why 5-year seat belt expiration?

[siverson]

While I'm all for making our old not-so-safe cars safe (compared to modern cars), I do not understand the 5-year expiration on aftermarket seat belts. They all have a tag with the expiration year on it, and PCA, NASA, etc do check this diligently during tech inspections - probably because it's easy. I drive my car about 3,000 miles per year, and my now 5 year old belt still look great, but to get a new expiration tag is going to cost me $600+ ($300+ per side).

Why are originally lower quality factory belts that are now now 35 years old OK (no expiration), but more modern 5-year old replacements are not?

Is there any scientific reasoning that the belts become significantly weaker after 5 years?

I suppose an expiration makes sense, but 5 years seems much too often to me. I'm happy to spend money to make our hobby safer, but I'd rather put the $600 towards a HANS device I don't have.

-Steve

[Bill Verburg]

It's stupid because the 35 year old oems are nfg anymore either.

yes, sunlight kills the web material, DuPont Nylon 6-6 or a similar product loses ~50% of its strength after 12mo daily exposure to sunlight. Just have a new web and old web in your hands at the same time it's easy to feel how stiff and dry the old web is.

[siverson]

If it's sunlight, that may explain it, because my car is driven little and always garaged. I still have my first set (now 10 years old, in a box the last 5 years) and they still feel new too.

Too bad there's not some sort of "litmus test" to actual measure the deterioration of the material. Some probably need to be replaced more often than every 5 years.

[Zeke]

In the case of helmets, technology improves over a 5 year period. I don't know how much belts can change over the same period, but they seem to go hand in hand.

Also, in race cars, the belts seem to get dirtier with oil, etc. than a passenger car belt. I've seen some nasty looking race car belts.

[Rot 911]

If old OEM seatbelts are no longer any good, how come I never hear about any of them breaking in a wreck?

[T77911S]

Originally Posted by milt

In the case of helmets, technology improves over a 5 year period. I don't know how much belts can change over the same period, but they seem to go hand in hand.

Also, in race cars, the belts seem to get dirtier with oil, etc. than a passenger car belt. I've seen some nasty looking race car belts.

not to mention race belts are subjected to more and harder impacts. one hard wreck in your car and it may be totaled, race cars are easily rebuilt and put back out on the track. not that this would actually weaken a 3inch race belt.

[Deschodt]

Yup, pet peeve of mine...

Local PCA does not like my super wide and thick racing harness that is 10 years old but has seen the sun maybe only 40 hours in its life, but they will let me run with the stock factory belts (or in my case the already twice replaced factory belts that are in the sun all day long)!

[jurhip]

The answer is easy. If you manufactured belts which went into unknown locations and unknown use/care, what timeline would you put on your belts given that if they broke prior to that you could be sued, possibly to compensate for a now dead driver. 5 yrs actually seems long. Plus, at the end of those 5 years, you were likely to get a repeat sale at the futures inflated price.

That being said, the belts are probably still good. Can you easily cut off the tag? What does PCA do about no tag? UV does deteriorate web material, but UV light in a car cab is highly filtered via the plastic in the windscreen, not to mention how often these cars sit in broad daylight.

$600 for reinspection is rediculous. How much are new belts? We regularly inspect fall protection harnesses. Look for broken lines, fraying, cuts, and suppleness/flexibility.
In the end, just save $125/yr and buy new belts. Its not a cheap sport - actually there are no cheap sports.

[Joe Bob]

What Steve is talking about is PCA DE and Time Trial rule on STREET belts that San Diego is extending to Autocross. It's total BS and since SD is the 500lb gorilla in the region, Zone 8 is backing them up.

I'm not real happy with the interpretation because it changes the dynamics up at MY event, and now I have to enforce a rule I don't agree with. I have to listen to the Beeyotching when someone drives 200 miles only to get DQ'd at tech for something that is legal on the street.

SD did that to me once, I almost nuked the place. I'll never go to an SD event again. You can probably hear SD sighing, ahhhh too bad.....

[Zeke]

300 per side is probably too much. Crow Ent. will re-do the belts using your hardware and provide you with today's date. Last I checked it was less than half of the price of new. It varies due to length, etc.

[Joe Bob]

try www.peparts.com

[pgeorgeson]

This doesn't answer your question, but I just picked up some G-Force belts that are FIA rated (so you get the 5 years) for about $150, so you could do both sides for $300.

[KTL]

Agreed with Milt. Buy a Crow camlock belt setup for $150. When it expires, $50 for new material to "reweb" the belts. That's easy to swallow and it keeps a good company in business. If you have a non-Crow manufactured belt that's expired, send it to Crow and it'll cost you $100 instead of $50.

I just saved you at least $400. How's that for good spending sense in the time of economic depression?

[rvanderpyl]

Because not enough new people start racing each year for the manufactures to do well with sales if everyone just bought a set once.

[siverson]

> not to mention race belts are subjected to more and harder impacts

Sure, I agree - one accident and they should be replaced. Same with helmets. Fortunately I've had zero accidents.


> Can you easily cut off the tag? What does PCA do about no tag?

Yes, tag is easily removed, but PCA looks for it.


> $600 for reinspection is rediculous. How much are new belts?

Sorry - $600 for new belts. This is what I have now (really like them!):

http://subesports.com/products/cat/Harness+Belts/brand/Schroth/prodID/587


> Crow Ent. will re-do the belts using your hardware and provide you with today's date.

Great tip, thanks! I'm looking into that now! $200 for a new date is more manageable. I still think it's silly, but I won't complain as much...

[KTL]

Note that Crow is going to give you new Crow camlocks and buckles. So your Schroth stuff, while it may still seem nice and useable, is not simply going to be given back to you with new belts installed. If you had Crow stuff then I think they would give you back the same hardware? Check Crow's site to confirm. Seems like a liability/promotion combination. They don't want to use other manufacturers hardware to create recertified belts.

[gchappel]

The SCCA and nascar published a bunch of tests a couple of years ago. Here is a quote from one of the Nascar sites: "The webbing used in motorsports restraints is typically made with DuPont Nylon 6-6 or a similar product. According to data derived from tests on the nylon webbing material, the strength of typical webbing can be cut in half with only one year’s exposure to outdoor weather and sunlight. After two years of this exposure, the strength of the webbing can be reduced to 20 percent of its original strength."
80% loss in 2 years!- scca requires new belts every 2 years.
I would not complain about getting 5 years out of a set of my belts.
Of course one would be long dead before breaking even one of the "weakened" belts, but they do lose strength rapidly.
Gary

[Bill Verburg]

Considering that this is what can happen to high strength reinforced steel, why risk it???

[Cattler]

I'm guessing this also has something to do with lawsuits. I'll bet 5 years was the longest the seat belt industry could certify without too much exposure to liability should the replacement belts fail.

[T77911S]

so what is the actual rule? for PCA de's or autoX, are the factory belts legal and 5 yr old race belts are not. i dont want to get PO'd at the TI because i got DQ'd at a DE or AX
is this the same for SCCA?