Power Window Switch - Projects on Hold till I Buddy Up

[VroomGrrl]

Howdy Pelicans! I'm really enjoying getting to know my "new" 88 911. LOVE my new ride! Of course, there are all manner of little things that need attention at any given time, but one thing stands out after the past week - a fussy power window switch on the driver's side. Seems fine putting the window down, but sometimes no response from the switch when I go to put the window up. So far it has not completely failed - if I fiddle with it back & forth it eventually catches & the window goes up.

I dropped the PO an email to see if this was something new, or something he'd run across in the past with the car. He replied thusly:

Just remove the switch itself from the door panel and look to see if all the wires are pluged in. I have replaced the switch but this was long ago. Be very care full here the wires are very short and it does not take much to pull them of the plug.!!!!

Look how much confidence he has in me! "Just remove the switch..." ???Hahahaha! OK yall fear not. I am not going to "just remove the switch." I am going to hold this little project until I have found some local(s) to buddy up with.

I have a 150 yr old German violin that was my work-horse instrument for years (former career incarnation as a violinist...) and I would no sooner go taking it apart than I would my Porsche at this point. Change strings? "Maintenance" stuff? Sure. But a little knowledge is a dangerous thing and willing & enthusiastic as I am, I'm learning how easy it is to really screw things up royally, too. I'm no wrench, nor any kind of electrician...don't even play them on TV (youtube doesn't count).

This will go on the list of things to check out with my new local Pcar friends, once I have found them.

Do you think they might be hiding from me??

[mede8er]

He's right...those wires come lose...just gently pry out the switch and push the connectors in firmly...may easily solve the prob...

[KevinP73]

The window switches on those cars can be problematic. The weakest link in a very simple curcuit is indeed the switch contacts. As these cars age the window mechanisms get slow and sticky it puts undue stress on the contacts in the form of excess heat. Eventually the contacts lose conductivity and the switch fails.
If you muster the courage I'm confident you'll be able to replace the switch. A quick search here on Pelican will result in numerous threads that have a schematic posted. They really are very simple. Just be sure to have the replacement switch in hand before removing anything.

[VroomGrrl]

Originally Posted by KevinP73

The window switches on those cars can be problematic. The weakest link in a very simple curcuit is indeed the switch contacts. As these cars age the window mechanisms get slow and sticky it puts undue stress on the contacts in the form of excess heat. Eventually the contacts lose conductivity and the switch fails.
If you muster the courage I'm confident you'll be able to replace the switch. A quick search here on Pelican will result in numerous threads that have a schematic posted. They really are very simple. Just be sure to have the replacement switch in hand before removing anything.

Wish there were some HOW TO videos....

OK for a total noob...

I don't have a new switch. But if I wanted to remove the existing switch to check the connections in there, how do I get it out? Is there anything I need to disconnect first? I don't want to mangle the switch plate or the door - what tool do I use?

[slodave]

The switches come out very easily. Use something stiff to pry them out, but not sharp. Easiest to pry from the bottom. This way, if you scratch the vinyl/leather, it won't be as noticeable. The switches are held in via friction. Easy to do. Get your husband involved!

[JB36]

I used a small screwdriver, not eye glass size, but not too much bigger. Push down and pull out with screw driver between the door skin and the switch gently . Do this on the top a bottom a couple of times. Eventually, you'll be able to grab a hold of it and pull it out. Write down the wires if you have to change it out.

[slodave]

Here you go:

I used a screw driver. I'm not responsible for damage caused by using a screw driver. Use a hard plastic thingy if possible and work slowly!



Gently work the tool under the switch and pry out slowly and carefully.


Keep working at it.




At this point, you should be able to pull it out with your fingers. Again, slowly!


The wires will come out of the door a little.


If I wasn't taking pictures this would have taken all of about 3 minutes.

Hope this helps.

Dave

[JeremyD]

I used a putty knife - just get it moving and walk it out. Easy

[VroomGrrl]

Originally Posted by slodave

The switches come out very easily. Use something stiff to pry them out, but not sharp. Easiest to pry from the bottom. This way, if you scratch the vinyl/leather, it won't be as noticeable. The switches are held in via friction. Easy to do. Get your husband involved!

I just don't want to mess it up and then have NO window control until I can get it sorted. Got a road trip next weekend.

My husband has many awesome qualities and lively interests, but anything to do with cars is not on his radar. Except to get him where he's going. On a good day, I can get him to come out to the garage and hold a light or the camera He has no aptitude nor skill for fixing things. Neither do I, really, but I am interested, and I am learning.

[john walker's workshop]

notice the metal frame under the switch. don't pry on that, just the switch above it.

[VroomGrrl]

Excellent! Thanks for taking the time to do that for me! OK so I got out there and gently worked the switch out using my smallest frosting spreader (closest to a putty knife, thin but not sharp). I couldn't get it out far enough to really see what was going on in there or to mess with anything in there. Didn't want to pull it out too far.



Stuck it back in there and made sure it still worked. Which it does, as well as it did when I started - intermittently. Since posting here I've read on the PCA tech site that this very thing (won't go back up) has been a long-time prob in late 80s cars like mine.

Got this email just now from the PO:

The switch is easy! Just go buy a new one somewhere- in my notes there is a wire diagram of the wires. 20 minutes tops.

So I guess the thing to do is put in a new switch. At this point I can't put the window down without risking it not going up anyway so....gah.

[slodave]

You should have three switches. Switch (ha ha) the bad one out with one of the others.

The wires may be catching in there, but with some gentle pulling, you should be able to get them out at least as far as I did. As for a wiring diagram, take pictures .

BTW, I have a Targa and it shows. Water gets by the roof and window seals and drips down into the door, as evidenced by the rust.

[BeyGon]

This was super, I am calling Pelican tomorrow to order a switch, I have been wanting to do that too.

[VroomGrrl]

Originally Posted by slodave

You should have three switches. Switch (ha ha) the bad one out with one of the others.

The wires may be catching in there, but with some gentle pulling, you should be able to get them out at least as far as I did. As for a wiring diagram, take pictures .

BTW, I have a Targa and it shows. Water gets by the roof and window seals and drips down into the door, as evidenced by the rust.

I guess I could take the passenger side control out and switch it with mine. I know that one works fine. But alas, I am chicken! And daylight is on the wane and I don't have any lighting in my garage yet so I will leave this for now. Sure enough, I did find the owner's wiring diagram in the stuff he sent with me:



It's all Greek to me.........

[VroomGrrl]

Just after I posted the above a friend of ours dropped by. He's been working on the wiring for our elec garage door openers. I hijacked him for a little help with my window switches. I watched while he undid the driver's side, mindful of what went where (and I had the diagram if I got lost - it was right on). Then I went and undid the passenger side switch (no easy feat, as it was wrapped in years-old melted masking tape). My friend hooked the driver's side switch back up on the pass side, and I hooked the pass switch back up on the driver's side. Teamwork. And...SUCCESS!

Sorry, no photos of the actual success. But! They work! Meaning - the driver's side driver's window now works 100%, and the passenger's control switch is the fussy one, sometimes goes up, sometimes not. But the driver's side control for the passenger seat will bring it up when the pass side switch won't. So no harm no foul - good enough for now anyway.

Here's a mid-job shot of the driver's side door (click on photos to go to flickr.com where there are larger versions):





And he also finished the wiring on the overhead doors so now those are working. One day this week he'll put in my overhead fixtures for me and run a couple of sockets and I'll have overhead lighting and power for fan & tools in my garage. Yay!

Once again, I thank yall for walking me thru this stuff which I know is so basic to you, but brand new to me. I appreciate you more than I can say!!

PS You will be glad to know that while I was prying the wires off the back of the switch, my friend was standing right next to me going, "OK now that's the hot one, be careful! It's hot! ZZZZZ!" and making me jump out of my skin. Hahahaa! I know you'd have done it if you'd been here

[VroomGrrl]

Originally Posted by john walker's workshop

notice the metal frame under the switch. don't pry on that, just the switch above it.

Thanks! The pictures that were posted were exactly what I needed to see what needed prying - above the metal strip.

[Por_sha911]

Suggestions:
-Disconnect the battery when working with electrical. Saves the problem of blowing fuses or relays.
-Take pics or draw up a diagram of your wires before pulling them off the old switch. It seems like some folks have a different configuration than others.
-When replacing switches on the driver's door: Buy two and replace them both or one switch will look different than the other. Save the good one for a rainy day backup.

[VroomGrrl]

Originally Posted by Por_sha911

Suggestions:
-Disconnect the battery when working with electrical. Saves the problem of blowing fuses or relays.
-Take pics or draw up a diagram of your wires before pulling them off the old switch. It seems like some folks have a different configuration than others.
-When replacing switches on the driver's door: Buy two and replace them both or one switch will look different than the other. Save the good one for a rainy day backup.

Re: disconnect battery - I'll keep that in mind for next time. Once again I guess I've dodged the bullet....

Pics/diagram - I was fortunate to have the diagram for my switches which the previous owner made when he last worked on them. And I did take my own pics just in case. The wiring set-up was pretty easy to remember and I left them hanging in the way they came off and they stayed put so luckily this was not a problem.

When I do get a new switch, as you suggest, I'll get a couple and change them both out and then have at least one good spare.

Thanks for your suggestions!