Headlight wiring. Scorched?

[WolfeMacleod]

Many thanks to Scooter, who schooled me on the difficulties I had removing the trim from the H4 lights in my car.
Pried them off today...it was on there pretty good.

Unfortunately, no local place had the 80/100 watt bulbs that were in the car..

But, that's not the question.
The question is: It looks like the wiring is heat scorched...think so? Or is this somewhat normal? Should I be worried? Or should I go to the lowere 55/60 watt bulbs that are the only ones I can find locally...

(and something about additional light relay, etc...see no extra relay near light fuzes...)

Oh...and I notice a smaller buld in there too, which I'm told is for the Euro driving lights...if I plug in the single plug wrapepd in tape in the bottom pic, will it work as intended?

[Jadams1]

That looks like the stock wiring and socket for 50/55 watt bulbs. If you want to continue using 80/100 watt bulbs, you should consider rewiring with 12 ga. wire and using a heavy duty socket. I assume you already have relays?

[Wil Ferch]

Whether stock or high wattage, the "sleeve" can get scorched like that because some parts can touch the backside of the reflector. I usually wrap this section with high-temp electrical tape..pretty spendy, last time I bought a roll from an industrial outlet( scotch tape dispenser size)..it cost $17 or so.

- Wil

[WolfeMacleod]

Originally posted by Jadams1
That looks like the stock wiring and socket for 50/55 watt bulbs. If you want to continue using 80/100 watt bulbs, you should consider rewiring with 12 ga. wire and using a heavy duty socket. I assume you already have relays?

I did not find an relays after looking for them, which John Walker and someone from my other shop mentioned...
Since I don't want to go cutting up and rewiring a perfectly good harness, I'll probably just go with the lower watt bulbs. But...how much of a diference in lower light is ther really?
And what would be involved in rewiring with 12 awg wire? Any harness hacking?
Any write-ups on this?

[HarryD]

Originally posted by WolfeMacleod
I did not find an relays after looking for them, which John Walker and someone from my other shop mentioned...
Since I don't want to go cutting up and rewiring a perfectly good harness, I'll probably just go with the lower watt bulbs. But...how much of a diference in lower light is ther really?
And what would be involved in rewiring with 12 awg wire? Any harness hacking?
Any write-ups on this?

When I installed my relays, I disconnected the headlamp wires from the fuse block and attached the coils of my relays to these points. I then ran new 12 ga wires (separately) to the headlamp buckets (I drilled two holes for each side, 1 in the tub and one in the bucket)and I attached my new wires to a decent (Hella) headlamp connector.

[slodave]

Go for the relays and re-wire. You can build guitar pick-ups, you can install the relays and run some new wire. It's easy and cheap.

Just do it!

Dave

[WolfeMacleod]

Originally posted by slodave
Go for the relays and re-wire. You can build guitar pick-ups, you can install the relays and run some new wire. It's easy and cheap.

Just do it!

Dave

I make guitar pickups from scratch. I don't make wiring harnesses from scratch. It's not the difficulty that would keep me from it, it's the hacking apart my harness on an otherwise stock, pristine car.

[slodave]

Originally posted by WolfeMacleod
I make guitar pickups from scratch. I don't make wiring harnesses from scratch. It's not the difficulty that would keep me from it, it's the hacking apart my harness on an otherwise stock, pristine car.

You're not going to hack your harness. Go hack the Gibson You're good enough, strong enough and dammit, people like you! The Sucro relay kit only requires some soldering. The hardest part will be running some heavier wire to your lights. Hey, you have the board to help you. Use the spork, Wolfe.

[WolfeMacleod]

Originally posted by slodave
You're not going to hack your harness. Go hack the Gibson You're good enough, strong enough and dammit, people like you! The Sucro relay kit only requires some soldering. The hardest part will be running some heavier wire to your lights. Hey, you have the board to help you. Use the spork, Wolfe.

I had to splice the harness in my 924S when the flip up headlights stressed the wire and broke where it flexed.
I was so annoyed with having the wire spliced, that still I want to buy an entire front engine harness for the car a year later after the fact.
I spliced the wires, soldered, used liquid electrical tape, two layers of heat shrink over the solder, and adhesive heat shrink over the entire area.

So tell me about this Sucro relay kit...soldering is one of my strong points, after all...

[HarryD]

Originally posted by WolfeMacleod
I make guitar pickups from scratch. I don't make wiring harnesses from scratch. It's not the difficulty that would keep me from it, it's the hacking apart my harness on an otherwise stock, pristine car.

You do not need to touch your existing headlamp harness (except to unplug it from the headlamps, mine are still in the buckets, resting). Just disconnect the wires that go to your headlamps at the fuse block and connect these points to the relay coil (pin 86). The heavy current wires (which go from the battery, to the relay contacts, to the headlamps) are run separately. Your original factory fused circuits will now control the relay and require no changes.

This thread has much discussion on the many ways to install the relays. Headlight Relays Redux

[WolfeMacleod]

Originally posted by HarryD
You do not need to touch your existing headlamp harness (except to unplug it from the headlamps, mine are still in the buckets, resting). Just disconnect the wires that go to your headlamps at the fuse block and connect these points to the relay coil (pin 86). The heavy current wires (which go from the battery, to the relay contacts, to the headlamps) are run separately. Your original factory fused circuits will now control the relay and require no changes.

This thread has much discussion on the many ways to install the relays. Headlight Relays Redux

I'll read that, thanks. But...where do I run the new wires into the buckets?? I'm assuming the hole in the bottom is for a drain.

And while I'm on that subject...why are there TWO sets of wires coming into the bucket?

[Wil Ferch]

We're all running around in circles..all good stuff... but not "focused" answers.

1.) Whether stock wattage or not, the car benefits from a relay set up because you avoid the stock set-up ( which is fairly stupid) of running full amp current thru the dinky steering column switch. This switch then..over time...malfunctions and wants to weld itself together. Simple relay basics, you use a low draw "control" circuit to switch the high-draw headlight circuit on/off. The control citcuit will draw maybe 1/100 ( or less) of the power it originally had ....and your stalk-switch will be forever happy.

2.) Adding a relay circuit...like the Sucro kit.....is simply disconnecting some stock wires from their normal locations and running them in concert with the kit wiring. No "Hacking" at all !. Fully reversible ( but why?)

3.) You don't need to upgrade the factory "feeder" wires that run directly to the headlights if you retain stock bulbs or go as high as 100 watt. I've spoken to Marcus Sucro about such things and he even bench tested temp rises of stock wires and you're fine. No question, heavier gauge is "better", and is recommended if you push 130W or so.

- Wil

[HarryD]

Originally posted by WolfeMacleod
I'll read that, thanks. But...where do I run the new wires into the buckets?? I'm assuming the hole in the bottom is for a drain.

And while I'm on that subject...why are there TWO sets of wires coming into the bucket?

Wil is correct that the stock wire size should be ok for up to 100 W bulbs but the headlamp bases are not. You can get higher power bases from Hella (Daniel Stern Lighting offers them) but then you need to cut the stock headlamp connectors off.

If you want to run new wires, you will need to drill some new holes to get the wire from the trunk into the headlamp buckets.

[WolfeMacleod]

Originally posted by HarryD


If you want to run new wires, you will need to drill some new holes to get the wire from the trunk into the headlamp buckets.

Then that settles it.
Unless that bucket is removeable and can be replaced with an aftermarket part I can drill, Hell no.

[Wil Ferch]

I don't think you need to drill new holes.

For an 85, there are rubber grommets that feed foglight wires into the trunk (meaning, there is an access hole there) and your own photos show the rubber sleeve that surrounds the wiring and "flanges" ( cone-shaped rubber flange/sleeves) onto existing holes in the headlight bucket. Some creative routing can re-use these sources of "holes".

Just feed new wires alongside the existing wires if you need to..all pushed through the exisiting cone/flanges. Goop 'em up ( the wires) with some dish soap to help move them through. The dishsoap will dissipate later and does no harm. Don't go crazy on the amount you use.

- Wil

[RoninLB]

Wiring gets old. I'd do a voltage drop test after when using stock wiring and high watt bulbs.

I ran 130/100w Narvas for years and Dan Stern suggested Osram 85/80w, pn 64206, as a replacement. So far i used the 85/80w on one side and can't tell the difference. The Osram also looks beefer comparing it side by side to the Narva.



I use the non-diode 75amp Bosch

[BlueSideUp]

Ronin- Where did you source the heavy duty H4 connector?

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by BlueSideUp
Ronin- Where did you source the heavy duty H4 connector?

I think from Dan Stern Lighting? It's been so long ago and I'm so old.

[HarryD]

Originally posted by RoninLB
I think from Dan Stern Lighting? It's been so long ago and I'm so old.

That is the same one that I recently got from Daniel Stern as well. A very nice unit.

[Early_S_Man]

No real problem there, guys! Much ado about nothing. Overheated wires show evidence at the headlamp connector and it migrates back downward from the Fastons down the wire, and discolors the insulation a dark brown, and sometimes cracks the insulation, too! From the appearance of that headlamp wiring ... it doesn't look like your car has been driven much at night! The nylon nest for the three headlamp Fastons is still white and pristine, same as the wiring! After 22 years I would expect it to be yellowed and the Yellow and Blue wires to be turning brown at the ends.