck tail seriously injuring pedestrian's or cutting there heads off...LOL.

Once again the myth is debunked It was in the Porsche 911 Story book by Paul Frere




Please show us more that red interior or just me , im a silver & red person

[Bill Verburg]

Originally posted by Jack Olsen
A side point: the ducktail was continued because of peculiar German pedestrian safety laws, not because it wasn't an effective design.

first came the duck
then came the all f/g whale
then came the p/u edged f/g tail

the whale is more efficient than the duck
the p/u edge was for pedestrian safety

[chrisp]

what does a 3.3 turbo tail look like? Is that the IROC tail?

[RideShoot&Drink]

How about C2 tale?...definitely heavier than duck or whale though.