Targa window installation made easy! (long)

MikeBogue · 07-15-2008, 04:05 AM

I just installed my rear targa glass last night and found a way to get it to go in fairly easily, so I figured I would share with the other members on the board. The installation went ver smoothly and took about 1.5-2 hours including all of the cleaning/prep. My procedure is listed below.

Clean the glass and make sure thaat there is no debris, or other contaminants on it.
Place the seal onto the window without cleaning it. I did this, because the seal was fairly tacky as recieved and I have read how it can come off of the glass durring installation.
I then used a silicone lubricant in the channel for the trim by inserting the thin tube into the channel and spraying. I found that this works best if the end of the tube is pushed through the channel so that the tube is sliding through a section that already has the lube on it.
Insert the trim into the groove.
Trim the corner of the channel where it will seal onto the body lip. I found that on my gasket there was some flash at the corner that would have caused a problem, so I cut it to the shape of the channel with a utility knife.
Lubricate the gasket channel for the body lip using the procedure outliined above.
Lubricate a small diameter rope (I used 1/4" diameter nylon, but this rope should be synthetic to reduce friction when it is removed). I tied the end of the rope to a saw-horse and just ran it back as I sprayed the lubricant.
Insert the rope into the channel for the body lip. I found that it was helpfull to run a flat-head screwdriver in the slot ahead of the rope in order to open up the channel, because it was such a stiff lip.
I then sprayed all of the edges of the gasket that would need to slide olong the body when it was installed. My suspicion was that this was the primary source of problems with the gasket installation, because if that area had high friction it would stretch and twist the gasket as it was installed.
I then used some Duct tape between the outer edges of the gasket and the glass on the corners in order to stop them from twisting in when the window was installed.
We placed the window on the car and, starting at the corner, I pulled the rope over the targa bar while my father in-law pushed forward on the glass.
Once the lip was over the targa bar I took a flat bade screwdriver and worked the outer lip around the outside of the targa bar so that the window could be fully seated towards the front of the car.
Once we had the targa lip we started to work around the window above the rear fender. My father in-law pushed the window down and in while I pulled the rope out. The first attempt at this failed, because the targa gasket is so thick that the channel for the fender is cantilevered and bent up as I pulled the rope out. Since this attempt had officially failed I experimented on the other side and found that if the gasket was pressed down from the inside and following the rope that it would catch the lip well.

After the window was removed and the rope was reinserted this procedure worked well except for a ~1" section at the back when the rope was going past one of the semi-circular cut-outs and there was too much pressure from the ouside of the glass. With the rest of the lip in place I used a vinyl siding hook to grab the lip and pull it over the remaining section.

There was one problem with the installation and that was keeping the trim in the gasket as it was installed. We found that, as the gasket was "pulling in" over the finder lip, it changed the shape of the gasket and would pop the trim out. I was more concerned about getting the glass in than I was concerned about getting the trim in, so it was installed without the trim for the moment. I have a few new ideas about getting the trim to fit into an installed window, but I will post about that at a later time. All told it was not too difficult and I think that I could get the trim to stay in if I had another set of hands only holding the trim. If I had to do it again I do not think that I would hesitate as the procedure worked ver well and if I were to start from scratch I do not think that it would take more than 1-1.5 hours. Unfortunately I forgot my camera so I do not have any pictures of this installation, but I would be happy to answer any questions to the best of my abilities.

Mike

M.D. Holloway · 07-15-2008, 07:15 AM

Mike,
Great post! Did you take it out as well? Did you have to replace the window or due to a paint job?

I will be in CT in two weeks (Old Lyme, Niantic and Waterford). I would love to talk to you about this and maybe even see it.

MikeBogue · 07-15-2008, 07:32 AM

Thanks. I have been doing a bar metal restoration of a '73 for just over a decade, so the glass came out about 10 years ago and the car should finally be on the road in a few days. It is not perfect, but it is mine and I have done all of the work on it myself from pan replacement, rear fender replacement latch pannel replacement, and lots of miscalanious work. I am about 40 minutes from the Waterford/Old Lyme area and would be happy to get together. Send me a PM and we can work out the details.

Mike

Winter · 07-15-2008, 12:07 PM

sounds like it's been a long 10 years, but about to become very worthwhile. Do - please - post some pics of your first drive in the beast.

And congrats on seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.

---

Tom

William Miller · 07-16-2008, 05:51 AM

Mike, could you post a picture of the rear edge of your glass/seal/body above the deck lid.
I installed mine on the second attempt yesterday, but for some reason the glass is pushed down too far. I think my issue is partially what you described as the seal twisting. Did you use 1 rope or two? Where did you start and stop the cords?
Thanks!

1982911SCTarga · 07-16-2008, 06:13 AM

William, rope it in like the factory workshop manual says -- 8 inches or so at the top center first, then a similar amount at the rear center. This keeps things in balance as you continue to move along. Use one rope, but throw loops in it at the top center and bottom rear so you can double-rope your starting segments.

It's a tough job and there are no shortcuts.

Brian

MikeBogue · 07-16-2008, 10:41 AM

Bill,
I will try to post some pictures for this later tonight as I am traveling for buisness today, but I can answer a couple of your questions. I used one rope and started it at one of the corners. I then worked it over the targa bar to the other corner. After that I used both ends of the rope to work towards the middle.
It sounds like one of a couple things might have happened to your installation. There are two grooves that the glass can fit into on the gasket. I used the one towards the outside of the car. Also if the friction between the bottom of the seal and the pannel above the rear deck lid it could twist the seal and produce an odd fit. Did you lubricate the seal?
I found that this was actually not the most difficult glass installation I have done as long as I was patient. My brother in-law was restoring a '68 Cougar and we had a very difficult time with those windows. One of the problems was that we were using dishwashing liquid to lubricate the seal/rope and it kept drying out which is why I used the silicone.

MikeBogue · 07-18-2008, 03:37 AM

Here are a couple pictures of the targa window as it was installed. As I stated earlier the trim fell out as the gasket was installed, but I think that I can buy/make/modify a u-shaped channel to open up the channel that the trim fits into. If I can do this then I will be able to insert the trim into the tool channel and when the too is removed the trim will be in place. I will post again when I find out if this works.

William Miller · 07-21-2008, 09:41 AM

Just an update.
I used the factory method that Brian mentioned and it all went together very easily.
I did it on my own because no helpers were avalible. In the absence of the extra hands, I did use the strap method to help hold the window down while pulling the string. Starting the string at the top and the bottom helped keep things even. The glass is slightly down, but 1000 times better than how the paint shop left things.
Now that I've done it and know how, it is Not the most daunting thing on the car.
It is definately not the nightmare people have mentioned many times on this board.
Patience is required.

Thanks for all the help!

MikeH757 · 01-27-2021, 12:56 PM

Mike, found this old thread. Did you get the trim installed after the rear glass and seal were installed? Any tips you can share? I had the same problem, even with an extra set of hands. Went and installed the glass and seal without the trim, still took 2 tries to get everything seated. I have some ideas but wanted to know how you ended up doing it.

Thanks,
Mike

mike sampsel · mike sampsel's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeH757

Mike, found this old thread. Did you get the trim installed after the rear glass and seal were installed? Any tips you can share? I had the same problem, even with an extra set of hands. Went and installed the glass and seal without the trim, still took 2 tries to get everything seated. I have some ideas but wanted to know how you ended up doing it.

Thanks,
Mike

I think there is no way to get the trim in with the glass and seal installed in the car. Trim has to go in the seal with the glass, out of the car. on a set of saw horses. And care must be taken to get all of the trim in place in the seal. Do not listen to any glass pro tell you you can get the rest of trim in once the window is in, not going to happen. It helps to shape the trim to the metal surface shape before install into the seal on the glass.

Having said no way, we will see if Mike found this special tool. The fit is just too tight once the glass and seal are in, the trim makes the fit even tighter. I think it's easier to pull it out and start again and my paint guy who did it with two other helpers (one was me) is not interested in doing another one

We did it twice too.

MikeH757 · 01-31-2021, 11:09 AM

Mike, thanks for the feedback. What you say is pretty much what I've read in forums. When we tried installing the glass and getting it seated at the rear, the trim kept popping out. It was difficult keeping the seal on the glass and getting the trim to stay put while on the bench, but I believe it was likely not formed good enough to conform to the shape of the glass. I can get about 12" or so installed on the flat surface at the rear but can't get it around the curves. The U-channel tool mentioned may be plausible to spread and then push the trim in, so I'll look into fabricating such a tool. Failing that I'll have to remove and start all over again.

mike sampsel · mike sampsel's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeH757

Mike, thanks for the feedback. What you say is pretty much what I've read in forums. When we tried installing the glass and getting it seated at the rear, the trim kept popping out. It was difficult keeping the seal on the glass and getting the trim to stay put while on the bench, but I believe it was likely not formed good enough to conform to the shape of the glass. I can get about 12" or so installed on the flat surface at the rear but can't get it around the curves. The U-channel tool mentioned may be plausible to spread and then push the trim in, so I'll look into fabricating such a tool. Failing that I'll have to remove and start all over again.

Well maybe you will be the first to make it work with "the" (a) tool. I'd be excited to find this works. Taking the metal trim and placing it on the car, to get the shape it needs to be, (before fitted to the seal on the window) is an important overlooked step to getting the trim to stay in place in the seal on the glass.

At least the rear glass is stout and hard to break. Maybe the targa glass challenge is the reason people like the coupes

Have fun!

RDM · RDM's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike sampsel

Maybe the targa glass challenge is the reason people like the coupes

Sissies.

mike sampsel · mike sampsel's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by RDM

Sissies.

I'll have a pint+ of delicious German brewed IPA to that tonight!

RDM · RDM's Garage

I have a glass of finest Flemish Red-Brown I'll raise to you.

MikeH757 · 02-04-2021, 12:49 PM

I think the MikeBogue idea of the U channel would work in theory, however I have been unable to find any U-shaped tool that would work, nor have I made one that I could get inserted either. So, basically giving up and removing the glass and seal to start over. When I went to try and install the trim initially on the car, I noticed it was not shaped close enough, no doubt putting too much pressure against the seal and popping out when we tried to install it. A rookie mistake. With the glass and seal installed I have been able to get it shaped much closer to the needed shape, it should stay in place much better. Will use an extra set of hands to help hold it in place. With the glass and seal installed for over a week now, maybe it will have aclamated somewhat and be easier to install a 2nd time. One can only hope.

mike sampsel · mike sampsel's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeH757

I think the MikeBogue idea of the U channel would work With the glass and seal installed I have been able to get it shaped much closer to the needed shape, it should stay in place much better. One can only hope.

Mike,

I'd look closely at the trim inserted in the seal. And any place which is pulling up (even just a bit) might be adjusted some. I think pliers, with teeth carefully wrapped with gas hose and duct tape, used to slightly adjust might be time well spent. Although, sometimes the area pulling up needs the trim adjusted else where. Take you time on getting the trim the right shape to minimize it pulling away form the seal and glass. We know the seal and the glass are the right shape.

And you could set the glass on the car too and test to see if any of the trim wants to come out and then adjust some more. I think if you need extra hands to hold the trim in place it's not quite shaped correctly.

MikeH757 · 02-05-2021, 01:17 PM

Mike, thanks for the sage advice. You're right, getting the trim shaped correctly is key, something I did not do well enough before. I will try again this weekend.
The front windshield was easy, no issue with the seal or trim popping out.

MikeH757 · 02-25-2021, 01:49 PM

Success at last. Got it installed this past weekend, took 3 tries. The first 2 were mostly complete when a part of the seal on the targa hoop came off when getting the back portion pushed down and roped in. On the 3rd try used a strap to snugly hold the glass in place and finally got it all roped in and the trim stayed in place. The back center portion is slightly down, as another member mentioned in his install, but certainly not worth removing and trying to get it any better. Now I can start putting the targa hoop and rear interior back in.