How to add R-12

My 83SC has lost all it's R-12.I just had a new system installed last summer so I need R-12.Is this something I can do myself ?
what equiptment do I need to accomplish this.
I have some R-12, what else and how do I add it? It's starting to get hot here in Texas and I need my A/C ! I also just got laid off
so I need this done cheap. Thanks !!!

Hey Chuck, where are you in Texas. I am in Shreveport La. If you can get here I'll put it in for you.

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Robert Stoll
83 SC
83 944

Tough to get r-12 these days. you may consider using 134a

Can you add 134 A to an R-12 system? Or do I need to convert something?

I managed to "obtain" some R-12. My car has always had R-12 so I'm sticking with it, I have been told it works the best in my 83SC.

Robert,
I live in Austin. I'm planning another trip to Monroe next month but I think I have a "connection " here that will do the job for me.Thanks for the offer though.Have you gone to the rotary compressor in your 83SC ?
It sure makes a difference!

Plano25
I think you have to change out a few items.
I just had an all new system installed last summer and made the decision to stay with R-12 due to the poor performance of the Porsche A/C along with the extremely hot summers here in Austin.A loose fitting caused me to loose my charge over the winter.

You add refrigerant to the low pressure side of the system, but if you want to do it the right way, you should connect pressure gauges to the system and add only the recommended amount; no more, no less, for best efficiency. Before injecting the R12, I'd suggest you find out why the system is now empty after only one year. It might be cheaper down the line to take it into an A/C shop and have them evacuate the system and perform a leak test.

134a is not compatible with R12. If you want to make the switchover, you'll have to drain out the exisiting refrigerant lube/oil and change the hoses; not an inexpensive proposition. Maybe better off to make sure you don't have any refrig. leaks and live with the "A/C" the factory provided.

I've seen those 134aconversion kits at Pep Boys. One person I know said it works. How long? Don't know. Maybe it's worth a try?

I did the conversion on my old jeep that had lost most all of its R12 over the years... hadn't operated the system for about 4 or so years. Got the 134a conversion kit & it said pretty plainly on the box that it was compatible with any residual r12 & r12 oil. So I just added the kit contents & its worked great ever since.
I'd never try it on my good cars or Porsche, however. Would probably have the sytem totally evacuated & change out the dryer if I wanted to convert. Jeep's doing great, though, so it may be a scare tactic on the part of the local shops to keep our hands off something they like to charge $150 for.
regards,
jlex.

No Chuck, I still have the York compressor on my 83. Still works ok, just vibrates a bit. I do need to change the "O" rings at the manifold. After I removed the compressor to do the tensioner upgrade I noticed a leak on the high pressure side. If "O" rings don't do the trick I may go ahead and order Sanyo kit.

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Robert Stoll
83 SC
83 944

You Texans are so lucky to be so close to Mexico where you can still "obtain" R-12 in do it yourself cans.

Nick.

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Nick Shumaker
1982 911SC Coupe
nickshu@yahoo.com
PCA -- Rocky Mtn. Region

chuckr

My horded supply of r12 ran out a year or so ago. If you are anywhere near the TX border, you can get the r12 (installed) cheaply in Mexico. When I go, I get r12, maybe a root canal or a crown or two, some prescriptions, maybe some of those stuffed toads playing pool. Generally save enough to more than pay for the trip. The ac shops in Laredo are clustered on the outskirts of town, on the old (free) highway to Monterrey. Hard right from the bridge No. 1, follow till road curves to left, follow several miles till edge of town. Hasta La Vista.

"Hey, Senor....you want my seester or mebee some r-12?...."


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Doug
'81 SC Coupe (aka: "Blue Bomber")
Canada West Region PCA
members.home.net/zielke/911SC.htm

You cannot mix 134a with r12 period. I'm in the ac business. If you have the R12 you can charge to the low side. However if it has lost its charge in 1 year you have a major leak to repair first. R-12 in Canada is worth about $900 can for 30 lbs. so much for free trade
Kevin

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KEVIN WOOD
70 911E TARGA

The hoses (and other components) in older Porsche a/c systems will have to be replaced to use 134a. I priced the "upgrade", and the cost was staggering. It was then I decided to remove the system (all 70+ lbs) and carefully store it for the next owner. I realize if you live in a hot climate, you may have no other options.

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Doug
'81 SC Coupe (aka: "Blue Bomber")
Canada West Region PCA
members.home.net/zielke/911SC.htm

On my 944 a few years back I bought a R134A conversion kit from pep-boys and filled er up. Ac was as cold as ice, I think the conditioning oil neutralizes the R12 so incompatibility should not be a concern. I would go ahead and try the conversion, what do you have to lose?

Dante Oliverio

Ahh Larry,

I spend my days fixing Mexican dentistry. Not fun for you or me.

If only I could get them to pay in R-12 canisters!

Nick.

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Nick Shumaker
1982 911SC Coupe
nickshu@yahoo.com
PCA -- Rocky Mtn. Region

CFC-12 and 134a are not compatible! When mixed it crates a acid within your a/c system and will eat your rings, hoses, and cause major damage to your a/c not to mention the environment, and furthermore its not legal. A proper conversion requires flushing the system and replacing compressor (sometimes), fittings, oil, o-rings, and refrigerant.

So where exactly is the low side fitting on an 83 SC?

"So where exactly is the low side fitting on an 83 SC? "

The A/C system is a continuous loop circuit. High pressure in the system is created at the compressor, then to condenser, receiver/drier, expansion valve and evaporator. The low side begins just after the expansion valve and continues on the return line back to the compressor. Depending on the compressor you have, the high and low pressure valves may be on the flex or rigid lines on either side of the compressor or on the compressor housing itself (often marked H and L).

Somebody have the short answer?

Sherwood Lee
http://members.rennlist.org/911pcars

Well, I might as well jump in here along with eveyone else.

409A is an alternative to R-12 and compatable with it. If you decide to do a conversion, to 134-A, you will also need to replace your expansion valve to operate with 134-A.

The hoses do have a tendency to leak and were designed with that in mind. You can replace them with newer hoses, but it is going to cost you.

The larger hose on the compressor is the low pressure side - or if the system is working properly, it is the cooler hose.

I did a conversion on my Porsche 78 911 Targa, and picked up a sanden at the local junk yard. Disassemled it, converted to 134-A and made an adapter to bolt it to the existing support. Changed the belt and it works just fine.

Steve

409a will not work long in a semi hermetic system as it is a blended refrigerant. there is a drop in replacement available in Canada and I beleive you can get it in the U.S. as well. It is a hydro carbon refrfrigerant ie. a blend of Propane and Butane. Charging levels are more critical. It requires approx. 40% of normal charge. It is also more efficient then R12.

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KEVIN WOOD
70 911E TARGA