ZDDP notice from Vavoline

[db_cooper]

Thought I would share. Comments?

http://www.valvoline.com/downloads/2008-003a.pdf

[br1dgeman]

The declining levels of ZDDP in engine oil is a genuine concern.

With the advent of roller lifters in many automobile engines, the need for the antiwear additive has declined over time. This fact, combined with the trend toward longer new car emission warranty requirements (100,000 miles in some causes, maybe longer in others) has set the ground work for the automobile industry to heavily lobby the petroleum industry to reduce the ZDDP concentration levels. What this means to many car enthusiasts is increased wear in older engines that have conventional, non-rollerized hydraulic lifters, and at any olther metal to metal contact point in an engine. Cam lobe failures are already becoming more prevalent in older marine engines and I suspect the same problem will increase in frequency with older automobile engines as well.

Lucky for us the petroleum manufacturers are responding to our needs with a product they can now charge an additional premium for... But rather than complain about the planned obsolesence this whole move has created, be aware there are other options: like the Valvoline bulletin pointed out, there are racing oils that have higher ZDDP oil concetrations - besides Valvoline, Quaker State and Joe Gibbs Racing are two brands that come to mind. The downside to racing oil is that they usually lack the additives necessary to go for extended mileage intervals. This may not be a problem in Autos that are used for recreational purposes but not as daily drivers as the car probably doesn't see more than 1000 miles between oil changes. General Motors also makes an engine oil supplement (EOS) that can be added to your oil as well and it is available at your friendly parts counter. Lastly, engine oils specifically for diesel applications still have higher ZDDP levels - at least for now. I suspect I might get flamed for suggesting the use of diesel engine oil in a gasoline engine, since it is not the correct application, but it is an option and it is one I currently use on my 911 as well as a couple domestic-brand street driven custom autos that I own.

[RWebb]

the take-home messages I get from this are:

[1] using a ZDDP additive may very well not be adequate

[2] Valvoline Synpower might be OK, but Charles will have to change his testing methodology to find out

[3] Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil is probably OK -- wonder where I can find it?

and... just buy some Brad Penn (after my stock of "old" SL type Mobile One runs out) until a cheaper, more readily available and tested alternative pops up.

[pitargue]

Redline also makes a ZDDF additive.

http://www.redlineoil.com/products_coolant.asp?subCategoryID=35

Never used it. Does anyone know if extended use of this product in our engines is a good thing?

[B D]

Originally Posted by RWebb

[3] Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil is probably OK -- wonder where I can find it?

Any auto parts store usually has it on hand and in 20w 50. I've heard from several this is a great oil for air cooled 911s and I know it has a high zinc content.

[mca]

The VR-1 Racing oil is what I use. Seems to be a favorite among the local shops too. Very easy to find.

There is also a "not street legal" version which I hear is better ... but pricey.

[Netspeed]

Originally Posted by RWebb

the take-home messages I get from this are:

[1] using a ZDDP additive may very well not be adequate

[2] Valvoline Synpower might be OK, but Charles will have to change his testing methodology to find out

[3] Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil is probably OK -- wonder where I can find it?

and... just buy some Brad Penn (after my stock of "old" SL type Mobile One runs out) until a cheaper, more readily available and tested alternative pops up.

I just got a bunch of VR1 racing from the local NAPA store.

[RWebb]

thx - I did find some at a place here -- surprising -- usually I can't find anything locally

[cnavarro]

There were some documented failures on the newest VR-1 in the 356 community - same with the CJ-4 Rotella. They may have made changes to it, but it's easier just to use something that we know works and know won't get tinkered without our knowing :-)

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by cnavarro

There were some documented failures on the newest VR-1 in the 356 community - same with the CJ-4 Rotella. They may have made changes to it, but it's easier just to use something that we know works and know won't get tinkered without our knowing :-)

and that would be....BP??

[Netspeed]

Originally Posted by cnavarro

There were some documented failures on the newest VR-1 in the 356 community - same with the CJ-4 Rotella. They may have made changes to it, but it's easier just to use something that we know works and know won't get tinkered without our knowing :-)

True....I just wish I could find a local shop that carried Brad Penn or Swepco.

On a side note....I saw a retail store in Atascadero, CA that all they sold was Amsoil. I found it surprising that a retail location could support such a narrow niche...and only one manufacturer.

[Flieger]

I found that buying and shipping a case of Brad Penn from Charles Navarro was quite reasonable- better than a certain local shop- I think $74 total for 12 quarts.

[cnavarro]

Pelican carries Swepco too - it's just as good.

[Netspeed]

Originally Posted by cnavarro

Pelican carries Swepco too - it's just as good.

No I know they do and I always try to buy from Pelican. It's just that I got those lousy AMEX gift cards as a birthday gift and no online retailer takes them.
Hence the reason I wandered into NAPA.

[911pcars]

If you're near Yucaipa (NE of Corona), RGrupper, John Mohler just announced he's a BP dealer: www.worksvintagesupply.com

The trick is find a nearby source to avoid the shipping costs.

Sherwood

[clexton1]

I order a case of Brad Penn from The Oil Warehouse and have it delivered to my doorstep for $61. Hard to beat that.

http://theoilwarehouse.com/

Paul

[911pcars]

Originally Posted by clexton1

I order a case of Brad Penn from The Oil Warehouse and have it delivered to my doorstep for $61. Hard to beat that.

http://theoilwarehouse.com/

Paul

It is if you don't mind paying 1/3 of that cost for shipping.

Sherwood

[David E. Clark]

Originally Posted by 911pcars

It is if you don't mind paying 1/3 of that cost for shipping.

Sherwood

True enough but $5.00 a quart delivered to my door definitely beats $4.59 per quart "locally", a fifty mile round trip drive to pick it up and tax. If you've seen it for less in your local market - great; but out here $5.00 per quart delivered is a great tip.

[911pcars]

Suggestion: Group buy.

Find enough folks like yourself in NC and order a pallet to amortize the shipping. Porsche owners aren't the only target audience for BP. It might be a bit of a hassle - depends on the upside.

When I was younger, I gathered up a bunch of friends to buy a truckload of HD Castrol back in the day. And that was even from a local source. Quantity orders works most of the time to reduce cost.

It remains; every penny spent amounts to an economic stimulus for someone.

Sherwood

[TRE Cup]

Pricing on BP is mainly dependent on what part of the country you are in. If you are close to Pennsylvania, it will be cheap. If you are out on the left coast it will cost.

We charge $5.25 per quart whether you buy one (or cases of it)
we have it in stock and located near Van Nuys airport

Quite a few non porsche owners come in as well, since they heard of the benefits

Sherwood is correct, buy a huge pallet of it if you are out of range of a distributor. then it won't hurt the back pocket so bad